Freezing film, no frost or static freezer?

erian · Jun 9, 2018

I am wondering what would be the best option to freeze film.

Should it be static freezer or no frost freezer? I am only considering the side loading freezers.

Static freezers are considerably more affordable but the ice can build up. This has to be defrosted, needing the film to be taken out. In this light the no frost freezer makes much more sense.

What are your opinions? How do you keep your film frozen?

Sirius Glass · Jun 9, 2018

If the factory seals have not been broken I freeze film if the package has been opened, I put it in a ZipLok bag. Either way the package or bag are not opened until the film has warmed up. In over ten years I have never had an ice crystal problems.

Alan9940 · Jun 10, 2018

I've frozen film in freezers that require defrosting over nearly 40 years and never had any issues. Like Sirius Glass, I keep the film in ziplock bags and let it warm to room temp before opening. Many will say that it shouldn't be re-frozen (speaking sheet film here) after opening, but I've done just that for many, many years without a single problem.

mike c · Jun 10, 2018

I think the OP is talking about freezers that self defrost and others that do not have a defrost option. My understanding is the self defrosting fridges have a heating element to melt the ice off the walls , if this causes the film to defrost that is not good. Frost will not build up much if the freezer is kept closed.

AgX · Jun 10, 2018

I would consider the food in the freezer instead. It is most of it that should not be defrosted intermittantly.

I defrost the freezer when it is freezing outside or at least near freezing. That makes storing the food during defreezing much more simple.

sissysphoto · Jun 10, 2018

If I had a deep freeze top loader I would keep meat for nearly a year. If I had a front loader self defrosting model, I wouldn't keep meat 2 weeks and eat it. Try putting hamburger in a frontloader and keeping it a year. It wouldn't be fit for the buzzards.Of course film is not meat. But just imagine the water damage. Front loaders have a heating element to melt the frost. It can get like a sauna in there. Deep freeze in a top loader. If you wait for a cold day in January to defrost it, it would stop time itself. If I had a top loading deep freezer I'd fill it up with 100 years worth of film and sleep like a baby every night of it.

Alan Edward Klein · Jun 10, 2018

Would it be better to keep it in a refrigerator at a constant 36 degree F rather than a front loading no-frost freezer at 6 degree F. ?

Alan9940 · Jun 10, 2018

Alan Edward Klein said:
Would it be better to keep it in a refrigerator at a constant 36 degree F rather than a front loading no-frost freezer at 6 degree F. ?

I wouldn’t say better, but in the refrigerator is fine, too. I’ve never had a self-defrosting freezer, but I have two fairly large top loaders that are of the “frosts up” type. One is all food; the other is about half full of film and paper along with whatever food we can fit into the space left. When it’s time to defrost, we remove the contents and use a hair dryer along with a plastic spatula to help remove the frost as it melts. The whole process takes less than 10 mins; no food or photo stuff has ever even come close to defrosting, and I live in the desert!

GRHazelton · Jun 10, 2018

mike c said:
I think the OP is talking about freezers that self defrost and others that do not have a defrost option. My understanding is the self defrosting fridges have a heating element to melt the ice off the walls , if this causes the film to defrost that is not good. Frost will not build up much if the freezer is kept closed.

Ummm.... Not quite the way things work. "Static" freezers or refrigerators use exposed evaporator coils, within the cooled space, which of course are well below freezing. Thus moisture condenses on them and freezes. Self-defrost units by contrast circulate air over the evaporator coils or plates and then into the cooled space. When the coils or plates freeze up either the coolant flow is reversed, as is done with a heat pump, or a tiny heater defrosts the coils or plates. The resultant water drains to a tray where it evaporates. Since the evaporator coil or plate is not directly in the cooled space the temperature change in your film or beef filet is minor.

removed account4 · Jun 10, 2018

i don't freeze or refrigerate my film or paper,
it is kept on a shelf and the temperature does not
vary much ... not super hot, not super cold just ambient room ...
none of the paper or film is foggy, and most of my film was not
purchased new ( if it was at all ) after 2004
if you have a root cellar, wine cellar or basement you might
consider putting your film in there instead of a freezer or frige

i don't have or believe in a densitometry or sensitometry and rely on my eyes and
photographic experience instead of micro measurements, i have never had a problem
and personally think a lot of the deep freeze fridge stuff is a bit over the top.
others have had similar experiences ... i figure extremes and humidity are not good...
there people who go through great lengths to freeze &c their film
even buy freezers specifically for this sort of thing and get "cranky" when
they hear someone like me say it really hasn't made much of a difference...
the thing to think about is what you want to do and if in the end it is worth the effort
time, expense and to see if it really mattered that much.
you might do a "control" some film in a fridge/freezer and some just "somewhere else" you can
store it ... after a year or 2 or 3 or 5 see if it made a huge difference and go from there.
( i've used tmz3200 that was in a dresser drawer for 10+ years, never cold, never frozen never had trouble )

good luck with your storage situation

Old-N-Feeble · Jun 10, 2018

If I was that concerned about it, I would use a frost-free freezer. The film packs would be individually vacuum sealed and frozen, then closely packed within insulated boxes of reasonable size, which are then placed within the freezer. No matter how often the freezer door is opened, the temperature within the closed insulated containers will very practically none and humid air can only reach the film packs if an insulated box is opened. Keep the boxes away from the walls and raised off the base. Insulated boxes used to ship frozen meats and such would be perfect for this because they're squared and uniformly sized for compact stacking. I don't have enough film to be that concerned about it though.

mike c · Jun 10, 2018

GRHazelton said:
Ummm.... Not quite the way things work. "Static" freezers or refrigerators use exposed evaporator coils, within the cooled space, which of course are well below freezing. Thus moisture condenses on them and freezes. Self-defrost units by contrast circulate air over the evaporator coils or plates and then into the cooled space. When the coils or plates freeze up either the coolant flow is reversed, as is done with a heat pump, or a tiny heater defrosts the coils or plates. The resultant water drains to a tray where it evaporates. Since the evaporator coil or plate is not directly in the cooled space the temperature change in your film or beef filet is minor.

Thanks GR, I'm not familiar with the defrost cycle, but was told that there was a tempt drop in a freezer during defrost that could affect the contents.

Agulliver · Jun 11, 2018

I've used both types and they both seem to work for freezing film. If one does need to maintain the freezer (defrost it, replace a part, replace the freezer) then it's perfectly safe to keep the film in the fridge or even to defrost it and refreeze. I regularly defrost and refreeze film when I *think* I might use it and end up not doing so.

I currently have a small front loading conventional freezer sharing film, meat and left over spaghetti sauce etc. It needs defrosting about once every two years, as long as the spousal unit doesn't accidentally leave the door ajar.

guangong · Jun 11, 2018

I use a top loader. Filled mostly with 16mm cine film I bought when could buy at discount. Just put boxes as shipped by Kodak iinto freezer (savings more than paid for freezer). Also some respolled 620 , Minox and Minolta 16 wrapped in aluminum foil as well as my large format film. My basement temperature is almost constant throughout the year and since my cache of favorite Agfa B/W films for still photography have been long gone, most currently used films just sit on a shelf until used.
I don’t understand the advantage of a front loading freezer.

Agulliver · Jun 11, 2018

guangong said:
I don’t understand the advantage of a front loading freezer.

Space. Many parts of the world, a basement is an unimaginable luxury. Almost as rare is a utility room, or a kitchen where one can afford to have something taking that much floor space. Also, rummaging around stooped over isn't much fun. But if I had a basement or a garage adjacent to my home (mine is down the road)....I'd consider one. The basement will never happen. The electrified garage will....when my mother dies and leaves her house to me.

Sirius Glass · Jun 11, 2018

mike c said:
Thanks GR, I'm not familiar with the defrost cycle, but was told that there was a tempt drop in a freezer during defrost that could affect the contents.

If that was the case, no self defrosting freezers would be built of sold. I never has a problem with food nor film in self defrosting refrigerators and self defrosting freezers.

MattKing · Jun 11, 2018

guangong said:
I don’t understand the advantage of a front loading freezer.

It is much easier to forget things at the bottom of a top-loading freezer than it is to forget something at the back of an upright freezer.

Poisson Du Jour · Jun 11, 2018

Frost-free (dry) freezer.

Sirius Glass · Jun 12, 2018

guangong said:
I don’t understand the advantage of a front loading freezer.

More efficient, more reliable and easier to use since one only bends over if they want something in the freezer and everything in the refrigerator as within easy reach. If those do not matter to you, then it will not matter.

Slixtiesix · Jun 12, 2018

If you use the freezer for film only, I doubt that much ice will build up. This only happens if you use the freezer for food which has a lot of humidity in it and if you open and close it very often.

Nightfly · Jun 12, 2018

If using a self defrosting freezer, keep bundled film away from interior walls. All my films are bagged and caged to the center of the freezer with plenty of air gap top, bottom, and side to side. Interior walls may house defrost elements that gently heat the freezer liner to eliminate frost. I would not want that heating and cooling near the film itself.

Old-N-Feeble · Jun 12, 2018

Nightfly said:
If using a self defrosting freezer, keep bundled film away from interior walls. All my films are bagged and caged to the center of the freezer with plenty of air gap top, bottom, and side to side. Interior walls may house defrost elements that gently heat the freezer liner to eliminate frost. I would not want that heating and cooling near the film itself.

Yes, and it's even better if you keep the film in a closed insulated box inside the freezer. See post #11

markjwyatt · Jun 12, 2018

jnanian said:
...i don't have or believe in a densitometry or sensitometry and rely on my eyes and
photographic experience instead of micro measurements, ...

I'm glad the folks who formulate film do not have your beliefs! I imagine that was true 150 years ago. In any case you probably have a good eye.

Trask · Jun 12, 2018

AgX said:
I would consider the food in the freezer instead. It is most of it that should not be defrosted intermittantly.

I defrost the freezer when it is freezing outside or at least near freezing. That makes storing the food during defreezing much more simple.

+1
I defrost my freezer in winter, after having put all the frozen film in a couple of boxes that I put out on the back deck on a freezing day. No problems at all.

BradS · Jun 13, 2018

I don't freeze film - never, ever. Never have, never will.
I won't even buy film that has been stored in the freezer (I made that mistake once).
I do keep some film in the fridge.

Freezing film, no frost or static freezer?

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