Fomapan 200 didn't develop - any ideas why?

walliswizard · Apr 11, 2016

Hi all

I've just shot and developed my first roll of Fomapan 200. I ran it through my normal process:

Washed for 30 seconds in tap water
D76 1:1 20 deg C for 8 mins 30 secs (internet suggested 8-9 mins)
Ilford Stop 30 secs
Ilford Fix 3 mins
Wash for 5 mins.

Film has come out clear. Just a hint of one or two photos on it, but otherwise it's clean and transparent all the way down.

What did I do wrong????

Michael L. · Apr 11, 2016

Except for the 5 minute wash which is insufficient unless you use hypo clearing agent (and even if you do), your process seems allright. Was your D-76 fresh?
Offhand I'd say the fault must lie in the exposure. What camera did you use?

walliswizard · Apr 11, 2016

Leica M5. If the exposure was seriously over-exposing (which I doubt), surely the images would still be there on the film? I'd have to have gone some to overexpose to the point where the film is almost totally transparent throughout.

I developed two films with the same D76 last night (same batch, fresh) and those films (Ilford HP5+) are fine. One of those was shot on the Leica too.

I wonder if it is a faulty film then?

MattKing · Apr 11, 2016

walliswizard said:
Leica M5. If the exposure was seriously over-exposing (which I doubt), surely the images would still be there on the film? I'd have to have gone some to overexpose to the point where the film is almost totally transparent throughout.

I developed two films with the same D76 last night (same batch, fresh) and those films (Ilford HP5+) are fine. One of those was shot on the Leica too.

I wonder if it is a faulty film then?

I think you mean under-exposing.

Do you use a lens cap? Or an IR or 10 stop ND filter, by chance?

JW PHOTO · Apr 11, 2016

Any edge markings and if so, what are the density of the markings/numbers?

walliswizard · Apr 11, 2016

Lens hood was on (lens cap was off!) - I use a Voigtlander 50 1.5 ASPH. The film itself is totally clear. Just two little images that are sort of there but the rest is gone.

I dunno, I'm not Henri C-B, but I'm not THAT bad (honest :O)). Metering was done in-camera, it was a fairly average day (not too bright), nothing I've done differently before, it's just the film that was different. And I did change the ISO setting on the camera to 200 - it's still set to that now (that was the last film I shot through it).

walliswizard · Apr 11, 2016

On a separate note, I HAVE just ordered some Ilford Wash Aid (can't seem to get Perma Wash over here in the UK?). Been meaning to get some. I've developed about 20 films so far, maybe a few more. So this process IS still a learning curve but I dunno, every other film I've shot, not a problem. Not like this anyway.

I don't want to give up on Fomapan, just can't see what may have caused this issue. Very strange....

Ricardo Miranda · Apr 11, 2016

walliswizard said:
Washed for 30 seconds in tap water

The datasheet doesn't mention pre-washing: http://foma-cz.cs4.cstech.cz/en/fomapan-200
I wouldn't have developed it in D-76. Next time, I'll suggest you use Fomadon Excel, P or R09.
Or Ilford equivalents such as Ilford DD-X.
With any of the Foma films you don't need a stop bath. Two changes of water is all you need.
Even with fresh rapid fixer, I would fix Fomadon 200 for at least 5-6 minutes.
F200 is a mixed technology film and requires longer fixing.
Also longer washing times are required.
With a rapid fixer based in ammonium you don't need a hypo clear.

Unless you used bulk roll, there should be edge markings.
A picture of a negative strip would clarify the matter.

darkosaric · Apr 11, 2016

walliswizard said:
The film itself is totally clear

Developer went bad, if you don't see the numbers - then it is not the camera, it is developer. Could be that you used the fixer first, then developer (and yes - this happens even if you are sure that you did not do it ).

MattKing · Apr 11, 2016

Ricardo Miranda said:
Unless you used bulk roll, there should be edge markings.
A picture of a negative strip would clarify the matter.

+1
Any chance that the film didn't actually catch with the take-up - i.e. didn't go through the camera?

What prompted you to rewind it at the end - the feeling that it had reached the end, or just the exposure number?

walliswizard · Apr 11, 2016

When you say edge marks, do you mean the small numbers along the film? They are there. They look, well, like small black numbers

Developer can't be bad (surely?). If it was bad, it would have destroyed the Ilford I processed in it last night.

Weird stuff happens to me

walliswizard · Apr 11, 2016

If I had somewhere to upload this pic too I would...

walliswizard · Apr 11, 2016

darkosaric · Apr 11, 2016

walliswizard said:
When you say edge marks, do you mean the small numbers along the film? They are there. They look, well, like small black numbers

Yes - those are the markings, if you see the numbers - then developer is good. That means developing process was ok. Then it is the camera: film was not exposed (did not run through the camera), or shutter was bad or something else...

walliswizard · Apr 11, 2016

Well, dunno, perhaps I'll never know.

Bit annoying losing photos, but on to the next film and try again I guess! (

Cheers all....

jvo · Apr 11, 2016

darkosaric said:
Yes - those are the markings, if you see the numbers - then developer is good. That means developing process was ok. Then it is the camera: film was not exposed (did not run through the camera), or shutter was bad or something else...

what he said.... darko

jvo

p.s. don't worry, you're just getting all your mistakes done early, so that they'll never occur again.

me, the first time i got a blank roll was 2 years ago, after 30 years of experience. i was busy talking with friend in the darkroom and completely omitted the developer!!!! doh!

MattKing · Apr 11, 2016

Do you recognize the detail in the faint images? If so, where in your shooting day did those subjects occur (if at all)?

If I read the numbers correctly, they are near the end of the roll. Does that make sense?

walliswizard · Apr 11, 2016

HAHAHA!

Meh, the "Developer" step is overrated anyway!

walliswizard · Apr 11, 2016

MattKing said:
Do you recognize the detail in the faint images? If so, where in your shooting day did those subjects occur (if at all)?

If I read the numbers correctly, they are near the end of the roll. Does that make sense?

It does.

They are about right in the position in the film. If the film wasn't winding on, surely the photos would have been all at one end. Shutter not working? Possibly but unlikely I think? (Leica, cloth shutter, seems to work!).

MattKing · Apr 11, 2016

Something that caused the exposure to be much less than necessary. Filters and lens caps are the most common culprits.

walliswizard · Apr 11, 2016

Found the problem.

Faulty shutter. Just sitting here trying to work out if the shutters were even accurate - even BULB mode I couldn't see the shutter opening. Then it jammed

FORTUNATELY.... this Leica has warranty. Bought it from a dealer. So it's going back. Again....

Ricardo Miranda · Apr 11, 2016

Glad you found it.
With the edge markings showing, then the culprit had to be at the shooting stage.

pentaxuser · Apr 11, 2016

I don't want to appear to be a "dismal Jimmy" here but I'd want to check the camera before trying again. At what frame numbers do the partly processed negs appear? If the wind-on mechanism isn't working then all the pictures should be on top of each other at the beginning which isn't the case as you have a part neg at about frame 35.

Further information may shed more light on the cause but it looks like an intermittent fault with a shutter or is it possible that the lens cap was left in place for the blanks

I don't own what I think is a rangefinder in your case but on a rangefinder the viewfinder gives no clue about a lens cap unlike a SLR.

Frankly if you have checked the shutter and it works then you seem to have ruled out all the likely causes I can think of except the lens cap. Did you shoot the film on several occasions? In such a case you might forget to remove the cap then on the next occasion take it off, thinking that you removed it on the other occasions. This still doesn't explain why it is only part of the frame that seems to be processed

I am flummoxed

pentaxuser

darkosaric · Apr 11, 2016

Too bad about Leica, good that it has warranty. I had luck with my Leicas - but as every old camera: sometimes you are lucky, sometimes not. Save for a new MP , then it will last lifetime without a problem .

RalphLambrecht · Apr 12, 2016

walliswizard said:
Hi all

I've just shot and developed my first roll of Fomapan 200. I ran it through my normal process:

Washed for 30 seconds in tap water
D76 1:1 20 deg C for 8 mins 30 secs (internet suggested 8-9 mins)
Ilford Stop 30 secs
Ilford Fix 3 mins
Wash for 5 mins.

Film has come out clear. Just a hint of one or two photos on it, but otherwise it's clean and transparent all the way down.

What did I do wrong????

any chanceyou used the fixer before the developer

Fomapan 200 didn't develop - any ideas why?

walliswizard

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Fomapan 200 didn't develop - any ideas why?

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