Fomapan 100 4x5 sheets damaged: what did I do wrong ?

[thibsie]

Hi

I'm testing Fomapan 100 right now and got problems.
Before I used, HP5, Tmax100, FP4 and never got a problem.
Now the problem or should I say problems:

1/ scratches/blobs as if part of the emulsion was going away. More often near the sides of the holder but not only.
2/ traces of my fingers on the developed negative, probably when I unloaded the film.

In both cases I often feared I'd get that but never did until using Fomapan.
Otherwise I like the results (shot @EI 50, dev in Rodinal 1:50) but I'm really annoyed by this.

Also, I two tanks at home: one was a Jobo, the other one my beloved Combiplan (so much easier to load).
I have more problems on the negs out of the Combiplan. In the end of the dev, my negs often have moved when I use the Combiplan, maybe they have been damaged in this way and not in the Jobo (negs being inserted the other way around).

The other two tanks I did were at school, using Jobo tanks but... loaded in a real darkroom which I do not have at home and need to use the changing bag. That may be the culprit?

Anyway, I wonder if the lower price of the fomapan is that interesting if I ruin most of my shots...

 

[Ian Grant]

Fomapan 100 is a slightly softer emulsion compared to the others you've used. I use it in 120 and 5x4 with no issues but you do need to take extra care. On top of that you are using Rodinal which has a tendency to soften some emulsions (more than other developers) because it contains Potassium Hydroxide.

With careful temperature control throughout the process +/- 1°C you shouldn't have a problem.

Ian

 

[thibsie]

Thank for your input Ian.
I wouldn't have thought about choice of developer having an influence on this.

I'll try something else ASAP. I think I have some Ilfosol somewhere.

 

[Ian Grant]

Thank for your input Ian.
I wouldn't have thought about choice of developer having an influence on this.

I'll try something else ASAP. I think I have some Ilfosol somewhere.

I use Pyrocat HD which happens to have a hardening/tanning effect on the film.

When I used Rodinal (for about 20 years) I regularly processed EFKE (Adox) PL25 sheet film, EKE films have far less hardening than other manufacturers inc Foma, and I had no problems but Id been using EFKE films since the mid 70's so was aware of the possible issues and took extra care.

Ian

 

[Xmas]

I too am overcautious like Ian
no presoak
plain water stop
all temps same to better than 1C between changes including wash and hypo clear
I rate formapan at 160 ISO in microphen
Not had any problems attributable to Forma yet.
I have used Rodinal but again as Ian suggests it is high pH and prone to soften 125 ISO

 

[thibsie]

Mmmm No presoak (I almost always do) and water stop.
Those may be of influence too.

Maybe I sratched the negs myself in the damn changing bag.
I should get a changing tent.

Thank Xmas.

 

[Ian Grant]

Most manufacturers don't recommend a pre-soak, you could use a hardening fixer.

Ian

 

[Xmas]

I do get edge damage on 120 and 35 mm from tank spirals sometimes but that will be from loading as I spring film out when final washed.

But that tends to occur regular with soft films Forma only ocassionally Kodak Ilford Agfa blue moon

 

[Roger Cole]

Most manufacturers don't recommend a pre-soak, you could use a hardening fixer.

Ian

But Jobo does for rotary.

I've not used the 100 but I've run a fair amount of Fomapan 400 in my Jobo with a pre-soak and an acid stop (hadn't heard not to use it until later) and never had a problem. I HAVE scratched Fomapan 100 in the wash, but that was with my thermometer in a moment of carelessness. It is softer than most, but not really difficult to handle.

 

[Xmas]

your Jobo tempers the solutions that would help?

Your stop needs to be one shot discard dilution for any film not prehardened if you feel you must use acid, but plain faucet water is way cheaper/convenient tempered to better than 1C and lower risk.

It is not visible damage that is most worrying but mild crazy paving - reticulation - on a 20x16.

I use a lot of soft film so whole process is paranoid.

 

[jp498]

It's possible the fomapan 100 came that way. I had 8x10 film that was scratched from the factory. I do like some foma paper though.

I prefer the consistency of ilford and kodak film. Ilford is not much more.

 

[gone]

Had the same problems that jp-498 had. Kodak rapid fixer w/ the hardener helped on the soft emulsion, but generally I have gone back to Kodak as I never have QC controls. Ever. I do like HP5, but it's more of a TRi-X replacement in my shooting.

 

[Roger Cole]

your Jobo tempers the solutions that would help?

Your stop needs to be one shot discard dilution for any film not prehardened if you feel you must use acid, but plain faucet water is way cheaper/convenient tempered to better than 1C and lower risk.

It is not visible damage that is most worrying but mild crazy paving - reticulation - on a 20x16.

I use a lot of soft film so whole process is paranoid.

Yes it does so all solutions are the same temperature within a pretty tight range.

I don't feel I have to use acid just always had and hadn't heard different about Foma until recently. I plan to change to plain water.


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[Rafal Lukawiecki]

I have more problems on the negs out of the Combiplan. In the end of the dev, my negs often have moved when I use the Combiplan, maybe they have been damaged in this way and not in the Jobo (negs being inserted the other way around).

I have been using Combiplan for over a decade, perhaps I can help you with this issue. When you say that "negs often have moved" do you mean that when you open the tank you see that the negatives have slipped out of the grooves and are stuck to each other? If that is the case, could you, please, check if you still have any thin BLUE washers installed? You could find them between the orange crossbar and the clear grooved holder sides. They should NOT be used because they make the spacing of the tank too wide for 4x5 film, and they were originally designed to be used with plates, glass, but not film. Also, make sure that the grooved holders are inserted with the bowed (bendy) sides towards the middle, and the straight sides towards the outside. In other word, your negatives should bend into an arc when you insert them. The straight sides were designed for plates, glass etc. Finally, when you attach the orange retaining clip, make sure not too apply too much pressure—it needs to be firmly positioned, not too loose, but if it is pressing too hard on the negatives, they can slip when they get wet.

I very, very rarely have a slipped sheet, and I agitate quite vigorously while using Combiplan, but it took me a good bit of experience to find out about the above "gotchas"