Fomabrom 123 is dead, long live Fomabrom 113 & Fomatone 133

Lachlan Young · Aug 21, 2015

Was looking for some more Fomabrom 123 last night, discovered that its data sheet had gone from Foma's website & was out of stock at Fotoimpex too. Contacted Foma directly & received this email from Jiri Chrtek, the relevant bits which are excerpted below:

"Let us confirm that the remaining stock of the paper FOMABROM VAR.IV 123 was discontinued because of too high fog. This paper will not be supplied in the future.

Instead of this paper we recommend to you the following related papers: FOMATONE MG Classic 133 (velvet, warm tone) or FOMABROM 113 N (Normal grade, velvet, neutral tone). More details you can find in the attached technical sheets."

This echoes what I've noticed in the last few days when I was printing on the paper as well.

I'm guessing that the principle market for this paper was in the lith world, & there was not enough demand to make it worth solving the problem.

Hope this is helpful to anyone who works with this paper.

miha · Aug 21, 2015

Thanks for the update. 123 was very nice, especially for portraits. I was told it was almost identical to one Agfa's papers of the past (118?). So no Fomabrom variant in velvet then?

Mike Crawford · Aug 21, 2015

Really bad news as is one of the best current papers around for lith, (in my opinion), and the other Variant surfaces don't work in the same way. Was just teaching a workshop earlier this week using it. Am rather fed up now.
Here's a 123 lith for you Miha!

miha · Aug 21, 2015

Hi Mike, thanks. I see you did mange to visit Ljubljana after all. I hope you enjoyed your stay here.

Lachlan Young · Aug 21, 2015

miha said:
Thanks for the update. 123 was very nice, especially for portraits. I was told it was almost identical to one Agfa's papers of the past (118?). So no Fomabrom variant in velvet then?

118 was the number I recall too - though if any pictures of Portriga 118 are anything to go by, 133 might be closer in terms of base colour & emulsion. I've been offered some samples of 113 & 133 & will let you know.

Trond · Aug 21, 2015

That is really disappointing, as it is a lovely paper.

And I don't understand their reason for discontinuing it. Are they saying that they were selling too little of this paper?

Trond

Lachlan Young · Aug 21, 2015

Trond said:
That is really disappointing, as it is a lovely paper.

And I don't understand their reason for discontinuing it. Are they saying that they were selling too little of this paper?

Trond

from the looks of things it's a technical/ production problem - taking a guess, Fomabrom variant IV is a different emulsion from Variant III & because it was being made on only one substrate, it may not have been economically viable to create an identical replacement.

Trond · Aug 21, 2015

Lachlan Young said:
from the looks of things it's a technical/ production problem - taking a guess, Fomabrom variant IV is a different emulsion from Variant III & because it was being made on only one substrate, it may not have been economically viable to create an identical replacement.

Yes, a production problem may very well be the cause. But the choice of words: "remaining stock" suggests that the paper went bad because it has been in storage for too long. Whatever the cause, the discontinuance is inconvenient and a little annoying...

Trond

Mike Crawford · Aug 21, 2015

Trond said:
Yes, a production problem may very well be the cause. But the choice of words: "remaining stock" suggests that the paper went bad because it has been in storage for too long. Whatever the cause, the discontinuance is inconvenient and a little annoying...

Trond

Even if it does have base fog, is fine for lith so would be a shame if they destroyed the 'remaining stock.' Am working on a project just now with outdated papers and some very old materials impossible to print with using conventional developers, (due to fogging) work remarkably well in lith with clean white borders and highlights. Think Foma have missed a trick not to market it exclusively as a premier lith paper!

Mike Crawford · Aug 21, 2015

miha said:
Hi Mike, thanks. I see you did mange to visit Ljubljana after all. I hope you enjoyed your stay here.

Impossible not to!

winger · Aug 21, 2015

AAACK! That's the only paper I've gotten good lith results with. I'm finally back in the house with the darkroom and was hoping to start up again as soon as school starts.

Lachlan Young · Aug 22, 2015

Mike Crawford said:
Even if it does have base fog, is fine for lith so would be a shame if they destroyed the 'remaining stock.' Am working on a project just now with outdated papers and some very old materials impossible to print with using conventional developers, (due to fogging) work remarkably well in lith with clean white borders and highlights. Think Foma have missed a trick not to market it exclusively as a premier lith paper!

You could contact Foma & see if they'd sell you the remaining stock...

Mike Crawford · Aug 22, 2015

Lachlan Young said:
You could contact Foma & see if they'd sell you the remaining stock...

Lachlan, that is quite a good idea. If any of the paper is still available of course. Will be terrible if they've just binned a whole load of it.

Trond · Aug 25, 2015

Fomafoto still has some: http://fomafoto.com/index.php/vm/b-w-photopaper/fomabrom/fomabrom-vi-123

Trond

TheToadMen · Oct 6, 2015

Fomabrom Var.IV. 123 is suitable for Bromoil and Lith printing, but indeed discontinued. From the recent newsletter from Tim Rudman: "Foma has recently gone to great lengths to improve its warm tone paper emulsions in terms of lith printing (I have published the all-important batch numbers in previous newsletters), but now they have announced the discontinuation of one product - Fomabrom Var.IV. 123, which Foma report was unsuitable for conventional printing, being mostly used for Bromoil - for which they now suggest Fomabrom N 115 and Fomatone MG 133 as alternatives." (See also: http://www.timrudman.com).

Production has stopped, but there is still some stock around. On the website of www.fotoimpex.de: "We purchased the remaining stock of this discontinued paper to ensure availability for lith (MLD) process and the bromoil process users."

I ordered 4 packs of different sizes to stock up for future Bromoil printing:
- 30x40 / 50 Sheets
- 24x30 / 50 Sheets
- 18x24 / 50 Sheets
- 13x18 / 25 Sheets

Fomabrom 123 is dead, long live Fomabrom 113 & Fomatone 133

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