Foma 100 "white dots" defective batch. Foma Bohemia response.

[Вormental_old]

This has been covered before, but I think it's worth posting Fomapan response into a separate thread for easier searching for other users:

------------ Fomapan Response --------------

Keep you informed that our Quality dept. has confirmed that the described white dots are residues of not decolorized anti-halo layer used by our film FOMAPAN 100 – 120 size. Considering your mentioned LOT/emulsion number (021056-3) we have to admit that in this formula we used more hardened anti-halo layer and that´s why decolorizing is not so easy.

From our side we are going to make replacement to you from actual LOT/emulsion number, which is all right. Please, specify & prove how many rolls of FOMAPAN 100 – 120 you bought from the mentioned emulsion number and let us also your full delivery post address.

In case of your already exposed & processed negatives we recommend to you the following procedure to remove the residues of remaining anti-halo layer:

1) Prepare working solution in minimum with 40% of ethanol (optimally 70%).

2) Put carefully the films into spiral´s developing tank or a spiral with the film into similar transparent container with enough ethanol solution, with emulsion layer inside of the cylinder tank/container.

3) Keep the negatives in this solution approximately 45 minutes and make moderate movement each 4-5 minutes.
4) Wash sheets of the negatives in running water from tap for 2-3 minutes.

5) Make standard drying including wetting agent (FOTONAL).


If you may decide to use also other films from the same emulsion number, we advise you to follow this procedure of processing:


1) Exposed films put inside of the spiral´s developing tank.

2) Pour distilled water or water without minerals into this developing tank and keep the films in this solution for 20-30 minutes. Occasional inversion is convenient. This solution, ca. 600 ml, is possible to use in maximum for 2 rolls.

3) Immediately after pouring the water out you can fill the tank by developing working solution keeping standard conditions of developing, best using more alkaline developer, e.g. FOMADON R09.

4) After developing we recommend to stop process just by water bath, best running filtered water, in minimum for the time of 30 seconds in water´s temperature 12-18° C. Using acidic stop bath like FOMACITRO and others is not convenient in this case, because there are needed alkaline baths to help with dissolving the hardened anti-halo layer.

5) Standard fixing.

6) Wash the strips of the negatives in running water for 20-30 minutes (according to higher or lower temperature).

7) Use ethanol solution and other steps (1-5) as described in previous paragraph.


We are indeed sorry for made inconveniences to you & Hope you will achieve to save your processed negatives.

 

[DeletedAcct1]

This has been covered before, but I think it's worth posting Fomapan response into a separate thread for easier searching for other users:

------------ Fomapan Response --------------

Keep you informed that our Quality dept. has confirmed that the described white dots are residues of not decolorized anti-halo layer used by our film FOMAPAN 100 – 120 size. Considering your mentioned LOT/emulsion number (021056-3) we have to admit that in this formula we used more hardened anti-halo layer and that´s why decolorizing is not so easy.

From our side we are going to make replacement to you from actual LOT/emulsion number, which is all right. Please, specify & prove how many rolls of FOMAPAN 100 – 120 you bought from the mentioned emulsion number and let us also your full delivery post address.

In case of your already exposed & processed negatives we recommend to you the following procedure to remove the residues of remaining anti-halo layer:

1) Prepare working solution in minimum with 40% of ethanol (optimally 70%).

2) Put carefully the films into spiral´s developing tank or a spiral with the film into similar transparent container with enough ethanol solution, with emulsion layer inside of the cylinder tank/container.

3) Keep the negatives in this solution approximately 45 minutes and make moderate movement each 4-5 minutes.
4) Wash sheets of the negatives in running water from tap for 2-3 minutes.

5) Make standard drying including wetting agent (FOTONAL).


If you may decide to use also other films from the same emulsion number, we advise you to follow this procedure of processing:


1) Exposed films put inside of the spiral´s developing tank.

2) Pour distilled water or water without minerals into this developing tank and keep the films in this solution for 20-30 minutes. Occasional inversion is convenient. This solution, ca. 600 ml, is possible to use in maximum for 2 rolls.

3) Immediately after pouring the water out you can fill the tank by developing working solution keeping standard conditions of developing, best using more alkaline developer, e.g. FOMADON R09.

4) After developing we recommend to stop process just by water bath, best running filtered water, in minimum for the time of 30 seconds in water´s temperature 12-18° C. Using acidic stop bath like FOMACITRO and others is not convenient in this case, because there are needed alkaline baths to help with dissolving the hardened anti-halo layer.

5) Standard fixing.

6) Wash the strips of the negatives in running water for 20-30 minutes (according to higher or lower temperature).

7) Use ethanol solution and other steps (1-5) as described in previous paragraph.


We are indeed sorry for made inconveniences to you & Hope you will achieve to save your processed negatives.

Thanks a lot!

 

[Mick Fagan]

Very interesting about not using an acid stop bath to retain alkalinity, for further removal of the hardened anti-halation layer.

Thanks for giving us this information, some of us may need this in the near or far future; if we can remember that is.

Mick.

 

[rst]

... some of us may need this in the near or far future; if we can remember that is.

 

[AgX]

Very interesting about not using an acid stop bath to retain alkalinity, for further removal of the hardened anti-halation layer.

To me that maskes not much sense, as the idea of a plain water bath is not only to reduce developing agent concentration, but also the alkalinity.

Concerning the alkalinity I wonder why they did not advise concerning affected films processed in the past to add alkali to the alcohol solution. Maybe they considederd the risk too high of getting the concentratiin wrong and completedly spoiling the film, or the hassle too big.


Anyway, nonetheless a good idea by them to describe the actual problem in detail and to offer a treatment proposal as remedy.

I wonder though that the fault slipped their quality control. More alkaline processing by them?

 

[Nodda Duma]

That is a good, detailed response, good for them.

 

[Ojjokinen]

I came here to find answers to an issue of odd white dots on a 120 Rollei RPX100 roll I developed Monday - image attached. The roll was ordered from Silverprint just a week or so ago.

I havent seen the original thread where this is covered to identify whether this could be the same issue - does anyone have a link to it? I understand the production of Rollei RPX is a bit elusive and most likely done by one of the big European manufacturers.

 

[Вormental_old]

@Ojjokinen really cool image, BTW

 

[Ojjokinen]

@Ojjokinen really cool image, BTW

Thank you kind sir! Do you have any links on this though? A quick google of Rollei RPX call back yielded nothing so they clearly havent put anything out on the matter. I'd be interested in seeing what the described white dots look like and whether it is the same effect I had on the attached.. The whole roll had the same effect. I developed a roll of Delta 400 in the same process the following day and had no such clumps..

 

[Вormental_old]

I do not know anything about Rollei films, I have been dealing with these dots on Fomapan 100 and Arista EDU Ultra 100. It's the same emulsion.

 

[AgX]

I understand the production of Rollei RPX is a bit elusive and most likely done by one of the big European manufacturers.

The Rollei RPX films are coated by Harman (IlfordPhoto).

 

[Ojjokinen]

The Rollei RPX films are coated by Harman (IlfordPhoto).

Thank you, is this certain? I was planning on emailing the retailer as I bought ten of these rolls and would hate to see the same happen in others.

An alternative explanation is the difference in wash temperature which admittedly I did not take very seriously - dev, stop & fix at 20c, wash under running water which was probably around 15-16c.

 

[AgX]

Yes, from the source.

Strongly differently bath temperatures may lead to "reticulation", a artefact very different from what you presented.

 

[Ojjokinen]

Yes, from the source.

Strongly differently bath temperatures may lead to "reticulation", a artefact very different from what you presented.

Again, thank you - so the temperature is unlikely to be the culprit. I have emailed Silverprint where I bought the rolls to ask for their insight.

In the meantime, if anyone seeing this recognises the issue and knows the cause, I would hugely appreciate if you could share.

Olli

 

[Вormental_old]

@Ojjokinen speaking of rebranded films, this link was shared on Photrio before, I am not sure how accurate it is:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_photographic_films

 

[DeletedAcct1]

I came here to find answers to an issue of odd white dots on a 120 Rollei RPX100 roll I developed Monday - image attached. The roll was ordered from Silverprint just a week or so ago. View attachment 257861 View attachment 257861

I havent seen the original thread where this is covered to identify whether this could be the same issue - does anyone have a link to it? I understand the production of Rollei RPX is a bit elusive and most likely done by one of the big European manufacturers.

So RPX100 is manufactured by Foma?
I knew it was manufactured by Harman...

 

[Doremus Scudder]

Ojjokinen,

If you are using 120 film, the issue could be a backing paper problem. Search here for a lot of discussion about this.

Doremus

 

[gone]

That's probably not reticulation. I've had far greater differences in chemicals and not had that happen. When you get reticulation it tends to be all over the film. There's a suspicious line of vertical dots between the two buildings on your photo, and then there's what looks like an overall dot pattern in the sky. If it were me I'd make sure the inside of my camera and tank were spotless, scrub the reels, shoot another roll, and filter everything through coffee filters just in case.

 

[AgX]

...as the issue seems to affect the infamous emerald AHU layer which doesn't dissolve properly.

Any AHU-layer must not dissolve, otherwise the image would be lost, as the AHU-layer, as the name already should imply but may be ambiguous, is a layer between base and emulsion.
You likely meant a rear layer.

 

[albireo]

My Fomapan 100 batch which I received from EU was absolutely perfect.

Yep this has been solved with current batches, which are perfect. I'm using batch 021256 and it's gorgeous. No need for prewash, no need for special treatment - works great exposed and processed as recommended by the manufacturer IME.

 

[AgX]

Yep this has been solved with current batches, which are perfect. .

Just ordered a few rolls from B&H and yep - again - the same freaking little white dots (after inversion). Beware: Looks like B&H is still selling the old stock.

So this (again) is a issue of a manufacturer not recalling a defective product of his?

 

[albireo]

So this (again) is a issue of a manufacturer not recalling a defective product of his?

I do wonder..Seems like that's the case. In my experience Foma is really good when these batches are flagged and, if contacted, they'll promptly replace everything - however I am not aware if they have done full-scale recalls in the past. Maybe someone else can chime in.