Fogged Color Paper

RedSun · May 7, 2014

One of my Fuji Type P III 8" color roll paper is found to be fogged. The processed unexposed paper turns out to be slightly pink. I do not know what happened to it. Could this be darkroom safe-light? I do not recall having the paper exposed to safe-light. The bag could have been opened by the seller. Even with any possible exposure, I figure the fogging should only occur at the edges. But the entire sheet is pinkish. This batch of paper was last sold in 2008. So it is not very old.

So I opened another roll from the same batch. This one is sealed. It is not fogged. So I do not know if the fogged paper is because of exposure to safe-light, or just bad chemicals.

Any use to the fogged paper?

pentaxuser · May 7, 2014

My sympathies. I used to cut RA4 paper in the dark but used those "luminous stickers" in order to know where to place it on the cutter and noticed that if the paper came close to the sticker by accident then the paper in that area had a pink/magenta look about it.

The stickers aren't of course luminous in the true sense of the word but simply give out light that they have gathered from the white room light before it is switched off

I suspect that the paper is light fogged somehow

I have, I think, slightly age-fogged Kodak paper and that shows up as a creamy/yellowish colour in the borders.

I'd be wary of assuming that the whole roll is light fogged. I'd try to cut some from well inside the roll and process to see what happens.

Throwing out a whole roll is not an action to be taken lightly unless you have lots of money to spare.

If it is light fogged all the way through however I have no idea if it can be used for anything

pentaxuser

RedSun · May 7, 2014

Total I have cut 3 rolls of color paper. The other two rolls (one Type C and the other P III) have no problem at all. I never turn on any safe light. So either this roll was opened by the seller, or just de-graded (aged) somehow.

If the seller opened the paper, then the inside of the paper may still be good. But it is not. This seller has sold many rolls of papers (tens of boxes).

So most likely the paper is degraded. I do not know if 6 year old paper would be considered aged. For color, may be.

I did not pay a lot for the paper. But I just wonder what happened....

pentaxuser · May 7, 2014

I might be wrong but it doesn't sound like age-fogging. So you have bought a roll which is totally degraded and effectively useless? The seller needs to be told. If he is selling rolls that are effectively useless then even if it was free the postage cost still makes this stuff expensive.

My slightly age-fogged Kodak paper is still usable as it processes OK colour-wise except for the creamy borders which only shows up when compared to fresh paper which has white borders

pentaxuser

RedSun · May 7, 2014

I bought a total of about 10 rolls paper about 1.5 years ago. All are sealed in box except this roll. If I remember correctly (I could be wrong), the seal of this roll was still there. The roll could still be light fogged if not handled properly. At that time, I cut some and stored the sheets in black photo bags. Then the roll was stored inside a large black bag. Now both the cut sheets and the roll paper show the game pinkish fog.

The paper still respond to the enlarger and chemicals well. But it just has the pinkish tint. Maybe it can be used to print some greeting cards....

JoJo · May 8, 2014

It depends on the type/brand of paper what color it gets when aged.
I had some old Fuji which was yellow. Some Kodak Endura was brown and some Kodak Ultra was greenish-brown.
AGFA Signum was very strong orange.
Others may be pink.

Fogging by daylight gives a strong reddish color (like rust). But a complete roll which was unpacked by accident is exposed at the first 3-4 meters
and may also have a small red margin on both edges through the complete roll (3-5 millimeters).
Fogging by darkroom light gives a cyan color.
Your roll is definitly age fogged.

Open garbage bin, put roll inside, close garbage bin..

Joachim

Rudeofus · May 8, 2014

If you don't mind experimenting, you could try adding KBr to your RA4 color developer. Start with 0.1 g/l and add more in 0.1 g/l increments until the fog is gone. You may have to adjust exposure and color balance a bit, but results should come out fine. Any decent pharmacy will have KBr for a modest price, especially at the small amounts you will need.

One more thing: I found RA4 paper to be quite insensitive to yellow safe light, but even if it does fog your paper, the resulting color hue should be blue, not reddish.

JoJo · May 9, 2014

Have you ever tested and verified this KBr method?
I have read about a method using Benzotriazole in this forum, but never saw any examples using KBr.

Joachim

Rudeofus · May 9, 2014

JoJo said:
Have you ever tested and verified this KBr method?
I have read about a method using Benzotriazole in this forum, but never saw any examples using KBr.

I have here in my darkroom a giant stash of RA4 paper which appears to be well over 10 years old. With standard RA4 CD there was both fogging and very ugly swirls on my prints, which all went away immediately after I added 0.2 g/l. If you reuse your developer, you have to add the KBr again, the paper seems to eat the KBr for whatever reason (probably conversion AgCl + Br- ----> AgBr + Cl-).

What this left me with was a huge stash of paper which requires different filtration and a contrast boost, both of which can be achieved with little effort.

JoJo · May 9, 2014

Thank you very much.
I will try this with some old and brownish paper.
It is interesting to hear that the KBr will be eaten.

Joachim

Rudeofus · May 9, 2014

JoJo said:
It is interesting to hear that the KBr will be eaten.

You should expect the same kind of behavior with Benzotriazole, since it sticks very well to Silver.

RedSun · May 9, 2014

This is great. Will try.

Nodda Duma · Jun 6, 2015

Found this thread when researching the same problem I'm having with my first attempt at developing color prints. Did this end up working?

thanks,
Jason

David Lyga · Jun 9, 2015

Rudeofus is correct, in that either potassium bromide or benzotriazole will work, but test with SMALL quantities, as this stuff really stops RA-4 developer in its tracks! Add a tiny, but measured, amount to 100ml of developer working solution and see what happens before wasting a whole liter of developer.

Addionally, try this: Expose the paper for twice the time (maybe even longer) and develop diluting your color developer (with the bromide or BZ added). Essentially, developing for an effectively shorter time (dilution) will hold back that fog and the extra exposure will add the needed density. This is not a perfect solution but is one worth evaluating with practice,

I use NO safelight for either B&W or color printing. I do not OWN one! Reason: I trust no light. - David Lyga

Fogged Color Paper

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