Fixing up a Nettar 518/16

[philipus]

Greetings and salutations

I was recently given a Zeiss Nettar 518/16 for my birthday by thoughtful friends. The lenses are scratch-free and the shutter appears to release properly on all times except 1/10. I'm willing to tinker a bit with this camera and am wondering if adjusting the shutter is something I could do myself?

The two other things I would like to do is to clean the bellows – they have a bit of mould on the inside (and attendant smell) – and the lens elements which may have become affected by the mould (though do seem fairly clear actually).

Perhaps some of the forum's members have done this and could share their thoughts?

Thank you kindly in advance
Philip

 

[titrisol]

Before you do, exercise the shutter a few hundred times.
If only one speed is fialing, exercise might be sufficient. Other than that the shutter is not complicated

 

[Nicholas Lindan]

You don't mention the shutter on your camera - Nettars came in a large number of shutter variations. When you mention a 1/10 shutter speed I imagine you have a Prontor shutter (?).

One of the simple 3 or 4 speed shutters, velo/vario/vero/pronto..., isn't that complicated, though opportunities for springs to go sproing across the room, never to be seen again, abound.

A Prontor shutter with a full range of speeds is quite a bit more complicated. There may be repair guides on learncamerarepair.com and a search for youtube videos on the subject may yield further help.

I agree with titrisol that exercising the shutter first may get it to fix itself. Although many may grow apoplectic, removing the shutter from the camera and lens elements and flushing with Ronsinol can often remove enough old lubricant that the shutter starts to work again - or it can flush the old lube further into the recesses of the shutter and diaphragm and make things worse. I have had good luck with the method, YMMV and all that. If things get worse I will disavow giving such bad advice.

The safest and surest fix, if all the other speeds work, is to just not take pictures at 1/10th of a second.

If the mold is very slight then a toothbrush cleaning with some isopropyl alcohol followed with a few days exposure to sunlight may do it in.

 

[philipus]

Thank you for the suggestion. I have begun doing this and will continue tomorrow morning. It is indeed only the 1/10 that sticks.

Before you do, exercise the shutter a few hundred times.
If only one speed is fialing, exercise might be sufficient. Other than that the shutter is not complicated

Apologies, it's got the Velio shutter. I like the idea of trying with such a fluid – that's basically lighter fluid, right? If that doesn't work, would ethylalcohol be ok?

And yes, I always dread springs flying across the room when I open cameras...

Thank you for the suggestion re the bellows. The mould is indeed quite slight, basically only in various corners and exposed edges of the bellows. I'll brush it with alcohol and then leave it in the sun (if it ever returns here in The Netherlands).

A question – would it be an idea to apply a thin layer of some odour-free leather wax to the bellows to keep them soft or is that a bad idea?

I need to access the lens elements too. With a flashlight I see quite a few little marks on them. They seem faint so I think it will be possible to clean them.

You don't mention the shutter on your camera - Nettars came in a large number of shutter variations. When you mention a 1/10 shutter speed I imagine you have a Prontor shutter (?).

One of the simple 3 or 4 speed shutters, velo/vario/vero/pronto..., isn't that complicated, though opportunities for springs to go sproing across the room, never to be seen again, abound.

A Prontor shutter with a full range of speeds is quite a bit more complicated. There may be repair guides on learncamerarepair.com and a search for youtube videos on the subject may yield further help.

I agree with titrisol that exercising the shutter first may get it to fix itself. Although many may grow apoplectic, removing the shutter from the camera and lens elements and flushing with Ronsinol can often remove enough old lubricant that the shutter starts to work again - or it can flush the old lube further into the recesses of the shutter and diaphragm and make things worse. I have had good luck with the method, YMMV and all that. If things get worse I will disavow giving such bad advice.

The safest and surest fix, if all the other speeds work, is to just not take pictures at 1/10th of a second.

If the mold is very slight then a toothbrush cleaning with some isopropyl alcohol followed with a few days exposure to sunlight may do it in.

 

[madNbad]

Send a note to this shop before digging out the scanner.


http://www.jnoir.eu/en/repairs-sales/

 

[JPD]

Google for Velio shutter pics and you will find some repair photos with the shutter opened, so you can see what it looks like. It's a simple shutter and you probably don't have to disassemble it completely just to get one speed going.

 

[titrisol]

I used lighter fluid many times, and it is OK, but since a few people here recommended electrical contact cleaner I switched
It is far more efficient in cleaning and removing rust.
However be very careful as to not foul the shutter blades; otherwise you are in for a painful disassembly.

I cleaned of of these for my father in law in 2003-4 and learned a lot; however I had to redo it as I surely let the fluid go all over.
Check the bellows for leaks
You will need to recalibrate the lens, the easiest method is shown here: https://elekm.net/zeiss-ikon/repair/collimate/

PS. I think you have this camera:
518/16 Ih Novar Anastigmat 4.5/75 (Rodenstock) in Velio shutter (manufactured: Apr 53 - Jul 58)

Nettar - Camera-wiki.org - The free camera encyclopedia

camera-wiki.org

 

[BrianShaw]

…

I agree with titrisol that exercising the shutter first may get it to fix itself. Although many may grow apoplectic, removing the shutter from the camera and lens elements and flushing with Ronsinol can often remove enough old lubricant that the shutter starts to work again - or it can flush the old lube further into the recesses of the shutter and diaphragm and make things worse. I have had good luck with the method, YMMV and all that. If things get worse I will disavow giving such bad advice.

…

I’d only amend one statement here, all else is very true. Exercising a malfunctioning shutter may provide a bit more usability but it’s not a fix. It will always get worse and fail again in the future.

On the simpler shutters the lighter fluid ( or other non aqueous light clean drying solvent) can actually “fix” even without lubrication afterwards. If that technique doesn’t work well the first time it might take one or two more treatments. It is important to realize that after a treatment the shutter must be allowed to fully dry as wet parts can mimic the malfunction.

… you seem to already know this, though.

 

[philipus]

Thank you everyone, I really appreciate your suggestions and all the information.

I opened up the shutter yesterday evening and used alcohol and ROR in very small drops and then exercised the shutter. It didn't take long before 1/10th began to work. I also cleaned the lens elements.

The flash sync also works. Camera-wiki.org says that it's limited to 1/25th with slower (bulb) flashes, but does that mean that it synchronises on all times with normal flashes? My flash does fire on all times so I supposed that means that it does, or?

There's one small hole in the bellows, which seems to result from an old misfold. I've covered it on the inside with a flexible electrician's tape that I had handy so we'll see how long that will last. I have various glues here at home that I can try otherwise.

Cheers
Philip

 

[Dan Daniel]

The flash sync also works. Camera-wiki.org says that it's limited to 1/25th with slower (bulb) flashes, but does that mean that it synchronises on all times with normal flashes? My flash does fire on all times so I supposed that means that it does, or?

Look through the lens when firing the flash to see if it is synced. Aim flash and lens at a white wall or such, not have the flash pointing towards the lens.

Most older shutters will have a piece of brass that meets a contact to make the flash circuit. You can bend the brass slightly to adjust the sync.

 

[philipus]

Great suggestion, thank you Dan. I fired the flash at all times, placing it under the camera and with the back open so I could see if the shutter opened. Turns out that it opened on all shutter speeds, including B, which is very good news indeed. This was with the small National PE-1405 flash unit in the first image which has a handy built-in PC sync chord (very useful mini flash in case anyone's looking for one). I tried it with my Godox trigger and flash and that works brilliantly too.

The serial number on the back appears to be H 69542. The camera was made in Stuttgart but in the one serial numbers list I've found, at Camera-wiki.org, there is no H for cameras made in West-Germany. A bit of a mystery.

Look through the lens when firing the flash to see if it is synced. Aim flash and lens at a white wall or such, not have the flash pointing towards the lens.

Most older shutters will have a piece of brass that meets a contact to make the flash circuit. You can bend the brass slightly to adjust the sync.

 

[titrisol]

Looks great, have fun with it!