Fixing Negative Scratches

Alex Hawley · Jul 17, 2006

The time has finally come when I have a very good negative with a bad scratch. I understand a bit about what retouching is all about but have never done it. Can anyone offer suggestions for quick and easy materials available on the current market?

fhovie · Jul 17, 2006

Nose oil if the scratch is not in the emulsion. Can't beat it - it is my first pick .....

If the emulsion is scratched, you can use a very fine brush and some spotting solution (now very hard to find) It is easier to darken a light spot on a print than to scrape a dark spot. So I generally "paint" the scratch as fine as possible and stipple it away on the print.

fhovie · Jul 17, 2006

- I thought I'd add - nose oil is literally a little skin oil off the side of your nose. It will fill the scratch and light will not refract so much along the edge of it and will often eliminate the mark on the print altogether. (just in case you are unfamiliar)

Alex Hawley · Jul 17, 2006

Thanks Frank. This one is in the emulsion and too big for the old nose oil trick.

ann · Jul 17, 2006

you can try "no scratch". it is messy, but it may work.

it is one of those things that sometimes does, sometimes, doesn't.

you will need to clean the negative afterwards, which also means re-washing,

also clean the negative carrier.

Jorge · Jul 17, 2006

Disclaimer, I do not know if this will work, I have not tried it but, there is this new polymer used to fill in scratches on glasses that just might work on film if you mix it with a little ink or pigment. You might want to search on E bay for scratch repair and you will find them. They are pretty cheap and just might fill your needs.

Alex Hawley · Jul 17, 2006

Jorge said:
Disclaimer, I do not know if this will work, I have not tried it but, there is this new polymer used to fill in scratches on glasses that just might work on film if you mix it with a little ink or pigment. You might want to search on E bay for scratch repair and you will find them. They are pretty cheap and just might fill your needs.

Jorge, I highly appreciate the ingenuity, but I think I will stick with traditional methods. Thanks anyway.

Glad to see you are getting along well with your recovery!

Kino · Jul 17, 2006

Alex Hawley said:
Thanks Frank. This one is in the emulsion and too big for the old nose oil trick.

You didn't say how deep it was, but you might be out of luck for a liquid cure.

You can immerse the negative in silicon oil, but you need a glass carrier for that and, as Ann said, it gets very messy; you have to use a solvent based cleaner (like Ecco) to get the oil off, but you really don't have to rewash because of the oil.

One thing you CAN do to help minimize the scratch is to reprocess the film.

Run it back through exactly as you did upon first processing, but you can do it in the daylight. The developer will swell the emulsion and sometimes that "heals" the scratch.

It is a common trick in motion picture film processing when you are trying to salvage scratched camera original or a simply save a thousand feet of dupe stock that got lightly scratched.

As long as you do the FULL routine, it will NOT hurt the negative.

Frank

fhovie · Jul 17, 2006

And a last thought - Keep the scratch - in fact - add more - - tone it - mortdancage it and make it really artsy. Sometimes a scratch can head you off into a direction that creates something really new and different.

Donald Miller · Jul 17, 2006

Alex,

I have salvaged scratched negatives by using Scarlet Cocein and a 4X brush. You can fill the scratch with the red dye and this will print as added density. You can dilute the dye with water and build up your applications to achieve the desired density.

If you do this, you will find a white area on the print most usually. This is then retouched with your conventional retouching dye.

A magnifying glass and a light table are a big help to retouching the negative.

I have even used a fine point red Sharpee pen sometimes.

Red gives a less distinct demarcation between the retouch and the surrounding areas on the negative then black, for instance.

Alex Hawley · Jul 17, 2006

Donald Miller said:
I have even used a fine point red Sharpee pen sometimes.

Red gives a less distinct demarcation between the retouch and the surrounding areas on the negative then black, for instance.

Now that's one I never would have though of. I have a box of Red fine point Sharpees in my work desk!

Thanks Don!

Jim Jones · Jul 17, 2006

I've filled in deep scratches in graphic arts film with a very soft graphite pencil.

Charles Webb · Jul 18, 2006

Do not apply the crocein scarlet to the scratch! Apply the scarlet to the base side using a light table. Then when you enlarge the negative you will be focusing on the grain and the dye will be the thickness of the film softer than the actual grain. A soft edged spot is much easier to hide than a sharp edged one. To get a softer effect, use several layers of clear acetate with the retouching done on the acetate. A # 2 or #3 000 (ought) Rapidiograph
pen with india ink also works very well. In the days of retouching it was seldom if ever done on the emulsion side.

Charlie.................................

ricksplace · Jul 18, 2006

Jim Jones said:
I've filled in deep scratches in graphic arts film with a very soft graphite pencil.

me too. a 5B pencil available at stationary stores works well. Rubs off easy too if you apply too much.

Many years ago I worked as a draftsman with pen and ink and pencil. 6H was extra hard for working on mylar base paper with a lot of "bite". I don''t remember working with anything softer than a 2H. I think sketchers used the soft leads from B through to 5B. The higher the "B" number, the softer the lead. I don't know if you can find the really soft pencils anymore. Art stores may have them too.

photomc · Jul 18, 2006

Charles Webb said:
To get a softer effect, use several layers of clear acetate with the retouching done on the acetate. A # 2 or #3 000 (ought) Rapidiograph
pen with india ink also works very well. In the days of retouching it was seldom if ever done on the emulsion side.

Charlie.................................

Nice one Charlie, had not heard this one before, but I like the idea.

Good Thread Alex, hope we don't need this info that often, but sure glad to hear the thoughts.

noseoil · Jul 18, 2006

Alex, I'm curious about the scratch. Is it in the emulsion or on the base side? Is it a film defect or did you come by it "honestly" during processing & handling? Is it for enlarging or for contact printing? Which film were you using? Is it in the clear sky (the normal place for scratches from my experience).

One thing I've used is the whisker from one of our cats. The thick end is stiff, sharp and easy to control, the thin end is very fine and much softer. I have a standing policy in our house, any fallen whiskers go to my desk (no, I don't yank them out, it would piss off the cat if they were plucked and cats tend to hold a grudge). A strong magnifying glass, some spotting solution, a light box and patience are what is needed here. tim

P.S. thanks for the plug about the noseoil, but it is all one word -)

lowellh · Jul 18, 2006

In graphics, we use a "Sharpie"

Thomas Bertilsson · Jul 18, 2006

I read in an article by Bruce Barnbaum that to save damaged negs like that, he would go through the painstaking process of printing the negative, damaged, warts, and all to normal perfection standards. Next step is to retouch the print so it looks like it didn't have the scratch. In this case, that would involve very selective bleaching.

The best aspect is that if you mess up, you still have your original negative 'intact'. It may involve problems if it's a very large format neg. 4x5 and smaller can be enlarged to larger size, which would be easier to 'repair'.

Then photograph the print. Huge job, but could well be worth the effort if the neg is worth that much to you. I think it would be easier than to spot the neg.
Of course, I've never tried this myself, so no first hand experience.

- Thom

Dave Miller · Jul 18, 2006

ricksplace said:
me too. a 5B pencil available at stationary stores works well. Rubs off easy too if you apply too much.

Many years ago I worked as a draftsman with pen and ink and pencil. 6H was extra hard for working on mylar base paper with a lot of "bite". I don''t remember working with anything softer than a 2H. I think sketchers used the soft leads from B through to 5B. The higher the "B" number, the softer the lead. I don't know if you can find the really soft pencils anymore. Art stores may have them too.

I've brought 4B and 6B pencils recently. I use them for writing notes on the back of prints. The use of the soft lead ensures I don't have to press hard, and thereby mark the front.

MikeM1977 · Jul 18, 2006

Alex Hawley said:
The time has finally come when I have a very good negative with a bad scratch. I understand a bit about what retouching is all about but have never done it. Can anyone offer suggestions for quick and easy materials available on the current market?

I know this could be considered sacrilegious here, but this negative might be a great excuse to dip your toes into digital scanning and printing. BUT ONLY FOR THIS ONE NEGATIVE

Alex Hawley · Jul 18, 2006

MikeM1977 said:
I know this could be considered sacrilegious here, but this negative might be a great excuse to dip your toes into digital scanning and printing. BUT ONLY FOR THIS ONE NEGATIVE

Thanks, but no thanks MikeM1977. Ethics aside, my scanner is barely adequate for prints. Its completely worthless for scanning negatives.

Thanks to everyone for all the excellent suggestions. I will report back with what I try and how it turns out.

Markok765 · Jul 18, 2006

Edwal no-scratch

Fixing Negative Scratches

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