Film processing crash course

Henri Venable · Jul 7, 2009

Hey everyone, due to the unforseen incapability of local photo labs to process Ilford FP4+ and, I'm guessing, Delta 100 I need a crash course in dark room processing.

So, in terms of developer and fixer I'm looking at ID-11 and Rapid fixer, are these compatible and/or would you recommend any other combination of developer and fixer?

As for a stop bath, I've read that one can simply use water. Does it work? If so I think I would prefer water to a chemical stop bath, since I'm already apprehensive about working with all these chemicals.

For the actual developing process I'll just use google and spare you guys from repeating what you've probably said a thousand times over.

Thanks for the help,
Henri

Kevin Caulfield · Jul 7, 2009

ID-11 is as good a developer to start with as any. It and the Kodak equivalent (or near equivalent) D76 are considered as pretty much the standard developer. Rapid Fixer should also be fine. And regarding a stop bath, yes, many here would agree that a water stop bath is fine.

MattKing · Jul 7, 2009

What Kevin says (although I prefer using stop bath).

You'll probably need something like photo-flo for clean drying as well.

This might save you some time - the Ilford website is a great resource. Here is a link to the Getting Started section:

Dead Link Removed

Have fun.

Matt

Henri Venable · Jul 7, 2009

Great, thanks all!

We'll see how this turns out, I'm sort of excited.

PhotoJim · Jul 7, 2009

Stop bath is just 1/3 strength table vinegar, so if you're not afraid to put vinegar on your chips, it'll be fine in your stop bath tray.

wogster · Jul 7, 2009

Henri Venable said:
Hey everyone, due to the unforseen incapability of local photo labs to process Ilford FP4+ and, I'm guessing, Delta 100 I need a crash course in dark room processing.

So, in terms of developer and fixer I'm looking at ID-11 and Rapid fixer, are these compatible and/or would you recommend any other combination of developer and fixer?

As for a stop bath, I've read that one can simply use water. Does it work? If so I think I would prefer water to a chemical stop bath, since I'm already apprehensive about working with all these chemicals.

For the actual developing process I'll just use google and spare you guys from repeating what you've probably said a thousand times over.

Thanks for the help,
Henri

Most of the chemicals used in B&W photography are well known and were used for other things originally. Some of the chemicals used in colour processing are unique. For example stop bath is commonly either acetic or citric acid. Acetic acid is a very common chemical used in the food industry, known by a different name, vinegar. Citric acid is often found naturally inn citrus fruits, and gives them a somewhat sour taste. Citric acid is more common now because acetic acid has a very strong vinegar odour, and I can't stand that smell, from darkroom work in the late 1970's, even today.

Most chemicals used in B&W are fairly safe, you can use rubber gloves, or wash your hands well before and after using the chemicals and you should be okay, although some people get contact dermatitis (a rash) from metol, wearing long sleeves and rubber gloves will take care of that. One caution, do not share utensils between photo use and food preparation.

2F/2F · Jul 7, 2009

Henri Venable said:
Hey everyone, due to the unforseen incapability of local photo labs to process Ilford FP4+ and, I'm guessing, Delta 100 I need a crash course in dark room processing.

So, in terms of developer and fixer I'm looking at ID-11 and Rapid fixer, are these compatible and/or would you recommend any other combination of developer and fixer?

As for a stop bath, I've read that one can simply use water. Does it work? If so I think I would prefer water to a chemical stop bath, since I'm already apprehensive about working with all these chemicals.

For the actual developing process I'll just use google and spare you guys from repeating what you've probably said a thousand times over.

Thanks for the help,
Henri

Those are fine developers and fixers. There is nothing much to be worried about. You might find Ilfotec HC easier to use, as there is no mixing of powders that way. (That also makes it safer for your health, by the way.) The widespread fear over b/w home darkroom chemicals exists for no good reason, and should go away once you learn more about them. The chemicals are close to harmless if you take very simple precautions. Developer and working-solution stop bath are of no worry whatsoever. Fixer should not be dumped, as it is bad for the environment. Save it up and take it to a hazardous waste disposal site. The same with selenium, if you decide to use it. Any large city and every county should have at least one of these facilities.

For developing instructions, do yourself a favor and pick up a used beginning photo textbook, such as "Photography" by London and London (or Upton and London in some editions). it will contain developing instructions and so much more, and will be super cheap.

Note: Do not ever touch stop bath concentrate. It will give you acid burns. I accidentally touched some once, and could not feel my fingertips for nearly a week. It did not hurt; just numbed them. Do not fear, however. Just be careful. I would suggest wearing safety glasses when mixing the stop if you fear splashing.

Christopher Walrath · Jul 7, 2009

Wirelessly posted (BlackBerry9000/4.6.0.167 Profile/MIDP-2.0 Configuration/CLDC-1.1 VendorID/102 UP.Link/6.3.0.0.0)

Check out the July issue of CiM. We have a beginners course in B and W processing.

GJA · Jul 7, 2009

i think the last issue of CIM had an article with the same title as this thread. Look at any of the posts on this sit and your bound to see the avatar thats black and says CIM on it, I think its the blackberry guy. Its free and helpful and definitely a starting place.

rternbach · Jul 7, 2009

I've begun to evaluate these two devlopers: a. D76 and b. HC 110 with the following 120 films:

1. TMX-100
2. TMAX 400
3. HP5
4. FP4

So far I've used TMX-100 in D76 (1:1) and will stick with this combination as I acquire consistency and technique since I am new to this. Can anybody tell me if there is a film/developer combination above which is not reasonable to try? I'm planning on using the same pre-wetting and post-development steps for both developers and all four films.

Thanks for your replies.

RT

Henri Venable · Jul 8, 2009

Great, I just ordered ID-11, rapid fixer, and photoflo along with an SS reel and tank (hopefully they're compatible) and a changing bag. The rest (beakers, termometer, stirring rod, etc etc I'll try to get cheap at walmart of some such place).

I'll look into both the book and magazine recommended. Thanks for all the responses!

If I can find a negative scanner I'll post a few (if they're good).

rternbach · Jul 8, 2009

Henri,

I have had good results on the auction site. If you try searching "darkroom equipment" , " film developing" or similar terms you can find a lot of used but serviceable items.

Best,

RT

JBrunner · Jul 8, 2009

If you like to learn visually, there is a link in my sig to some videos that demonstrate the process, at least the way I do it anyway.

Henri Venable · Jul 8, 2009

RT - Thanks, I'm already browsing ebay.

Brunner - Found your vids on youtube a few days ago. Good stuff.

Henri Venable · Jul 18, 2009

If anyone's interested...first darkroom work was a complete failure.

I developed, stopped, fixed, and photoflo'd it for the recommend times with all the recommend agitations. Temperature was difficult to regulate/measure I just placed all my chemicals in a tub of 20* C water and hoped for the best (it's currently 104* F and I have no AC).

When I unwound the film from the reel it seemed to have not gone on correctly, although I did check the outsides of the reel for anything poking through and couldn't feel anything...I'm guessing this was my biggest problem as some of the film seems correctly processed while the majority is all black (or all white) with blobs of white (or black).

MattKing · Jul 18, 2009

Henri:

My condolences - but rest assured, most of us have been there as well!

I don't recall whether you mentioned which style of tank and reel you were using. Are you using a changing bag to load, or a darkened room?

It does sound (read?) like the results you get when the film bunches up against itself in the reel, due to the fact that that it didn't feed properly.

The feel and sound of film being properly loaded into a reel is hard to describe on the internet.

The only suggestion I can make is to get some scrap film and practice - first in the light, then with your eyes closed and then in the dark.

Don't hesitate to ask for more advice.

Matt

P.S. I meant it when I said that the sound of properly loaded film is important. IMHO it is one of the best ways of telling whether the film is going into the reel properly. This is one of the main reasons I refuse to use a changing bag.

bdial · Jul 18, 2009

Not a complete failure, you know much more about it now than you did before.
White areas are most likely places where the film was stuck together on the reel. This is very common for newbe's and stainless reels.
Areas that are all black are light-struck, probably in the changing bag, but there are numerous other possibilities.

It would be extremely unlikely for the film to poke through the sides of the reel, but it's easy to pull too hard and cause it to skip a spiral on one side or the other, or both. Usually it's one side that kinks a little and then it doesn't follow the spiral on that side. One way to check is to count the spirals starting from where the film is to the outside, on each side. If they aren't equal then the film has doubled up somewhere. Unwind till you find the place it slipped and start again.

Henri Venable · Jul 18, 2009

Mattking - I'm using a SS tank and reel (don't know what brand) and loading in a changing bag.

bdial - I do know more now than I did 2 hours ago that's for sure.

I'll practice my rolling method as I browse apug, we'll see how the next one turns out.

papagene · Jul 18, 2009

Henri - sorry for your spate of bad luck. As Matt says, we all have been there before. And I never really paid much attention to it, but Matt is right about the sound of properly loading film, it does sound different.

Keep practicing and much luck to you in your future attempts.

gene

Brandon D. · Jul 20, 2009

Henri Venable said:
As for a stop bath, I've read that one can simply use water. Does it work? If so I think I would prefer water to a chemical stop bath, since I'm already apprehensive about working with all these chemicals.

At first, I was apprehensive about all of the chemicals, too. First, I was apprehensive about mixing the chemicals for dilution and for storage. But then, I worked up the courage to do it, and it turned out to be no big deal. Second, I was apprehensive about the developing process itself. And once again, it turned out to be no big deal at all.

Work in a ventilated area, e.g., I initially mixed my chemicals outside, and then I processed my first rolls in my garage (just yesterday). Start out working with protective gloves, protective eye goggles, and a breathing mask (or a breathing respirator). With that much protection, you can make a lot of errors and still be well protected at the same time.

Come up with a plan to carry out your entire darkroom process, and just work at your own pace. You'll get faster at it with confidence, which only comes with experience. Also, prepare for spills, and just use common sense. I'm honestly convinced that all the chemicals are harmless to me as long as I use them properly.

FWIW, I'm using Kodak XTOL developer, Ilford Ilfostop stop bath, Ilford Hypam fixer, and Kodak Photoflo.

Best wishes!

fotch · Jul 20, 2009

Brandon D. said:
......
Work in a ventilated area, e.g., I initially mixed my chemicals outside, and then I processed my first rolls in my garage (just yesterday). Start out working with protective gloves, protective eye goggles, and a breathing mask (or a breathing respirator). With that much protection, you can make a lot of errors and still be well protected at the same time.

Come up with a plan to carry out your entire darkroom process, and just work at your own pace. You'll get faster at it with confidence, which only comes with experience. Also, prepare for spills, and just use common sense. I'm honestly convinced that all the chemicals are harmless to me as long as I use them properly.

Ha Ha Ha, sounds like your working with radioactive material! The picture you created in my mind with all you apparatus is what gave me a chuckle.

However, better safe than sorry.

CBG · Jul 20, 2009

Brandon D. said:
... working with protective gloves, protective eye goggles, and a breathing mask ...

You'll no doubt be better protected than I. Other than using tongs when handling prints, I don't use any special gear. Were I to use any especially nasty stuff, I'd get protective clothes, gloves... but right now I'm using same old same old stuff. D-76 ish developers, Indicator stop, Kodafix and Sprint fix, Permawash ... no super bad guys there.

Your choices seem pretty safe too. As a bonus, Xtol is supposed to be pretty low impact enviromentally to boot.

Best,

C

wogster · Jul 20, 2009

CBG said:
You'll no doubt be better protected than I. Other than using tongs when handling prints, I don't use any special gear. Were I to use any especially nasty stuff, I'd get protective clothes, gloves... but right now I'm using same old same old stuff. D-76 ish developers, Indicator stop, Kodafix and Sprint fix, Permawash ... no super bad guys there.

Your choices seem pretty safe too. As a bonus, Xtol is supposed to be pretty low impact enviromentally to boot.

Best,

C

What I find amazing in this litigious world we live in, reading the warnings on the package of D76, holy cow patties Batman, you would think this stuff was the most hazardous material ever invented..... It sure is different from the 1970's when the only warning on the package was to not breathe in the powders and to not drink the solution.

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