Film, paper & chemistry recommendation

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Chan Tran

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I have been doing color work for a long time but now I think I want to start doing some B&W. My experience with B&W was with Tri-X, Plus-X, Kodak Polycontrast paper and D76 developer. That was when I took a semester in photography back in 1979 or so. Since Kodak quits making B&W paper I am thinking of using Ilford Polycontrast RC paper. Any recommendation on a medium speed B&W film (ISO100-400) true B&W not C-41, film developer as well as paper developer?
 

fschifano

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There's no reason to stop using any of the materials you've already been using. Tri-X and Plus-X, developed in d-76 will print just fine on Ilford's paper. There is no need to change your paper chemistry.
 

jim appleyard

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Indeed, Plus-X, Tri-X and D-76 are still fine products. Since you're just getting back into b/w, I would suggest Adorama's brand of paper. The price is nice and you can branch out once you get rolling again. Dead Link Removed

Freestyle also sells a fine generic paper under their Arista name; just beware that you may need a different safelight for it.
 

fschifano

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Jim makes a good point about Adorama's paper. I use it quite a bit and it's a really good value for the money. I've used it under an OC safelight with no problems as long as I allow the required 1M distance between the safelight and the paper with a 15w bulb. I've had no problems with the Red 1A safelight under the same conditions. Works great in Dektol too. Contrast control is good with either the Ilford or Kodak VC filter set, though you will need to make adjustments to printing times when you change filters. The image color can be influenced to a small degree by diluting Dektol to 1+3 or even 1+4. Higher dilutions tend to warm the image up a bit.

According to their web site, Adorama doesn't have any house branded RC paper in stock. I've still got several hundred sheets of 8x10 on hand, but if I run short before they re-stock, I'll give the Arista.EDU Ultra from Freestyle a try.
 

srs5694

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Rumor has it that the Adorama paper is/was Ilford. As Ilford has stopped working with re-branders, whatever they've got now is all they'll ever have, and most of the products listed on their Web site are out of stock according to the Web site. Of course, they might just sign up with some other company and start selling a completely different product under the same or a different name.

Freestyle has several suppliers for the different lines of their product. This can be confusing because most of them go by the "Arista" name; you've got to pay attention to the sub-name:

  • Arista Pro -- I'm not sure this moniker was used for paper, but for film it was Ilford. Little or none of it is left.
  • Arista II -- This is supposedly Kentmere paper. In film, it is/was Agfa, but I don't think they've got much of that left. AFAIK, the paper line is current.
  • Arista.EDU -- This is Forte, in both film and paper. This seems to be a current product line, although Freestyle has a few odd gaps in the line.
  • Arista.EDU Ultra -- This is Foma, in both film and paper.
  • Freestyle Private Reserve -- If they've got any left, this paper is Agfa.

As to the original question, for film, paper, and chemistry, there are people who are very devoted to just about every product out there, so if this thread goes on for long enough, you'll get recommendations for lots of very different things.

That said, if you just want to "get you feet wet" and re-familiarize yourself with B&W processing, I'd say to start either with something inexpensive (Arista.EDU Ultra fits this bill for both film and paper) or with what you used last.

For chemistry, similar comments apply. My survey of commercial developer prices is about a year old and limited. Freestyle's Arista line extends to chemistry, though, and is pretty inexpensive. They've got A76, which I'm guessing is a D-76 clone (the development times match those for D-76). Rodinal and similar products (like Calbe/Foma R09) are quite inexpensive when diluted to 1+50 or 1+100. Personally, I favor phenidone/vitamin C ("PC") developers rather than the more common metol/hydroquinone ("MQ") developers, since phenidone and vitamin C are safer than metol and hydroquinone. (Not that metol and hydroquinone are all that toxic, but if reducing even a small risk is cheap and easy, why not do it?) I use mix-it-yourself chemistry, but in commercial products, AFAIK only Kodak XTOL and Paterson FX-50 are PC developers. The latter is much pricier and is likely to be hard to find; Paterson's been having problems with their chemistry supply of late. Among paper developers, there's the A&O (formerly Agfa) Neutol Plus (but not other products in the Neutol line) and the new Silvergrain Tektol line. I've been using an earlier mix-it-yourself Tektol variant called DS-14 with good results.
 

jim appleyard

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fschifano said:
According to their web site, Adorama doesn't have any house branded RC paper in stock. I've still got several hundred sheets of 8x10 on hand, but if I run short before they re-stock, I'll give the Arista.EDU Ultra from Freestyle a try.

It's back in stock. I rec'd notice yesterday that my backorder of 5/9 has been shipped.
 

jim appleyard

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srs5694 said:
Rumor has it that the Adorama paper is/was Ilford.


Yes, that is the general rumor, but some folks definitely said *NO* it wasn't. Who knows?
 

dancqu

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srs5694 said:
I'd say to start either with something inexpensive
(Arista.EDU Ultra fits this bill for both film and paper)
or with what you used last.

Perhaps not the Ultra. See the EDU Ultra thread of
a few days ago. The PDF indicates a DI Emulsion and
the thread seems to confirm that.

I've some EDU, no Ultra, which Freestyle insists is
the "exact" "exact" same as Forte Polywarmtone. By
the carbonate test it has NO DI Emulsion. That is
an exposed sheet will produce Zero image when
activated by a sodium carbonate solution. Dan
 
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Chan Tran

Chan Tran

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Thanks for all the suggestion. I think I would stay with Plus-X and Tri-X film and develop them in D-76. For paper I think I use Ilford polycontrast and develop in Dektol. Those are what I can buy at the local camera store. I don't want to go mail order unless I have to.
 

jim appleyard

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jim appleyard said:
It's back in stock. I rec'd notice yesterday that my backorder of 5/9 has been shipped.


Whoops, I'm sorry if I got everyone all aroused about photo paper, but it wasn't my paper that arrived today, it was the cable release I had on backorder. :sad:
 

pschauss

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Adorama sent me a note yesterday saying that they are no longer stocking their house brand paper. I have had a couple of boxes on backorder since January and their note seemed to be saying that they had shipped it. (If it is on my doorstep when I get home tonight I will know.)

When Adorama put their paper on backorder I started using the Freestyle Arista.EDU.Ultra paper. It is a bit thinner and curls more than the Adorama paper. Also, it seems to be about a stop slower.
 

srs5694

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pschauss said:
Adorama sent me a note yesterday saying that they are no longer stocking their house brand paper. I have had a couple of boxes on backorder since January and their note seemed to be saying that they had shipped it. (If it is on my doorstep when I get home tonight I will know.)

FWIW, I've found that Adorama doesn't handle out-of-stock items in the best way. I once placed an order for about half a dozen items, and their Web site had no indications that any of the products were out of stock. A day or two later I got an e-mail saying that one item was out of stock, then another couple. I e-mailed and asked and this information was confirmed. Then I got an e-mail saying that everything else in my order was out of stock. I cancelled the order and bought from somewhere else. I've never had anything even remotely like that bad happen with B&H (as far as I can tell, their online stock information is 100% accurate) or Freestyle (I order less from them but have seldom encountered out of stock items). A pity, really; Adorama will ship some things that B&H won't ship, so they're the best source for some products, at least for me.

When Adorama put their paper on backorder I started using the Freestyle Arista.EDU.Ultra paper. It is a bit thinner and curls more than the Adorama paper. Also, it seems to be about a stop slower.

That's been my experience, too. My first B&W paper (about a year ago) was Agfa MCP 310 RC, which is unusually thick, so my first go with the Arista.EDU Ultra/Foma paper was a shock. Adorama paper is closer to Agfa on this score. The "neutral" tone Arista.EDU Ultra/Foma paper is a bit warmer in tone than the Adorama and Agfa papers. I have yet to try the Arista.EDU/Forte paper.
 
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