Film advance problem w/ Velvia

ktwyford75 · Nov 27, 2008

I am having a peculiar problem with my Mamiya RB67 120 back. With a roll of Fuji Velvia loaded, i can wind to frame 1 and trip the shutter, but when I advance the frame the indicator stays on one no matter how many times try to wind on. It has happened with all four rolls I tried (two 50's and two 100's). Strangely enough, I have loaded and shot several rolls of Ilford film with absolutely no problems. So it seems my back has a problem with Velvia. I searched for info on this, and the closest I came to an answer is something about "film thickness syndrome." Can that be the case here? Is this something that can be fixed with some sort of cleaning?

~Kevin

kodachrome64 · Nov 27, 2008

Wirelessly posted (BlackBerry 8300: BlackBerry9000/4.6.0.185 Profile/MIDP-2.0 Configuration/CLDC-1.1 VendorID/102)

Wow that's weird. I have used both Velvias in my RB67 and they acted no different from any other films.

Is there any difference in thickness with Velvia and other films? Have you tried other tranny films?

Alexander Ghaffari · Nov 28, 2008

I have used Velvia 50 and Velvia 100 in 120 and 220 with Mamiya RB67 Pro-S and Pro-SD backs with no problems at all.

Poisson Du Jour · Nov 28, 2008

The problem sounds like the film perforations are skipping over the sprockets, or could be broken pawls connecting wind-on lever and sprocket gear; this can happen in any camera but especially those under heavy use (35mm, 120 esp.). Try a different Velvia (100, 100F) or Provia (100, 100F, 400) and see if it repeats; if it does, it's a Fuji problem but I'd hedge my bets on a fault with the film transport first.

Q.G. · Nov 28, 2008

Fish of the day,

120 film does not have perforations. 120 backs do not have sprockets.

Philippe-Georges · Nov 28, 2008

I had this kind of problem once, although with a Linhof Rapid Rolex 6x7 back. The film transport problem was caused by the tape used to stick the film on the backing paper. The tape came lose a little and got stuck on one of the rollers. Perhaps the tape could be the reason of your problem, who knows?

Philippe

Alexander Ghaffari · Nov 28, 2008

Q.G., I hate it when my 4x5 film jams because of its sprocket holes. ; )

tjaded · Nov 28, 2008

Fuji 120 backing paper is thinner than other brands...maybe that has something to do with it?

Mark Antony · Nov 28, 2008

Could be thinner backing, or even thinner emulsion as slower films sometimes are thinner than fast ones.
Can you get a slow B&W film through OK? They should be thinnest.
Personally I'd bet on the back being out of tolerance, try to get another back. I have a hard time believing Velvia can't be used in RB67 backs.
Mark

ktwyford75 · Nov 28, 2008

Mark Anthony,
I'm sure it's the back, but I was hoping to see if anyone had any of the same issues. I've ran Ilford Pan F+ (slow) with no problems. I'm going to try my last roll of Velvia today and see what happens.

~Kevin

Mark Antony · Nov 28, 2008

Kevin
Might be the back. I have a similar problem with Neopan 400 in my Fuji RF where it mis-loads and loose winds only that film, any other film is OK
Strange but true.

ktwyford75 · Nov 28, 2008

Okay. So I went ahead and tried again with my last roll of velvia 100, and I had a different phenomenon. This time, I wound through about 5 frames on the film before frame 1 was indicated. So, after processing it I had 6 blank frames and only 3.5 exposed frames! Frustrating!

MattKing · Nov 28, 2008

It probably is a fan of Kodak film in preference to Fuji .

Matt

ktwyford75 · Nov 29, 2008

Thanks for all the replies. I am going to pick up some other types of film to try. I will test to see if perhaps my back is intolerant of reversal films vs. negative. Who knows?

~Kevin

xtolsniffer · Dec 2, 2008

Why don't you sacrifice a roll of film and put it through the holder without putting the holder in the back so you can watch what happens? I do this with my RB backs when I buy a secondhand one to check it all works.

ktwyford75 · Dec 3, 2008

xtolsniffer said:
Why don't you sacrifice a roll of film and put it through the holder without putting the holder in the back so you can watch what happens? I do this with my RB backs when I buy a secondhand one to check it all works.

How will that tell me why the exposure counter does not advance? The film is advancing just fine, but somehow the exposure counter is not indicating the correct frame in the roll of film.

~Kevin

dsim · Mar 28, 2009

Using Velvia 50 with my RB67 ProS resulted in losing a frame and a half at the beginning. I made sure the start mark was aligned properly, DS removed for shooting, shutter fired etc.

I took the advice in this very thread and wasted a roll to understand what was happening. Each time the counter showed frame one, the film was actually at the end of the second frame. I contemplated ordering a new back. Re-reading the thread I considered Mark Anthony's post regarding the Velvia 50's emulsion thinness. I decided to have another try with T-Max 100 and the ProS back off.

The back worked as expected. The tension in the film advance lever was noticeably increased. Frame one lined up with the counter reading of one. I re-spooled and tried again, no problems. I also tried with E100VS and had no problems.

Is there a trick to loading the Velvia 50 emulsion that is possibly overlooked.

archphoto · Mar 28, 2009

I don't think this has anything to do with Velvia.
It appears to me that your back needs a CLA and esp. the A(djustment) part of it.
Your problems with Velvia is just an indication that your back needs one.

Peter

dsim · Mar 28, 2009

Thanks Peter.

Film advance problem w/ Velvia

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