FB Papers (Ilford vs. Oriental)

JackRosa · Jun 8, 2014

I've used Ilford Multigrade as pretty much my only paper for quite some time but had a chance to test some Oriental VC Seagull (FB) and was impressed by the results. It looks like Ilford (Classic) is more contrasty and Oriental reacts more vigorously to increased development. I use PD-130 diluted 1+1.

I toned Ilford in Kodak Selenium 1+9 (5 minutes at 75F) and after a little playing around found that the look I liked best with Oriental was achieved with Kodak Selenium diluted 1+5, 3 minutes at 80F.

I have plenty more testing to do before I abandon my "old friend" for a new friend but am hoping some of my fellow photographer here at APUG can share shame light into this subject.

Any insight/opinions would be appreciated.

ROL · Jun 8, 2014

Oriental graded were my papers of choice, VC less so, though still excellent. I would match graded sheet sizes with mural rolls of VC. The problem, as I've experienced it, is lack of sustained supply. Sad to say, (though happily for) Ilford may be the only predictable supply of excellent classic printing materials.

GRHazelton · Jun 8, 2014

Any reports on these papers? http://www.ultrafineonline.com/ulprfibava.html I have no idea who makes these papers for the vendor.

And FreeStyle in California has quite a variety http://www.freestylephoto.biz/ Most are familiar names.

brian steinberger · Jun 16, 2014

I'm surprised no one else commented on this thread. I've used oriental VC in the past and was impressed. Very very similar to MGIV. I decided to stick with MGIV for cool to neutral prints. As for the new ilford papers I have only tried the new cool tone paper. I am not impressed so far. I was hoping for cool blue blacks with selenium and instead got a brownish red. I used Eukobrom which is not a warm tone developer. I have some new classic on hand as well. Needless to say if Classic does the same thing as cool tone in selenium I will be going back to oriental for cool to neutral prints. Others complained that MGIV did not respond well to selenium. Non sense! It toned beautifully at 1:10 or stronger. Cooled nicely to a charcoal color. Very nice! Oriental acts much the same.

JackRosa · Jun 16, 2014

Thank you Brian and Michael. My feelings parallel Michael's ... I was surprised no one commented on this thread.

I tone Ilford in Selenium 1+9 for 5 minutes at 75F and like the results. If you tone Oriental in Selenium 1+5 for 3 minutes at 80F, you will notice a more "purple" look but still very pleasing.

In all cases, I use Formulary's PD-130 diluted 1+1, 1 minute at 68F to develop the paper.

Thanks for your insight & comments.

brian steinberger · Jun 17, 2014

I would agree oriental may go "purple" quicker or tone faster. I had compared prints I made from the same negative on both papers and when wet you can see the oriental looked a little more purplish but upon dry down the MGIV and oriental were identical, to my eyes anyway.

brian steinberger · Jun 17, 2014

Id also like to point out that when I was using this paper 2-3 years ago I don't recall the "cooltone" label it now has when I look it up at b&h.

Interesting point Michael about ilford making this paper. I've heard this before. I don't have a package on hand to see if the label actually says"made in Japan" on it. If not I would believe it's made by ilford if you told me. Actually that would be a good thing!

I plan to buy another box of oriental soon and compare with Ilfords new classic. If oriental is still as cold neutral as I remember and classic is warmer than MGIV I'll be sticking with oriental and MGWT as my two printing papers.

brian steinberger · Jun 17, 2014

Michael, good point about developers. My tests at the time were with ansco 130 1:1.

brian steinberger · Jun 17, 2014

Michael, can I ask why you stopped using it?

GRHazelton · Jun 18, 2014

GRHazelton said:
Any reports on these papers? http://www.ultrafineonline.com/ulprfibava.html I have no idea who makes these papers for the vendor.

And FreeStyle in California has quite a variety http://www.freestylephoto.biz/ Most are familiar names.

I went to Wings Camera here in the Atlanta area to get a stuck filter removed. Success! Mike, the proprietor is an old hand; the business itself is over 100 years old. A wonderful selection of film gear. If you're in the area drop by.

The shop had a nice selection of the Ultrafine paper I mentioned in the post above. Mike's assistant said he'd found it "just fine."

RalphLambrecht · Jun 18, 2014

Ilford MG FB is a friend I will never give up on.It's the most reliable and consistant photographic paper on the market today.It never yellowed or faded on me and has the classic look that sells the best.I wish I could find an inkjet paper to match it.

brian steinberger · Jun 19, 2014

RalphLambrecht said:
Ilford MG FB is a friend I will never give up on.It's the most reliable and consistant photographic paper on the market today.It never yellowed or faded on me and has the classic look that sells the best.I wish I could find an inkjet paper to match it.

Ralph, are you planning to transition to the new Classic paper once your MGIV stock runs out? Have you tried Classic?

DREW WILEY · Jun 19, 2014

I was addicted to the old Oriental Seagull G graded bromide paper, but not equally impressed with its redux version, and certainly never fond of the VC versions, though I tried them all. I've always thought of MGIV as a competent but otherwise slightly lackluster paper with a so-so DMax and not especially resilient in toners. So I used mostly Polygrade V and Kentmere Fineprint. But now we're into some absolutely "Wow" Ilford VC papers. MGWT has obviously been around awhile, but what you also need to try is the new Cooltone product. Pretty much fills in whatever
MGIV lacked if a cold tone is desired. Very nice in amidol. Richer DMax and superior tonality, esp up in the highlights. Tones well.

DREW WILEY · Jun 19, 2014

Not after toning! Conspicuous improvement over MGIV. But like any new paper, there is a bit of learning curve to mastering it.

FB Papers (Ilford vs. Oriental)

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