Fastest EI available from a 4x5 film?

Hi,

In a bid to expand my handheld options I am wondering what combos give really good speed from available 5x4 films. Sadly Delta 3200 is not available as sheet and from my experience HP5 plus just has the edge on TriX (400) in speed for 120 so presumably a fair adge on TriX 320 in sheet?

HP5 plus in DDX should give very full film speed but I am looking to see if there are easily available film/dev combos that would give appreciably more genuine shadow speed than this in 5x4 sheet. If I could get a solid 800 that would be incredible but perhaps I am expecting too much.

Any thoughts?

Tom

If you discount Polaroid Type 57 (ISO 3000), HP5+ has the fastest true speed AFAIK. However, I've gotten very good results with old, expired 9x12 cm Tri-X 320 pushed to EI 5000 in a "Super Soup" compounded of Dektol, HC-110, vitamin C, and washing soda; the resulting negatives are slightly foggy, but don't look pushed at all and print at close to normal contrast settings. The process is one that can really only be done in tubes or an invertible daylight tank, however (*extremely* vigorous agitation every 30 seconds). Others have reported similarly good results with this film and developer combination, as well.

Donald, can u give details on the SuperSoup?

Also, can that be done with Tri-X 400 as well, or just the 320?

TXP320 is a VERY different film than Tri-X 400 although its name is very similar.
I think your best option is Ilford HP5+ pushed at 800 and souped in Microphen.
You can obtain quite good results also exposing it at 1600.

Tom Stanworth said:

Hi,

In a bid to expand my handheld options I am wondering what combos give really good speed from available 5x4 films. Sadly Delta 3200 is not available as sheet and from my experience HP5 plus just has the edge on TriX (400) in speed for 120 so presumably a fair adge on TriX 320 in sheet?

HP5 plus in DDX should give very full film speed but I am looking to see if there are easily available film/dev combos that would give appreciably more genuine shadow speed than this in 5x4 sheet. If I could get a solid 800 that would be incredible but perhaps I am expecting too much.

Any thoughts?

Tom

Click to expand...

Your LF "handheld options" can be greatly expanded by introducing a powerful flashgun into the equation. Obtain some vintage flashbulbs and a good working flashgun and see how well those 4x5 press cameras performed! Even a more modern strobe unit (properly synched to your shutter of course) will deliver razor sharp handheld 4x5 negatives, with little or no grain. To make things easy just focus the lens on infinity and frame the shot with the pop-up sports finder and you'll be amazed at the results.

For the past few years, I've used a totally different approach to 'pushing' film than I did in the '60s and '70s ( the bad old days of 'powerful' developers ). Today, the results are more pleasant, and are simple extensions of normal processing.

I use TMAx 400 ( in Xtol, 1+2, with reduced agitation ) at EI from 200 to 1600.
I expect that HP5 and DDX would give similar results, although I'd lean toward Delta or TMAX.

The agitation pattern that is efficient and safe would be 10 seconds every 5 minutes. A starting time would be twice the suggested time for a given exposure index. The results are very similar to a normal curve, as the the increased development time 'pushes' the shadows while the reduced agitation 'pulls the highlights'. Both Xtol and DDX are very efficient at maximizing whatever shadows speed the film has, and the result is a negative that looks disturbingly normal... with a tiny bit more base fog and - of course - a wee bit more grain.

It works very well in 35mm, so why not 4x5 ?

The trick is to begin with a film that tends toward a long straight line,
and a developer like Xtol or DDX.

HC110 and TXP, for instance, would be a different experience altogether ! But those 4 zones you got would be lovely !

Here are a couple of examples of the combination, from a tiny 35mm neg. The actual prints look quite normal, the scans lose so much 'presence' !

(there was a url link here which no longer exists)

(there was a url link here which no longer exists)

good luck

don

HP5+ is probably the fastest in 4x5", but I just don't care for the look. For handheld LF without flash, I usually shoot TXP or J&C Classic 400 at 640 souped in Acufine.

For night photography (high contrast like street lamps), you might experiment with the XR-1 formula (see article on unblinkingeye.com) for maybe one more stop worth of speed, but I found the contrast too low for normal lighting conditions.

As usual, I'm with Df on this one, I'd think Tmax 400 would push great and be your ticket if you aren't looking for a traditional emulsion

But it's good to just mess around and find odd things that work for you. I LOVE TXP pushed. My negs are often thin, but in fairness I handle it digitally, scanning the neg and outputing on a piezo. It's blasphemy here, yes, but, well, who cares. I only mention it b/c I imagine some of my negs that scan well would be a hooch to print traditionally if that's you're route.

Anyway, for an example check out the 1st and 4th shot in Portfolio 3 on my site. I have no clue what the E.I. was. Lots.

Neat shots Graeme

d

htmlguru4242 said:

Donald, can u give details on the SuperSoup?

Also, can that be done with Tri-X 400 as well, or just the 320?

Click to expand...

Yes, in my experience it works about as well for 400TX as for 320TXP, though the EI varies a little (actually, I've used it with the older TX in 35 mm and TXT sheet film). Mixing information, and a fairly recent thread showing some results from someone else using the Super Soup, can be found (there was a url link here which no longer exists).