Exakta 66 versus Bronica ETRSi?

kawasakiguy37 · Feb 10, 2011

I currently have an Exakta 66 and a good condition 50 4 zeiss lens. Im getting some great results with the camera, abut the thing is just fricking HUGE. Its really hard to justify bringing it along with my D3. Originally I bought the 50 4.0 to use on my D3 for tilt photography with an adapter - does anyone know if I can do the same with the bronica lenses? I really like 6 x 6 but I suppose I could possibly downsize to the 6 x 4.5 of the bronica

Also, how do the lenses on the bronica system and the pentacon system compare? The main reason I invested in an Exakta 66 is there seems to be a lot of good quality Zeiss glass for pretty cheap - then again bronica gets leaf shutters.....

edit: Id like to point out I want to use the camera mainly for landscapes and nature work, so I am also considering 6 x 7 and 6x 9 camera. I am on a very tight budget though (another reason I am considering selling the exakta).

CGW · Feb 10, 2011

The Bronica ERTSi is a bargain now.

If you want 6x7, look into the Mamiya RB system. Cheap, versatile, big, plentiful, swappable film backs, close-ups with bellows focusing.

wiltw · Feb 10, 2011

Bronica ETRSi lenses have a Seiko lens shutter/diaphram. The biggest trick is to get the lens to stop down for shooting! Somehow the ETR body can do it, but I have not figured out how to trigger it...mechanically or electrically. You'd have to figure that one out first.

lxdude · Feb 10, 2011

wiltw said:
Bronica ETRSi lenses have a Seiko lens shutter/diaphram. The biggest trick is to get the lens to stop down for shooting! Somehow the ETR body can do it, but I have not figured out how to trigger it...mechanically or electrically. You'd have to figure that one out first.

It's quick and fairly simple.

Here's the procedure:
Start with the lens cocked. The pins on the back will be next to the green dots.
Move the A/T lever to T.
Look at the back of the lens. You will see the word "JAPAN" or "SEIKO".
Look at the lens mount, to the right of that word, about level with it. You will see a small chrome lever projecting outward slightly.
Push that in and while holding it in, move the pins on the back through their entire arc (clockwise) until they stop.
That will stop down the aperture and open the shutter, which will stay open until the T/A lever is moved back to A.

To restore normal function and allow the lens to be mounted on the Bronica, move the T/A lever back to A and move the pins all the way back to the cocked position, next to the green dots (the chrome lever on the mount does not need to be pushed in for this part).

That's it!

wiltw · Feb 10, 2011

Thanks very much, lxdude. That worked for PE lens. Finally, I can mount the ETRSi lenses on my Horseman monorail (customized lensboard with Bronica ETR mount) and mount my Canon d*g*t*l camera on the back (with another customized lensboard) and be able to shoot.

And what about the MC lenses which lack the A/T lever?

lxdude · Feb 10, 2011

wiltw said:
Thanks lxdude. That worked for PE lens.

And what about the MC lenses which lack the A/T lever?

They should all have an A/T lever. My MC's all have one; the only difference is the metal retaining pin has a slot and is screwed in and out instead of being pulled out and pushed in as on the PE's.

If an E or MC lens did not did not have one, or if it did not function, the DoF preview lever could be held in by securing a zip-tie around the lens. The manual says not to change the aperture with it held in, though.

rawhead · Feb 11, 2011

If the Exakta 66 is too big, then I can't see any 6x7 (let alone 6x9) system that would be better off. I love my 67II, but it's definitely bigger than an Exakta 66, and an RB/RZ is a friggin' monster. You might check out a Mamiya 7/7II, but that's probably outside your budget.

In a related note, let me know if you want to rid yourself of that bulky Exakta 66... I've been in search of a reliable Pentacon Six mount body for a while now ;-)

kawasakiguy37 · Feb 14, 2011

Am I supposed to get stop down style metering with this camera? Right now the viewfinder dims as I move the aperture - shouldnt it just stop down right when I press the trigger only?

Wishy · Feb 14, 2011

kawasakiguy37 said:
The main reason I invested in an Exakta 66 is there seems to be a lot of good quality Zeiss glass for pretty cheap - then again bronica gets leaf shutters.....

Its quite an expensive system for that it is - last i looked its not far off hassie money for a body, although lenses are cheaper. While they're not bad, think its fair to say the Zeiss Jena lenses aren't up to the standard of Zeiss Oberkochen (In terms of design, coating and quality control)
I wouldn't expect the Zeiss Jena lenses to be anything too special, certainly you'll get a capable lens with the systems you've suggested

One thing - your shooting 6x6 now - are you happy with this? Your looking at a variety of different formats, and my experience has always been finding the format I like and THEN working out what system I want

kawasakiguy37 · Feb 14, 2011

I do like 6x6, but I also like 6x7 and 6x9. Im not looking to go smaller than 6x6 as I have a D3 and for all normal purposes it takes amazing pictures. Hassie is appealing, but still a lot, lot more than Id be willing to afford....I bought this camera for a little less than $500 and I dont think I could possibly afford anything more expensive

lxdude · Feb 14, 2011

kawasakiguy37 said:
I do like 6x6, but I also like 6x7 and 6x9. Im not looking to go smaller than 6x6 as I have a D3 and for all normal purposes it takes amazing pictures. Hassie is appealing, but still a lot, lot more than Id be willing to afford....I bought this camera for a little less than $500 and I dont think I could possibly afford anything more expensive

Then forget the Bronica ETR series and look at the SQ series. They are 6x6 and not much larger than an ETR-Si.

Adrian Twiss · Feb 15, 2011

I owned an extensive Exakta 66 system for a number of years which included both Zeiss Jena and Schneider lenses. I currently own a Bronica SQB and a number of Zenzanon lenses. I found for enlargements of around 15 inches there was no discernible difference between Schneider and Zenzanon lenses. The Zenzanon lenses just pipped the Zeiss lenses for sharpness at this degree of this enlargement.

Steve Smith · Feb 15, 2011

lxdude said:
Then forget the Bronica ETR series and look at the SQ series. They are 6x6 and not much larger than an ETR-Si.

This make me wonder why they didn't just make one camera with the option of 6x6 or 6x4.5 backs.

Just the SQ and its lenses with the two types of back option would be ideal for me.

Instead I have an ETRS and sometimes wish it was a SQ!

Steve.

lxdude · Feb 15, 2011

The SQ series has 645 backs in 120 and 220, so that's certainly an option, if you can find them.
The ETR was introduced Jan. 1976. The SQ came along in Oct. 1980, and was based on the ETR design. Maybe they were not originally planning to replace their EC series, but seeing the popularity of the ETR series, they decided to produce a Hasselblad style (leaf shutter, etc.,) 6x6. Just a thought.

The SQ-Ai is about 5/8 inch longer and maybe 3/16 inch taller, but weighs (IIRC), about a half pound more than the ETR-Si. And the lenses and accessories are a little bit bigger and a little bit heavier. So it definitely has more 'presence' than the ETR-Si. Nothing unexpected-just a little more of everything.
I suppose wedding photographers, who employed the ETR series extensively, appreciated the lighter weight and less bulk, plus more shots per roll, and accepted the trade-off of having to tilt the camera for verticals.

Like you, I'm considering getting an SQ series machine and selling my ETR-Si's, as I have for the first time in my life gotten interested in the character of the square composition. Part of that is that the 4:3 ratio doesn't do a lot for me anyway: I prefer a larger ratio in rectangular.

Steve Smith · Feb 15, 2011

lxdude said:
The ETR was introduced Jan. 1976. The SQ came along in Oct. 1980, and was based on the ETR design.

I didn't know that.

lxdude said:
The ETR was introduced Jan. 1976. The SQ came along in Oct. 1980, and was based on the ETR design.

Put historically, it makes more sense. I suppose that if the SQ was first then there wouldn't have benn an ETRS.

lxdude said:
I have for the first time in my life gotten interested in the character of the square composition.

I like both the square composition and the waist level finder which is why I tend to use my Rolleicord a lot more now. I have recently sold my RB67 as I found I was not using it so with the money that brought in I might consider an SQ for times when I want a different angle of view from the Rolleicord's standard (and fixed) lens.

Steve.

Klainmeister · Feb 15, 2011

To the OP: Have you considered a Mamiya Press system? I had a Mamiya press with a 6x7 back and a 6x9 back, plus two super sharp lenses for under $300 and kinda miss the thing. There's also 6x4.5 and 6x6 backs so theoretically, it's an all and all camera with great lenses. It is a lunker though.

Also, I've used Voigtlander folders that blew my socks off. A Bessa RF or Bessa II with the skopar or heliar lens will produce incredible 6x9 negs and weigh less that 2.5lb total. Granted, lenses aren't interchangeable.

Just some thoughts from a fellow landscaper.

CGW · Feb 15, 2011

lxdude said:
The SQ series has 645 backs in 120 and 220, so that's certainly an option, if you can find them.
The ETR was introduced Jan. 1976. The SQ came along in Oct. 1980, and was based on the ETR design. Maybe they were not originally planning to replace their EC series, but seeing the popularity of the ETR series, they decided to produce a Hasselblad style (leaf shutter, etc.,) 6x6. Just a thought.

The SQ-Ai is about 5/8 inch longer and maybe 3/16 inch taller, but weighs (IIRC), about a half pound more than the ETR-Si. And the lenses and accessories are a little bit bigger and a little bit heavier. So it definitely has more 'presence' than the ETR-Si. Nothing unexpected-just a little more of everything.
I suppose wedding photographers, who employed the ETR series extensively, appreciated the lighter weight and less bulk, plus more shots per roll, and accepted the trade-off of having to tilt the camera for verticals.

Like you, I'm considering getting an SQ series machine and selling my ETR-Si's, as I have for the first time in my life gotten interested in the character of the square composition. Part of that is that the 4:3 ratio doesn't do a lot for me anyway: I prefer a larger ratio in rectangular.

The Bronica SQ-B is worth a look, especially if you can find an intact kit with 80/2.8, WLF and 120 back. Otherwise assembling a kit can be dicey:WLFs are pricey, as are 120 backs; anything aside from the 80 and 150 can be tough to find in good shape at a decent price. Despite being dissed for its size, the Mamiya RB system is still arguably the most negative real estate for the buck.

kawasakiguy37 · Feb 15, 2011

Interesting, I did not know there was an SQ that was square format. Thats much more appealing to me....I may just have to sell this exakta and get the SQ

wiltw · Feb 15, 2011

kawasakiguy37 said:
Am I supposed to get stop down style metering with this camera? Right now the viewfinder dims as I move the aperture - shouldnt it just stop down right when I press the trigger only?

With the Bronica??? The lenses are coupled with the meter electronically, so metering is designed to be done at wide open aperture.

Steve Smith · Feb 16, 2011

kawasakiguy37 said:
Interesting, I did not know there was an SQ that was square format. Thats much more appealing to me....I may just have to sell this exakta and get the SQ

I think the SQ is supposed to stand for square (though I could be wrong!).

Steve.

film_man · Feb 16, 2011

With regards to the ETRS and SQ sizes, I have had both and the ETRS feels much smaller and compact in hand compared to the SQ.

Anyway, the SQB is a nice camera and I had the 80PSB that goes with it as a kit. Sharp, easy to use, easy to load, generally a good camera for a budget. As said, finding it as a complete kit is easier and works out cheaper. The only thing you should look out for is the condition of the focusing screen as they tend to get scratched a lot. The other advantage of the SQB is that it is the newest model (went into production in 1996) in the SQ line so you know you're not buying an ancient camera. It won't take a motordrive or any of the metered prisms though.

All you ever wanted to know about the Bronica line:
http://www.tamron-usa.com/bronica/sq_guide.asp
http://www.tamron-usa.com/bronica/prod/sq.asp

lxdude · Feb 16, 2011

film_man said:
With regards to the ETRS and SQ sizes, I have had both and the ETRS feels much smaller and compact in hand compared to the SQ.

True that, despite being close by measurement. Now the SQ compared to the RB/RZ...
Even the GS-1 seems (relatively) small compared to those. No diss on the Mamiyas though-they're great at what they do.

Exakta 66 versus Bronica ETRSi?

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