Eugene Atget Appreciation

cliveh · Sep 29, 2024

DREW WILEY said:
That's one of the greatest pictures in the history of photography, Cliveh, along with several very similar ones - greater than the sum of their parts. He got better with old age - remarkably poignant. Even though distant, the statues are as if alive, something he had an uncanny ability to do over and over again. But the sculpting of form itself, deep blacks juxtaposed again the brilliance of overpowering highlights, is about as poetically impressive as it gets in any visual medium. The compositional balance - incredible. Overall, a timeless image.

I know, us mere mortals can't compete.

Pieter12 · Sep 29, 2024

DREW WILEY said:
That's one of the greatest pictures in the history of photography, Cliveh, along with several very similar ones - greater than the sum of their parts. He got better with old age - remarkably poignant. Even though distant, the statues are as if alive, something he had an uncanny ability to do over and over again. But the sculpting of form itself, deep blacks juxtaposed again the brilliance of overpowering highlights, is about as poetically impressive as it gets in any visual medium. The compositional balance - incredible. Overall, a timeless image.

I wonder how much of that is Berenice Abbott's printing skills?

DREW WILEY · Sep 29, 2024

I saw at least one original print from that particular series in person. Of course, it wasn't in particularly good condition anymore; but the visual effect was still intact. Most of what one sees in Atget reproductions has been digitally cleaned up.

Not even Brett Weston's "Holland Canal" quite comes up to that level of impact, and Brett was a far better printmaker than Atget, one of the very best ever.

Pieter - Berenice Abbot and her generation probably couldn't clean up old mildewed, cracked prints well enough to make them look new. But maybe she had access to a certain prints or negs which weren't yet in as bad condition as they are today, and reproduced some of those. I did a fair amount of pre-digital restoration work, and it was a huge chore even using the then state of the art speciality films like Tech Pan, which Abbot didn't have access to. Even the best book on Atget's last imagery, Hambourg's "Ancien Regime" (Vol IV) left a lot of the age flaws intact, or copied and printed from cracked negative themselves if those happened to be in better condition. A lot of the original prints are seriously afflicted with mildew spotting. Current digital restoration techniques are certainly more successful.

But for charm and authenticity, there never will be a replacement for the real deal original prints, which are actually somewhat dull sheen, and not like looking at either a shiny coffee table book page or a backlit image on our screens.

Pieter12 · Sep 29, 2024

Berenice Abbott purchased something like half of the negatives from Atget’s estate. She promoted his work tremendously when she returned to the States, trying to get him into collections and museums. It is entirely possible he might have fallen into oblivion if not for her efforts.

CMoore · Sep 29, 2024

cliveh said:
Or this: -

View attachment 379721

It always struck me as "funny" how a scene like that is devoid of a single person.
There could have been humans all over the outside of the frame..... who knows.
Just something i always found interesting.

DREW WILEY · Sep 29, 2024

He made plenty of shots with people in them in earlier years. But even in many of the classic older pictures there are still abundant anthropomorphized roles. They're just made of marble; yet they seem alive in a manner mere statues don't. Maybe spooky; maybe profound metaphors. How he accomplished that certainly wasn't by accident. His pictures are a master class in composition.

Pieter12 · Sep 30, 2024

CMoore said:
It always struck me as "funny" how a scene like that is devoid of a single person.
There could have been humans all over the outside of the frame..... who knows.
Just something i always found interesting.

That’s Versailles. Could be before opening time.

DREW WILEY · Sep 30, 2024

Some of the other parks he routinely visited were relatively rundown, even overgrown, at the time. Like many of, he was trying to preserve something of the past in his shots, even while taking it to another level.

CMoore · Sep 30, 2024

Pieter12 said:
That’s Versailles. Could be before opening time.

Did they have "business hours" back then.?

Thanks for the info. I had no idea it was shot there, or how big that place actually is.
Do we have any members living there....... want to take a similar picture.?

Not sure how recent this is, but it is from their website
Is this the same location.......

cliveh · Sep 30, 2024

I think Atget was very much a photographer of zen practice without even knowing it. He adopted a very simple system of format size, materials and process. He would contact print his negatives and gold tone the prints. The ones that were not commissioned by the French government he would sell in the market place. He did this thousands of times over and over again. I would suggest this was devoid of thought, further than setting up his camera, framing and making the exposure.

This is where magic happens.

Pieter12 · Sep 30, 2024

CMoore said:
Did they have "business hours" back then.?

Thanks for the info. I had no idea it was shot there, or how big that place actually is.
Do we have any members living there....... want to take a similar picture.?

Not sure how recent this is, but it is from their website
Is this the same location.......

View attachment 379788

Apologies. I mistakenly identified the pool as Versailles, when it is actually the grounds at the palace of Saint-Cloud outside Paris, with a rather complicated history. At one time it was Louis XIV's brother's palace, later purchased by Louis XVI for Marie Antoinette. Napoleon also resided there later. The palace was destroyed during the war of 1870. The grounds are now (and probably during Atget's time) a park.

Pieter12 · Sep 30, 2024

cliveh said:
I think Atget was very much a photographer of zen practice without even knowing it. He adopted a very simple system of format size, materials and process. He would contact print his negatives and gold tone the prints. The ones that were not commissioned by the French government he would sell in the market place. He did this thousands of times over and over again. I would suggest this was devoid of thought, further than setting up his camera, framing and making the exposure.

This is where magic happens.

Atget was kind of a stock photographer of his day. His aim was to take photographs to sell to painters who could use them as reference material for backgrounds in their paintings.

DREW WILEY · Sep 30, 2024

CMoore - I've never seem an Atget of that "Chariot of Apollo" at Versailles. His most iconic reflecting pool shots were taken at St Cloud. Stunning Versailles "Chariot" prints have been made by Michael Kenna and especially Roman Loranc in recent years.

CMoore · Sep 30, 2024

Pieter12 said:
Apologies. I mistakenly identified the pool as Versailles, when it is actually the grounds at the palace of Saint-Cloud outside Paris, with a rather complicated history. At one time it was Louis XIV's brother's palace, later purchased by Louis XVI for Marie Antoinette. Napoleon also resided there later. The palace was destroyed during the war of 1870. The grounds are now (and probably during Atget's time) a park.

DREW WILEY said:
CMoore - I've never seem an Atget of that "Chariot of Apollo" at Versailles. His most iconic reflecting pool shots were taken at St Cloud. Stunning Versailles "Chariot" prints have been made by Michael Kenna and especially Roman Loranc in recent years.

Oh.....OK
I have no knowledge of those things.
Funny how similar and close they are to each other

Thank You both for the explanations

DREW WILEY · Sep 30, 2024

No need to apologize. I haven't been to either. And it is interesting how Atget gravitated toward the more run-down, and probably quieter, location. I would have too.

Alan Edward Klein · Sep 30, 2024

cliveh said:
I came across this picture the other day, which I thought was mind blowing. His sense of composition, tonal rendition and presence is just amazing. I could look at this for hours.

View attachment 158474

The statue and tree are too close to each other.

cliveh · Sep 30, 2024

Alan Edward Klein said:
The statue and tree are too close to each other.

Nice one

cliveh · Sep 30, 2024

Or this: -

Look at the separation between the box and the tree. This could have been a Cartier-Bresson picture.

Pieter12 · Sep 30, 2024

DREW WILEY said:
CMoore - I've never seem an Atget of that "Chariot of Apollo" at Versailles. His most iconic reflecting pool shots were taken at St Cloud. Stunning Versailles "Chariot" prints have been made by Michael Kenna and especially Roman Loranc in recent years.

Atget probably did not photograph at Versailles because the intended use of the photos was as a background for painters to use, and Versailles would probably be too familiar (so the painter already had sketches to work from) or the artist might not have wanted it to compete with his subject.

DREW WILEY · Sep 30, 2024

We know a few things about his intentions. He deeply resented the modernization of Paris which had occurred in the mid-1800's, and deliberately sought out corners and remnants of its past. How much of his antiquated gear had to do with that as well, as opposed to just rote habit, is hard to say. Just look at the marvelous use of flare in that image Cliveh just posted - it isn't accidental. The fading distances, so typical of his work, accentuates the feel of architectural aging itself, yet with a counterpoint of then-modern in the center foreground.

snusmumriken · Oct 1, 2024

Very interesting read, this thread.

I confess that overall I am not totally sure what I feel about Atget. Some of the (generally late) photos are to me wonderful, exquisite, haunting. Do I feel that primarily because of the obvious nostalgia? And if so is the nostalgia evident because Atget made us see it, or because of the passage of time? Sometimes I think he was a master of composing with blocks of shadow and blank skies; other times I just want to get the image into an editing package and straighten the horizon or crop off one unbalancing side.

Anyone else feel this ambivalence?

CMoore · Oct 1, 2024

snusmumriken said:
Anyone else feel this ambivalence?

Often i am conflicted by the same.

The passing of time is VERY Kind to a lot photography.

Vivian Maier
1970 Le Mans
Robert Klein
WW2
Steam locomotives
Etc etc etc

If Vivian was shooting now, would anybody care.?

Steam trains were ubiquitous, an everyday occurrence. Now they are very unique and fascinating.

1970 Le Mans was full of Iconic Cars. Today they mostly look the same.

There is a huge divide between a well Composed/Exposed photograph and one that anybody will give a zhit about

cliveh · Oct 1, 2024

snusmumriken said:
Very interesting read, this thread.

I confess that overall I am not totally sure what I feel about Atget. Some of the (generally late) photos are to me wonderful, exquisite, haunting. Do I feel that primarily because of the obvious nostalgia? And if so is the nostalgia evident because Atget made us see it, or because of the passage of time? Sometimes I think he was a master of composing with blocks of shadow and blank skies; other times I just want to get the image into an editing package and straighten the horizon or crop off one unbalancing side.

Anyone else feel this ambivalence?

As we walk and look at the world around us, we see glimpses of things that are static and/or people moving within our vision. Life moves on leaving you with little memory of a single image at an exact point in time. When you straighten the horizon or crop what you consider to be unbalancing, you are creating your own view of what you want other people to see and loosing the original composition which was perhaps closer to that impressionistic fraction in time and space. Atget puts you in that time and space.

Arthurwg · Oct 1, 2024

Pieter12 said:
That’s Versailles. Could be before opening time.

I was there last November. Millions of tourists. There's no such thing as off-season anymore

Arthurwg · Oct 1, 2024

GLS said:
I absolutely love Atget's work. I do however find it extremely difficult to articulate precisely why. I just know they affect me deeply.

I think that can be answered with one word: "Sensibility."

Eugene Atget Appreciation

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