Envelopes?

eclarke · Jul 11, 2007

Don't laugh at me. I always make 2 identical exposures of 4x5 when I photograph and it has always been a really good thing to have a backup. Unfortunately I have been having really good luck developing the first sheet this year and have about 100 holders sitting around with one sheet inside. I just don't have time to study the first negatives and make development decisions about the second ones and would like to store them, not in boxes but individually so I can attach my notes to each one. Does anybody know of a light-tight envelope I could use for this purpose??..Thanks..Evan Clarke

Nick Zentena · Jul 11, 2007

At some point won't the image start disappearing? You can't wait forever.

Why not use negative sleeves placed in a box ? This way the sleeve doesn't have to be light proof.4x5

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phaedrus · Jul 11, 2007

No idea how to solve your problem, but I must say I'm flabbergasted: You have 100 double darkslides sitting there half filled with exposed film and can still shoot more? Did you inherit the factory?

KenM · Jul 11, 2007

phaedrus said:
No idea how to solve your problem, but I must say I'm flabbergasted: You have 100 double darkslides sitting there half filled with exposed film and can still shoot more? Did you inherit the factory?

If you knew Evan, you wouldn't have even thought of asking that question

BWGirl · Jul 11, 2007

I don't know if this would harm the emulsion, but what about putting them in the black plastic bags that photo paper comes in? You should be able to cut an 8x10 bag in two (lengthwise... in half) and use black electrical tape to seal the end of and create the second bag. This way, you could use those avery labels to write your notes on & attach that to the bag. Hope this helps!

eclarke · Jul 11, 2007

BWGirl said:
I don't know if this would harm the emulsion, but what about putting them in the black plastic bags that photo paper comes in? You should be able to cut an 8x10 bag in two (lengthwise... in half) and use black electrical tape to seal the end of and create the second bag. This way, you could use those avery labels to write your notes on & attach that to the bag. Hope this helps!

I have about 100 of them and use removable gaffer's tape on the holder to make fairly detailed notes about the negative, so making my own would be a big chore. I may never develop the spares but they would be a fun project in the winter when I spend more time in the darkroom and make less exposures. I have tried a self sealing mailer but it leaked. The problem with storing all these in N+/- boxes is that you only need to shuffle them once and all the data is disorganized. I would like to be able to stick my notes on the individual package and then make comparisons between the first neg and the print to make a decision on really refining the second negative. In individual envelopes, they could be stored right along with the developed negative..organised. I wonder if professional labs have such containers??....Evan

eclarke · Jul 11, 2007

phaedrus said:
No idea how to solve your problem, but I must say I'm flabbergasted: You have 100 double darkslides sitting there half filled with exposed film and can still shoot more? Did you inherit the factory?

After a fashion A large department store chain, Kohl's is headquartered here in Milwaukee and when they quit doing film I was able to buy a bunch of new style Riteways for $8 a pair as well as some used ones. When the digital surge was happening i was also given quite a number of nice holders. I continue to purchase holders and probably have 160 of them and seem to never have enough. As far as the image lasting, I have developed negatives with 12-14 months on them and so far I have never had one fail for THAT reason:rolleyes: just for bad photograph..Evan

dferrie · Jul 11, 2007

I'm not sure if they are light tight as I've never thought of checking them, but in the electronics industry we use black anti-static bags (plastic) which come in various shapes and sizes. You could probably pick some up in Radio Shack or even online. The bags could be sealed as suggest by BWGirl. Just a thought, not sure if it will help.

David

eclarke · Jul 11, 2007

dferrie said:
I'm not sure if they are light tight as I've never thought of checking them, but in the electronics industry we use black anti-static bags (plastic) which come in various shapes and sizes. You could probably pick some up in Radio Shack or even online. The bags could be sealed as suggest by BWGirl. Just a thought, not sure if it will help.

David

Thanks for the suggestion, that's the kind of thing I am looking for, there must be a product. My scheme seems to be a crazy notion, but it's not. The workflow of it is very simple. With the gaffer's tape notes, I merely pull the tape from the holder and put it on the negative envelopes after I develop them. That's how I would do the undeveloped negs and their envelopes, the original notes stay with the sheet. For me this works better than a spreadsheet....Evan

rexp · Jul 11, 2007

Fold them into a piece of tinfoil, and use the "tape-with-notes" to tape the flaps shut.

eclarke · Jul 11, 2007

rexp said:
Fold them into a piece of tinfoil, and use the "tape-with-notes" to tape the flaps shut.

I thought of that and so far seems to be a pretty fair option. There are even sheets available for restaurant use. I just ordered 2 sizes of 70# black envelopes. I am going to place the neg in the smaller envelope and then place the smaller envelope into the larger, it should make a light trap (theory )..Thanks..Evan

pentaxuser · Jul 11, 2007

eclarke said:
After a fashion As far as the image lasting, I have developed negatives with 12-14 months on them and so far I have never had one fail for THAT reason:..Evan

Probably a redundant comment on my part but just as back-up to reinforce your point. I was given an Agfa Isolette I which had film in it by a friend. It had belonged to his deceased brother.

Negs were fine. We know from the people shots that my friend recognised that the film had been in the camera for over 25 years!

pentaxuser

Marc . · Jul 11, 2007

rexp said:
Fold them into a piece of tinfoil, and use the "tape-with-notes" to tape the flaps shut.

I would be careful with that option, and find it unsafe for long term.
I believe what you call tinfoil is aluminum. It is really thin and it oxydizes quickly with humidity, coming from condensation for example. That could make pinholes first and then real holes !
Anyway it is still a good option as an extra wrapper.

Marc

eclarke · Jul 11, 2007

Marc . said:
I would be careful with that option, and find it unsafe for long term.
I believe what you call tinfoil is aluminum. It is really thin and it oxydizes quickly with humidity, coming from condensation for example. That could make pinholes first and then real holes !
Anyway it is still a good option as an extra wrapper.

Marc

A chemical reaction was my concern with the aluminum. I think the black envelopes I found today may work and I can reuse them. I will have them ina couple days and do some tests and will report..Thanks..Evan

copake_ham · Jul 11, 2007

I think what you're seeking are lightproof mylar bags. If you ever added a memory board to your computer (or some other board) chances are it was packed in one of them.

I did a bit of googling and came up with:

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=mylar+++lightproof+++bag&btnG=Search

I'll let you do some poking around from there to see if you can find the right size and vendor etc. Note that lightproof mylar seems to have a valuable use to certain kinds of folk who are what we might call "urban gardeners"!

Marc . · Jul 11, 2007

eclarke said:
A chemical reaction was my concern with the aluminum....

Also, keep the negs dry, whatever they are stored in.
I read horror stories about LF pics taken during a damp summer, in a humid but otherwise fine region where I was born.
The guy kept the holders loaded with exposed film in a rather damp house during the whole summer, and when he processed them the gelatin had soaked up the humidity and the negs were ruined...

Marc

copake_ham · Jul 11, 2007

I did a little more refined search on google and found:

http://www.sorbentsystems.com/stockziplock.html

I have no connection with this company etc.

AgX · Jul 11, 2007

Those anti-static bags will be extra costly, with not much benefit. (Depending on how you manipulate those filled bags. I'm not sure whether the original photo bags are anti-static too.)

Try to trace black PE foil extruded to form a hose, flattened and rolled up. Just the base material for those bags. Cut the needed length, seal one end, insert the sheet in the darkroom in the bag, and still there, seal it with a household bag-welding apparatus. Using a sort of table attached to it with a stop at the right distance, you have the welding done at the right place with comfort.

If you can trace, or have traced bags of the apt size, weld them in the same manner, but don't use two bags.

dferrie · Jul 12, 2007

AgX said:
Those anti-static bags will be extra costly, with not much benefit.

One way to reduce the cost of buying the bags is to locate a local company involved in electronics manufacturing and I guess you will find they have a surplus of these bags. The company I work for only does a small amount of in-house manufacturing and we have built up a stock of the bags over time, which I have donated to a local technical college.

As I said, it's only a suggestion, one that occurred to me cause I had some of the bags sitting on my desk I'm sure there are less expensive options, but I couldn't think of them at the time.

David

eclarke · Jul 12, 2007

Thanks for the suggestions. I use some 3M anti static bags (clear) for my holders which I bought from a company specializing in overruns..2000 of them for about $50 US!!..Evan

Envelopes?

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