Emulsion Photo Contest

lee · Jun 13, 2005

Not to beat a dead horse but do we have a winner yet in the contest Emulsion Magazine is sponsoring? The rules say that the notification of the winners will be made on May 7th. That date has come and gone. Only word is that one judge would not take the time to send the prints to the next judge. Since I dont have a dog in this fight (not entered) I suppose my questions might be considered not pertinent. But inquiring minds want to know.

lee\c

Aggie · Jun 13, 2005

Lee I have kept especially the chat room aprised of what was happening. We don't know yet. In fact As far as I know it has stalled once again aiting for it to be transfered to the last Judge. Thursday I will spend the day in Monterey and get the damn thing finished. One thing I have learned about this, is not to put a specific time on the judging. For the 43 people who entered, this has turned into a nightmare for me.

Bob Carnie · Jun 13, 2005

Hi Aggie
As one of the 43 and probably the contest winner I will gladly wait until you sort out the contest. Do not even sweat it as these things do take their time.By the way will you be needing my picture for the magazine article on the winning photo's?
take your time
Bob

lee · Jun 13, 2005

thanks for the quick reply

lee\c

doughowk · Jun 13, 2005

It was suppose to be an easy way to raise money for the magazine, but it seems that nothing in life is as easy as you hoped. Sorry for all the problems; but, in the end, the 1st issue should be a moment of satisfaction & euphoria shared among your staff. We subscribers will enjoy the fruits of your efforts.

Dave Parker · Jun 13, 2005

Aggie said:
Lee I have kept especially the chat room aprised of what was happening. We don't know yet. In fact As far as I know it has stalled once again aiting for it to be transfered to the last Judge. Thursday I will spend the day in Monterey and get the damn thing finished. One thing I have learned about this, is not to put a specific time on the judging. For the 43 people who entered, this has turned into a nightmare for me.

It is unfortunate indeed that it has turned out to be a nightmare, I do wish you all the luck in the world Aggie, I have been there and done it, the magazine business is a tough one.

Dave

Aggie · Jun 13, 2005

Just got word the transfer was made this morning to the last judge, and he has no other pressing things, or a full time job to contend with. It could be like the Jackson trial,......any moment now!

Flotsam · Jun 13, 2005

Not Guilty on all counts!!!

gr82bart · Jun 13, 2005

Bob Carnie said:
As one of the 43 and probably the contest winner I will gladly wait until you sort out the contest.

Hey wait a sec...not fair. Have you seen the resources this guy has?

Art (Don't know why I'm whining, I didn't even enter! Or yet to subscribe to Emulsion either... )

geraldatwork · Jun 13, 2005

Maybe next year the magazine can have the submissions by CD's or slides. Many galleries and other contests are run this way. A lot of people are reluctant to send in their actual prints but will have no problem with the media. The amount of submissions will be much higher, probably 4 or 5 times as many, and would raise more money. One of the galleries where I am a member has a few contests for shows each year. The national contests where media is submitted receive a few hundred entrées. The one they they require actual prints gets a few dozen. When the winners are notified they are asked to send in the actual prints. Works very well. The director allows for the few prints they never receive. They give themselves plenty of lead time. He has been doing this for many years and has learned by his mistakes.

Sean · Jun 13, 2005

A lot of people are reluctant to send in their actual prints

This I don't get. Personally when I send any print for a contest I consider it something I'll never see again. I focus on the actual material costs when it comes to a contest, which is maybe $5.00, an acceptable loss in my book for the opportunity to enter a contest. I also usually print a few copies of any negative I'm working on anyway so have spares available. I can't get my head around sending off a print with the mindset of 'this print is worth $300 please when can I get it back?', to me it is 'this cost me $2-5 to make that print so do with it as you like'..

Dave Parker · Jun 13, 2005

Sean said:
This I don't get. Personally when I send any print for a contest I consider it something I'll never see again. I focus on the actual material costs when it comes to a contest, which is maybe $5.00, an acceptable loss in my book for the opportunity to enter a contest. I also usually print a few copies of any negative I'm working on anyway so have spares available. I can't get my head around sending off a print with the mindset of 'this print is worth $300 please when can I get it back?', to me it is 'this cost me $2-5 to make that print so do with it as you like'..

I have to agree 100% with you Sean, anytime I have entered a contest, the print is gone, probably never to be seen again, that is unless I win and see it hung or printed in the publication that I have submitted to...sometimes it seems as if we trip over dollars to save pennies.

Dave

gr82bart · Jun 13, 2005

geraldatwork said:
The national contests where media is submitted receive a few hundred entrées. The one they they require actual prints gets a few dozen.

Umm...not to get into a digital debate here, but Emulsion is specifically for traditional silver prints, so a CD wouldn't be in the interest of the magazine. From my understanding. Personally, I think by holding true to the concept and philosophy, Emulsion will produce a unique product, rather than following all the other lemmings.

Art.

geraldatwork · Jun 13, 2005

Many more people are reluctant to send in actual prints as can obviously be seen in the results. As I mentioned in my post above my gallery receives 4 or 5 times as many entrées when CD's or slides are required than when they ask for prints. Same gallery, similar contests, same internet advertising.

There was an emerging photographer contest in Brooklyn about a year ago where they received over 900 CD's.( At $25 each) And this was for a two week show. They were over a month late posting the results. The Emulsion contest only received 43 contestants. Here on a forum with over 6000 members (mostly all photographers) and not infrequently with over 500 people on at the same time. I think that speaks for itself. I'm not saying it is a better contest when CD's or slides are required. I honestly believe it makes for a better contest when the actual prints are viewed. Just that people are reluctant to send in their actual prints for whatever reason you want to believe.

I admittedly have difficulty making prints. I spent 8 hours a few days ago trying to duplicate two prints. After all of that time I was only happy with one of them. Maybe I am tooo fussy, maybe I'm not that good a printer. Maybe both. I don't know.

geraldatwork · Jun 13, 2005

gr82bart said:
Umm...not to get into a digital debate here, but Emulsion is specifically for traditional silver prints, so a CD wouldn't be in the interest of the magazine. From my understanding. Personally, I think by holding true to the concept and philosophy, Emulsion will produce a unique product, rather than following all the other lemmings.

Art.

Art,I totally agree. That is why I sent in my prints for the Emulsion Contest. I was just commenting on when actual prints are required the amount of entrees are significantly lower than when other media is asked for. You can come to your own conclusion if you want as to why.

Dave Parker · Jun 13, 2005

At the risk of compremising the ideals of the magazine, I would not accept entries into a contest for a magazine that is suspose to be all about silver based photography, I was very disenchanted when I saw B&W do this a couple of months ago, and even if it results in less entries, I think it is important to maintain the standards the magazine was founded on. I don't think it is fair to the people who dedicate their lives to traditional photography to run a contest that would accept digital entries.

Dave

Jorge · Jun 13, 2005

geraldatwork said:
Many more people are reluctant to send in actual prints as can obviously be seen in the results. As I mentioned in my post above my gallery receives 4 or 5 times as many entrées when CD's or slides are required than when they ask for prints. Same gallery, similar contests, same internet advertising.

There was an emerging photographer contest in Brooklyn about a year ago where they received over 900 CD's.( At $25 each) And this was for a two week show. They were over a month late posting the results. The Emulsion contest only received 43 contestants. Here on a forum with over 6000 members (mostly all photographers) and not infrequently with over 500 people on at the same time. I think that speaks for itself. I'm not saying it is a better contest when CD's or slides are required. I honestly believe it makes for a better contest when the actual prints are viewed. Just that people are reluctant to send in their actual prints for whatever reason you want to believe.

I admittedly have difficulty making prints. I spent 8 hours a few days ago trying to duplicate two prints. After all of that time I was only happy with one of them. Maybe I am tooo fussy, maybe I'm not that good a printer. Maybe both. I don't know.

Well, I dont know, but if it was a problem to judge 43 prints or however many there were, judging 900 CDs and requering that the judge views each CD on the computer seems to me an impossible task. I would not do it unless I was paid for my time.

I tend not to participate on contests where the prizes are camera equipment, I have all I need and whatever I need and dont have many a times is more specialized. I doubt many would have been enthused by a 165 wolly lens, which is what I wanted. I suspect many here are the same, they have the equipment they need and dont want to spend time making prints for the contest.

Of the 6000 members, I would venture about 200 are the most active, if 43 submitted prints, that is about 20% not a bad turn out. OTOH we have to realize that this contest was essentially for APUG members, hopefully once the magazine has a year of existence and is better known, I imagine many more people will participate. We also have to realize that Aggie had the misfortune of having that (/&%$)=/ from inked magazine announce a contest right at the same time, he essentially copied Aggie's idea and milked the APUG membership for all he could, I imagine this took away some participants from Aggie's magazine.

I have little contact with Aggie, but it seems to me she was left hanging by the judges, was given poor advice by whatever people are involved in this venture and to top it off her idea was stolen by another magazine that was all hype a no substance and ended up publishing an article in favor of digital photography. So why dont we all give her a break, uh? Trying to second guess and whine about something that is done with is a waste of time, she has explained, she has apologized, and has offered to return not only the photographs but the money as well, what else do you all want? So as MrCallow's signature says, nothing to see here, move on!

lets all look forward and wish her success, if she succeeds, we all do!

Claire Senft · Jun 13, 2005

Starting something new is filled with the unexpected and no one leaves you down like people. GIVE AGGIE THE BENEFIT OF THE DOUBT AND THEN SOME. PISSING, MOANING AND NIT PICKERING IS BEST LEFT TO THE DIGITALLY INCLINED. LETS BE APUGRACIOUS NOT APUGNACIOUS....AND THE HORSE YOU RODE IN ON!

Shmoo · Jun 14, 2005

I think that all around there are lessons to be learned...and Aggie has had her share. It's a fledgling operations folks. She's doing a darn fine job juggling a lot of responsibility...from getting articles written, finding an editor, getting a printer, getting a website built, managing a contest, etc....and oh yeah, taking care of health issues. So give the woman a break, will ya'? I'm sure that a lot of what has happened in getting this magazine hatched won't happen again...not if Aggie can help it!

Keep on truckin', Aggie.

S

lee · Jun 14, 2005

you guys seem to think I am giving Aggie a hard time when nothing could be farther from the truth. I asked a simple question. The internet isnt the best way to read answers and get the inflections the person intended. I want this magazine to succeed I really do.
And I am interested in who won the contest that is all.

lee\c

BWGirl · Jun 14, 2005

geraldatwork said:
Many more people are reluctant to send in actual prints as can obviously be seen in the results. As I mentioned in my post above my gallery receives 4 or 5 times as many entrées when CD's or slides are required than when they ask for prints. Same gallery, similar contests, same internet advertising.

....

I admittedly have difficulty making prints. I spent 8 hours a few days ago trying to duplicate two prints. After all of that time I was only happy with one of them. Maybe I am tooo fussy, maybe I'm not that good a printer. Maybe both. I don't know.

There are two separate issues you point out here.... the first is "why not do it the way everyone else does?" I guess, to which I would respond "Because Emulsion and the people this magazine represents are not like those others." I have to say that if I were judging this contest, I would want to see a physical print. Seeing a scan on my computer screen... I don't care how great a computer set-up you've got...just does not have the depth and dimensionality of an actual print.

For example... I've seen Lee's work both in the magazine & in person. Same with Les McLean's (also seen his in cyberspace). There is nothing, and I mean NOTHING that compares to seeing the actual prints. It's just light years different. So, Aggie was right to ask for actual prints.

The second point you raise may actually be why you raised the first point. I cannot tell you how to become a happier printer... ie, one whose struggles in the darkroom are few... but I can tell you that it can be done! Of course, you may or may not want this. I think there are many people content to never print... to either send prints to a pro shop, or scan negatives & print them. Everybody gets to make that choice!

Lee, I think the people here are not upset that you've asked... I think they are actually reacting more to what geraldatwork is saying...and the implications of digital submissions of artwork...

Many of us do not frequent the chatroom (or only rarely), so when there is news, and it's only presented in the chatroom, the rest of us remain "out of the loop". It doesn't mean we don't care about what's happening, it just means we don't get the info. So maybe an ocassional post about what's going on... an Emulsion update... would be grand! I'd love it! I am so looking forward to this magazine!

geraldatwork · Jun 14, 2005

Originally Posted by gr82bart
"Umm...not to get into a digital debate here, but Emulsion is specifically for traditional silver prints, so a CD wouldn't be in the interest of the magazine. From my understanding. Personally, I think by holding true to the concept and philosophy, Emulsion will produce a unique product, rather than following all the other lemmings."
Art.

Jeanette, I responded to the above post with my reply below. I guess you didn't see it.

"Art,I totally agree. That is why I sent in my prints for the Emulsion Contest. I was just commenting on when actual prints are required the amount of entrees are significantly lower than when other media is asked for. You can come to your own conclusion if you want as to why."

Again for an analog magazine or contest it I agree it makes more sense to see the actual prints. That is why I was excited about the contest and sent my prints in.

When I mentioned that by requiring the entrees be sent in by a CD or other media that there would be a lot more contestants I was just responding to what I perceived as disappointment in only 43 entrees were entered in the magazine contest. It was only to suggest an alternative to think about.

David A. Goldfarb · Jun 14, 2005

I'm not entered either, but I completely support the decision to ask for real prints for this contest. I think that makes the participants more self-selecting. Only those who are really committed and are printing regularly will submit. I don't think that getting more contributors in this case would really make it a better contest, and I agree with Jorge that 43 is a pretty good turnout.

I also think it's much easier to judge a stack of prints than to deal with digital images or a combination of formats (slides/prints/digital).

jovo · Jun 14, 2005

geraldatwork said:
When I mentioned that by requiring the entrees be sent in by a CD or other media that there would be a lot more contestants I was just responding to what I perceived as disappointment in only 43 entrees were entered in the magazine contest. It was only to suggest an alternative to think about.

A couple of years ago, PhotoTechniques Magazine held a black and white landscape photography contest. That magazine has national circulation and is well known (if not necessarily loved) by most serious amateur and professional photographers. Even so, and despite asking for entries in the most ubiquitous of subject areas, it was announced that there were only about 300 entries.

Considering that Emulsion magazine doesn't even exist yet, and has very few outlets for advertising the contest, 43 sounds like a pretty decent turnout to me.

Bob Carnie · Jun 14, 2005

I am totally suprised with the lack of entrys into this competition, I joined this group little over a year ago and I have to say 43 entrants is a pitiful # considering all the pontification that goes on here about members printing expertise.
I have started to join the blind exchange , the print share, and when aggie announced the magazines print competition I gladly sent in the maximum number of prints.( I have done this to actively support members initiatives. as well as Arts photo walk that was great fun)
Now I have put my foot into this court,by having the 5K print competition at my gallery next spring, and judging by the poor response for this one I am concerned , actually crapping my pants.
Regarding sending prints. For the life of me , is this not what we all do , and is this not what all the talk about densitometers, graphs, concoctions of chemistrys. If there are so many experts here why was this contest not supported with beautiful prints from around the world.( I know that I was happy with my prints and excited at the possible chance to be exhibited in Aggies first magazine.
I guess my beef is not with the people on this thread who may of entered but the thousands of members who did not.
Bloody hell , as Sean mentions 5-10 dollars and shipping /entry fee to support a very good intention , the members here that do all the expert pontification should have done less talking and made some prints to enter.
Just my canadian 2cents

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