unless you're Kodak
Or a chemist.
If the two have indeed been used interchangeably by others in the past then such practice is nonsensical, UNLESS the "100" part in 1:1:100 is explicitly defined as "made up to 100 with water", " total parts of the mixture" or similar wording.
If the "100" part in this example is defined as pure water then no, the two conventions 1:1:100 and 1+1+98 are absolutely NOT the same.
Having worked as a photo-chemist and later running an analysis laboratory I find 1:1:100 completely meaningless, we used 1:10, 1:100, 1:1000 etc standard solutions with our equipment and these were ratios. You can't have a double ratio.
It's simply a ratio of volumes of three separate ingredients; how is that meaningless?
Bringing dilution factors into the discussion (which I believe is what you are referring to) only adds another layer of potential (and needless) confusion.
I will illustrate the difference by giving you another typical real-world example, such as a working synthetic chemist uses every day. If a prep calls for the use of a 1:2 mixture of methanol:ethyl acetate, that ALWAYS refers to a ratio of the two different solvents, NOT a dilution factor of one into the other.
So, let's say for the sake of discussion we use 10 mL methanol and 20 mL ethyl acetate, making a mixture comprising 33% methanol by volume. If on the other hand we used 10 mL methanol and diluted it to 20 mL with ethyl acetate (i.e. adding 10 mL), we would have a mixture comprising 50% methanol by volume. These end results are totally different.
To reassure people that I'm not pulling this stuff out of thin air: I have two degrees in chemistry (including a PhD), and I work in the field of synthetic organic chemistry & medicinal chemistry for a living.
Keep it simple. In science we don't leave room for any ambiguity and you are arguing at cross purposes against yourself.
1 +1 made up to 100 is excavate the same as 1 +1 +98 however it's written and there's no ambiguity in that.
Ian
1:1:100 is exactly the same as 1 +1 +98 ie making up to 100 unless you're Kodak. Some companies used to put 1:10 (1+9) or 1:20 (1 +19) on their bottles for clarity. So you were agreeing with the poste before
Kodak use 1:3 to mean 1+3 = make up to 4 and is goes against the convention of the Dilution ratio that 1:3 means 1 part in a total of 3,
It's better to be clearer so I always say 1+1 to 100
And it is so much fun, we do it regularly!I'll sum up this thread- Only on Photrio........You guys are just blowing farts into the wind.
Dang it! A question even I could answer and when I find it, there's already 36 replies.
And it is so much fun, we do it regularly!
I guess they taught us math wrong in school. We were always told that if there were two boys and four girls, the ratio between the number of boys and girls would be 2:4 (1:2), never 2:6 (1:3).
You aren't "wrong".For some reason I have tended to think of 1:9 as 1 part in 9. e.g. 100ml developer concentrate + 800ml water. Whereas 1+9 would be 100ml dev. concentrate + 900ml water. I'm probably wrong...
Given the differences we are arguing about it does tend to suggest that when we use the shorthand of 1:10 we need to expand this so there is no confusion as I think Ian Grant was suggesting. Presumably unless the ratios are small such as 1:3/4 or maybe 1:10 maximum then it may not really matter how we interpret it
The way I see it, ':' is ambiguous whereas '+' is not.
I prefer to call it 1+99.I got a Pyrocat HD kit coming in for some sheet and roll film processing. I understand it calls for 1:1:100. So equal parts A & B to 100 parts water, ok. Wait. I don't get it.
Let's say I'm running 5 8x10 sheets in my Jobo Expert Drum. How many ML of A & B to how much water?
One can have an option but the scientific and mathematical definition of the colon vis a vis ratios is clear to those who paid attention to there teachers, instructors and professors.
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