Elementary question: Does it matter who develops the negatives?

ntenny · Apr 13, 2009

Hi everyone,

I don't shoot a lot of colour film; in particular, nowhere near enough to justify the overhead of doing my own processing. I have various local processing options for C-41, the convenient ones being rather ordinary drugstore labs and the like.

I know not to expect good prints from a cheap lab; that's fine. I can use bad prints (and scans) as rough proofs, and take the negatives to a pro lab if I turn up something that merits a nice print. What I'm wondering is, given that C-41 processing is theoretically standardised, can I safely assume that the *negatives* produced by a cheap lab will be all right?

Of course there's a somewhat elevated chance of an incompetent tech doing something really destructive, but let's assume that that doesn't happen. Stipulating that I get back negatives with recognisable images on them, that they haven't been immersed in mud or stomped on by a herd of cattle, should I expect them to be just as good as C-41 negatives developed anywhere else?

Thanks

-NT

srs5694 · Apr 13, 2009

In theory, and in an ideal world, yes. In practice, no. I've run across all sorts of problems with commercial processing, including:

Scratches (this is a biggie, especially with drug-store minilabs)
Fogging (a local Walgreens minilab manages to fog the first frame from of about half the rolls I've given to them)
Lost film (rare, but it does happen)
Negatives that fade with time (hard to make judgments about modern film and labs, but some family C-41 rolls from the 1970s are faded, whereas older C-22 negatives are fine)

There could also be problems with out-of-control processing -- machines running at the wrong temperature or time, chemicals pushed beyond capacity, etc. I honestly don't know how common such problems are with modern minilabs, pro labs, or larger commercial processors, but at the very least they could occur. If these problems do occur, you could get color crossover, incorrect contrast, poor image stability, or perhaps other problems.

FWIW, one reason I started doing my own C-41 was that I was seeing too many of these problems with the local and mail-order photofinishers I'd been using. I see problems with my own rolls, but at least I learn from my mistakes.

Anscojohn · Apr 13, 2009

Yes. It matters

David Brown · Apr 13, 2009

ntenny said:
given that C-41 processing is theoretically standardised,

I think "theoretically" is the operative word here ...

bob100684 · Apr 14, 2009

if the tech is maintaining the machine properly, you probably won't get scratched negs or ruined film b/c a gear snapped. If there is enough film throughput, the process will stay in balance as long as it was mixed properly in the first place, and no one contaminates anything. I've worked in drug stores, and stores that are steps up from drug stores, but shouldn't be considered pro labs. It all comes down to the staff. My first photofinishing job was at a drug store. The manager was extremely interested in photography, the machine was immaculate. Another more recent job, at something that would be considered a step up from a drug store, the machine was all sorts of messed up because people simply didn't care.

OldBikerPete · Apr 16, 2009

Poor performance of a 'professional' color lab in processing my 5x4 C41 negs was a primary reason for me moving to process my own. Uneven development, lots of fibres and particulates (dirt) on the negs from a lab. that was supposed to be the best. One shudders to think what to other labs would do.

Jeff L · Apr 16, 2009

I have found the big issue is scratches that sometimes run the entire length of the film. I don't know if it comes from the processing machine , scanner or neg cutter. I will ask them to check the rollers and not cut my negs. We'll see if that works. I stopped using a lab in a camera store because of dirty pressed onto the film from the rollers, as well as dust, lint and hair. I was told it was defective film! It's all up to the operator and if they care at all- alot don't.

ntenny · Apr 16, 2009

I have to say, the roll I got back from my local drugstore has done much to convince me that it matters! Ugh---little flecks and scratches all over the negatives. It's a shame, because they're shockingly well stocked with film---they've got Polaroid film, for pete's sake!---but I'm gonna have to turn elsewhere. Bother. I'll keep looking for someplace that runs their operation a little better.

-NT

Akki14 · Apr 16, 2009

Well I've had scratches and strange variance in development horizontally along 35mm negs, frames cut clearly down the middle by stupid low-paid staff, managers that complain at me for requesting they don't cut my negs but my camera doesn't evenly space frames so they take a day to do a 1hr print job... so that rules out all the local photo printers except for one. I now post almost all of my colour stuff off to either of two labs I've not had problems with, one in middlesborough, one in newcastle. Not sure why the good ones are 'oop North
I think you should test what you have available to you with a few rolls of "not important" stuff to find out what's good and what's not since the two labs I send to aren't strictly "pro" but they're a bit higher standard than the drug store variety of processors.

bob100684 · Apr 17, 2009

Shop around in your area. Pro labs are USUALLY the best option, but it really comes down to how much care the tech's are giving their machines, and how good attention they're paying to their control strips. Ask about control strips, try to talk photography with people. Printing, even on the highly automated minilabs used today is still somewhat of an art. Anyone can make a decent print, but people need to pay attention and know what they're doing to make a great one.

nicefor88 · May 3, 2009

Allow me to return the question to you (with a slight change).
If your film was a car, would the workshop you bring it to for service matter?
You got your answer!!

alanrockwood · May 3, 2009

On the other hand, pro labs sometimes make mistakes as well. I have only taken film to a pro lab a few times. Last time I did there were scratches on my conventional black and white negatives, probably from the lab, though it could have happened on my side.

By the way, there is no such thing as an error-free process. It all comes down to probabilities, which are largely dependent on whether the lab adheres to a proper standard operating procedure.

Ektagraphic · May 3, 2009

Yes it kind of matters who develops the negs. The place has to have fresh chemical, a clean machine and one that is running well and the temperature is well controled. Sometimes, your local pharamcy may do a good job at developing the negs. You have to try these places in order to really know.

bob100684 · May 4, 2009

alanrockwood said:
On the other hand, pro labs sometimes make mistakes as well. I have only taken film to a pro lab a few times. Last time I did there were scratches on my conventional black and white negatives, probably from the lab, though it could have happened on my side.

By the way, there is no such thing as an error-free process. It all comes down to probabilities, which are largely dependent on whether the lab adheres to a proper standard operating procedure.

does anyone else get a horrible attitude back from a pro lab when they complain about scratches/fingerprints/dust?

Elementary question: Does it matter who develops the negatives?

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