Eightbanners Chinese Pinhole Cameras?

nsurit · Jun 12, 2006

Other than eBay, does anyone have any ideas about how to get in touch with either the manufacturer or a distributor of this line of cameras? They are similar to the Zero Image cameras, of which I have both a 2000 and the 4X5. I've Googled and Dog Piled it and can't come up with an answer. Any ideas? Bill Barber

Paul Sorensen · Jun 12, 2006

Wow, those are some nice looking cameras. I ended up looking at all of their listings and sample photos and now I have to get one (acute GAS, it would appear).

Here is an email address from the eBay auctions: fotogadget.ebay@gmail.com. They also have a web site at fotogadget.com, but there isn't much there at this point. I did run across this page with a listing of current models and a couple of pictures of them:Dead Link Removed.

If you get one, post your impressions, I am really curious.

Greg_E · Jun 12, 2006

Those are nice looking cameras! You might try asking in the pinhole forums at http://www.f295.org , maybe someone can help you find them.

Greg_E · Jun 12, 2006

http://www.f295.org/Pinholeforum/forum/Blah.pl?m-1150135163/

The 120BB66 Sky looks kind of nice, I might have to look into that a little more.

Donald Qualls · Jun 12, 2006

Somewhere, they have a web site with example photos from different models; I've seen it and the images are very good indeed. Search on f295 for "chinese pinhole" and you'll likely find it. The actual pinholes they supply in the cameras seem a little small (0.2 mm), but it's hard to argue with the results.

Greg_E · Jun 12, 2006

Over all they have a very finished outside look, much better than my woodworking skills allow. I did send and email to the guy asking about unassembled kits, and also about a 35mm version.

Greg_E · Jun 12, 2006

Just checked my email and here ia what it said:

Hi Greg,

Thanks for your enquiry. I need to ask my supplier if he can supply me the "kits". For the 35mm one, I know that he has made a prototype some time ago, but never put into production. Recently I heard from him that he is considering picking it up again, but I guess this would be the plan of next year. This year 4 more models are coming, a metal 66 & a metal 612 in July, then a 8x10 and a ploaroid ones. I wonder if he has time / energy to pick up the 35mm again this year.

Regards,

Oliver

I replied that I would be interested in the kit and that the 35mm might be nice for the next World Wide Pinhole Day, since that film is easier for a lot of people to get developed.

reellis67 · Jun 12, 2006

Man, the metalwork on that 4x5 is really something. There is a lot to be said for hand craftsmanship in a camera like that.

- Randy

nsurit · Jun 12, 2006

Paul Sorensen said:
If you get one, post your impressions, I am really curious.

Paul, to say the least I am both curious and interested. I've expressed my interest to Oliver and I am assuming he is the distributor. If I didn't already have the Zero Image 2000, I'd be real tempted to buy one of his bamboo pinhole cameras.

If I am successful in obtaining one, I may just stop by the Denver Darkroom and let you take a look at it or perhaps even run a roll of film through it. Although I'm in the Houston area, I have a daughter in Golden and visit her family often. Given that she is having a baby in December, I imagine I'll be up there a bit more than usual over the next year or so. Bill Barber

Paul Sorensen · Jun 12, 2006

nsurit said:
Paul, to say the least I am both curious and interested. I've expressed my interest to Oliver and I am assuming he is the distributor. If I didn't already have the Zero Image 2000, I'd be real tempted to buy one of his bamboo pinhole cameras.

If I am successful in obtaining one, I may just stop by the Denver Darkroom and let you take a look at it or perhaps even run a roll of film through it. Although I'm in the Houston area, I have a daughter in Golden and visit her family often. Given that she is having a baby in December, I imagine I'll be up there a bit more than usual over the next year or so. Bill Barber

Awesome Bill, let me know when you are in town, whether or not you get the camera.

Paul.

CarlRadford · Jun 13, 2006

A work of Art!

Certainly not cheaper than a zero of which I have two - both great cameras - but have a look at this: http://mottweilerstudio.com/index.html I had the pleasure of seeing an early prototype owned by Russell Young - stunning!

Carl

Greg_E · Jun 13, 2006

I bet that camera is not cheap, beautiful looking device, and the pictures were very sharp.

Greg_E · Jun 17, 2006

Dead Link Removed is now up for those people looking to buy their cameras. They have prices, but I'm not sure exactly how you are supposed to purchase things. I'd like to get one of their "shutter" units, and maybe the pinhole package (under accessories).

nsurit · Jun 28, 2006

The "Dragon" has been shipped and should be here in a few days. I'lll keep folks posted on how it is going. Bill Barber

Jim Noel · Jun 28, 2006

Bill,

Please let us also know the cost including shipping.

Greg_E · Jun 28, 2006

You were able to get one of those? You must be lucky! The sample pictures from the Dragon are incredibly sharp for a pinhole camera. I'm waiting for some pinholes and a shutter from them for a camera I'm making, they should be here soon too. I'm still somewhat tempted to buy a Sky 6x6, but I'm torn between the beautiful wood camera, and making something like it myself. I guess it depends on the results I get with my first home built machine.

Until they get their shopping cart set up, you just need to email them. He sent me a Paypal invoice and we were off and running. Shipping for the "T" shutter and pinholes was only $4, and he even cut me a deal on the shutter!

magic823 · Jun 30, 2006

I just ordered one of these myself. Can't wait to play with it!

Steve

P.S. the price with shipping is $208US

Micahel · Jun 30, 2006

Don't be fool by the Chinese!

Hi all pinhole fans,
It's not good for me to say anything about this chinese company here but finally I decided to post my message here to let you all know more about it.

I am a zero user and I contact Zeroimage about the ebay listing when I saw the first post here. I was told that all the ebay listings by the HK seller Mr. Chan Wa Sang already removed by ebay because of copyright infringement after zeroimage complain to ebay. They also told me that they have take legal action to this Hong Kong people and also the 8banners in China. They set up a chinese web site for it but didn't mentioned it in their English site. If you can read Chinese, visit
Dead Link Removed. They show the legal letters.

Someone who post most messages about the 8 banners camera here, knowing very well with the camera, post their web site, the last registred member, pretended want to buy item from them, may be a saleman with a nick name or actually he is Mr. Chan from the Hong Kong trying to sell their camera here because they can't sell the camera on ebay anymore. Any forum is good for them to promote the cameras. they are tricky. The only copy Ferrari is found in China! US lost a lot of money everyyear because of the copies: software, movie, watch, camera.....and our goverment is now forcing them to control it.

That's all I know about this camera and hope it is useful to you all.

Good Luck!

Miachel

Greg_E · Jul 1, 2006

Micahel said:
Someone who post most messages about the 8 banners camera here, knowing very well with the camera, post their web site, the last registred member, pretended want to buy item from them, may be a saleman with a nick name or actually he is Mr. Chan from the Hong Kong trying to sell their camera here because they can't sell the camera on ebay anymore.

Just exactly who are you attacking here? If you are attacking me, you better get your facts completely straight before you accuse me of anything!

Amund · Jul 1, 2006

Micahel said:
Hi all pinhole fans,
It's not good for me to say anything about this chinese company here but finally I decided to post my message here to let you all know more about it.

I am a zero user and I contact Zeroimage about the ebay listing when I saw the first post here. I was told that all the ebay listings by the HK seller Mr. Chan Wa Sang already removed by ebay because of copyright infringement after zeroimage complain to ebay. They also told me that they have take legal action to this Hong Kong people and also the 8banners in China. They set up a chinese web site for it but didn't mentioned it in their English site. If you can read Chinese, visit
Dead Link Removed. They show the legal letters.

Someone who post most messages about the 8 banners camera here, knowing very well with the camera, post their web site, the last registred member, pretended want to buy item from them, may be a saleman with a nick name or actually he is Mr. Chan from the Hong Kong trying to sell their camera here because they can't sell the camera on ebay anymore. Any forum is good for them to promote the cameras. they are tricky. The only copy Ferrari is found in China! US lost a lot of money everyyear because of the copies: software, movie, watch, camera.....and our goverment is now forcing them to control it.

That's all I know about this camera and hope it is useful to you all.

Good Luck!

Miachel

The pinholecameras in question doesn`t look or operate as the Zero Image cameras as far as I can see, so how could there be copyright infringement here? Your post is pure BS, IMO...

Greg_E · Jul 1, 2006

But they both use film, and they both use a pinhole, and they are both made out of wood, and they both use brass pieces. By that logic they must be exactly the same. I'll have to check and see if something as basic as a pinhole camera can even be patented in the USA, and if so who already owns that patent. With the age if the technology of a pinhole camera, I would almost bet money on it being considered "too basic" to receive a US patent. Doesn't Kodak own the patents for the 120 format films that both of these cameras use?

And checking back through this thread, it is clear that I'm the one being accused of being Mr. Chan. I would go through and prove that I am indeed someone else, but I just can't be bothered to prove this to someone who most likely benefits from the sale of the Zero cameras. I'll tell your straight out, I'm more than a little angry about being accused, and companies that make me angry usually see a loss of profits in a very short amount of time. I'll be digging through the US patent office this weekend to see if there are any violations made by any Zero products, I bet I find at least one!

If you really are just a simple customer of the Zero products, you have now done them a huge disservice!

nsurit · Jul 1, 2006

Amund said:
The pinholecameras in question doesn`t look or operate as the Zero Image cameras as far as I can see, so how could there be copyright infringement here? Your post is pure BS, IMO...

r assessment.

As an owner of both a Zero Image 2000 and Zero Image 4X5, I would agree with your assessment.

The technology, as applied to photography, spans three centuries, so I would assume the concept of pinhole cameras is pretty safe from patent and copyright infringement. Camera are but boxes with sensitized material on one side and a means for light to enter on the other. They all work that way. Here again, seems pretty safe from both copyright and patent problems.

I look forward to getting my 8 Banners "Dragon" with its 6 X 18 format, spirit level, optical viewfinder and curved film plane, features which are missing from Zero Images line up of cameras. When I look at their 4 X 5 offerings, as well as their others, each seems to be pretty different from the Zero Image line up. Notice, please, that I said different rather than better. I love my Zero Image cameras and look forward to adding the 8Banners 618 to my stable of tools.

It would appear that where Zero Image had a reasonable claim was with their exposure calculator on the back of the 2000. The one originally used with the 8Banners looked almost exactly like (read that as copied from) the Zero Image camera. 8Banners has now changed that and substituted an etched scale, which may or may not be as efficient as the Zero calculator. I might add that my experience with the Zero calculator on the 2000 is that it is hard to read. I've just purchased a Black Ct exposure guide and hope it will be a little easier on my eyes.

Lets let the manufacturers fight this one out, while we use their tools to create our images. Bill Barber

Greg_E · Jul 1, 2006

nsurit said:
I've just purchased a Black Ct exposure guide and hope it will be a little easier on my eyes.

Are you aware of the program called Pinhole Designer? It has an exposure calculator that you might find useful, even takes reciprocity into consideration for a few films. http://www.pinhole.cz/en/pinholedesigner/ gives you a table for your film (if supported) that you can print and use in the field.

StephenS · Jul 2, 2006

I have been using an 8 Banner for several weeks

I ordered an 8 Banner from eBay and have been using it several weeks now. Let me add I also own a Zero Image 4x5 and Zero 2000 zone plate version. The Zero cameras are wonderful, no doubt about it. But the 8 Banner is very nice too - mostly because of the excellent shutter. This lets me add zone plates that I make myself. Also, you can easily switch between 6x6 and 6x4.5 with the 8 Banner.

You can see a few photos taken with the 8 Banner and DIY zone plates on my site www.silverbasedstories.com. Go to 'work' and look under the section about zone plates and the gallery of figures above that one. You'll also see stuff taken with the Zero, but they aren't labeled. Feel free to ask what's what.

I think the 8 Banner is different in many ways from the Zero. To be honest, the Zero is more of a work of art in terms of craftsmanship but the 8 Banner seems more of a workhorse and the shutter is great. I'm happy to own both and will continue to buy from both of these manufacturers. I hope they can live in peace because I love the products!

Stephen

PS - I'm new to APUG and didn't even know it existed until today. Looks like a good place!

Dave Wooten · Jul 2, 2006

Welcome Stephen S.

Good to see you here Stephen! Very nice web site btw! Impressive work.

Dave in Vegas

Eightbanners Chinese Pinhole Cameras?

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