Dust free negatives.

mporter012 · Dec 27, 2014

I know this subject has been brought up many time on here, and I've asked questions before about the process of getting cleaner negatives several times. I've become increasingly meticulous about my development process and I'm building a tent to hang negatives in to avoid any dust accumulation on negatives. I've recently been pondering what else could be causing the scratches and dust i'm seeing on my negatives and I've been thinking that the plastic negative sleeves may be the culprit.

After my negatives are dry, I cut them and place in the plastic sleeves and then put them in a 3 ring binder. Dust collects inside the sleeves and around the edges of the sleeves, and my current theory is that this is the issue. Maybe I should just cut the negatives and put them in a plastic holder that entirely closes off Or in a ziplock?

Mark

tkamiya · Dec 27, 2014

One thing I've noticed is that film appears to and feels to touch, DRY after few hours. But they aren't. If I cut them up and sleeve them right away, they scratch on their way in. If I wait overnight then do the same, less scratch.

I have come to realization that dust free negative isn't possible. All I can do is minimize them. Even then, there is limitation. There are type of sleeves where you don't put them by sliding them in length wise. Dead Link Removed These are side loading.

I use something similar to these when I expect to handle that particular negatives often.

gone · Dec 27, 2014

I never have these problems. When I lived in New Mexico, dust was a nightmare. Here in Florida, nada. Surely it's the humidity. I take the negs out of the photo flo, whip them a few times to get excess water off, hang them to dry in the bathroom, and cut and sleeve them in the usual 3 ring binder like most everyone else. I do use a hardener w/ my fixer. Not sure if that makes any difference w/ dust, but it may be helping w/ the scratches, or lack thereof. Anyway, try and increase the humidity in your working area, and use a hardener w/ the fixer is all I know to recommend. You may also have a lot of static electricity where you're working, and the negs get charged and attract dust.

Hatchetman · Dec 27, 2014

I always let the negs dry at least 24 before sleeving them. I never get scratches, but dust is another thing...

Christopher Walrath · Dec 27, 2014

I have no way to control dust in my house. I am the Dust King. I could sell it by the truck load.

But I do not have problems with dust on negs and prints. I do my best to reduce air movement of any kind and that always seems to do the trick. I tried once, when I was just starting out with darkroom work, to turn on the exhaust fan in the upstairs bath, thinking it would aid in drying. Yeah, it dried every speck of dust to two rolls. So now I use a wetting agent and let things hang for the better part of a 24 hour day. As for scratches, it may be the way I insert my cut neg strips into the sleeves but I have never had issues there either.

Not to say you're doing it wrong, I don't know of a RIGHT way to do it. All I can say is take extra care. And since you are posting this I assume you are so there we are. I suppose.

Sirius Glass · Dec 28, 2014

Hatchetman said:
I always let the negs dry at least 24 before sleeving them. I never get scratches, but dust is another thing...

I wait at least 24 hours. Dust in not a problem for me, I use DustOff!

ic-racer · Dec 28, 2014

Any dust that collects on the negatives after they are dry should be able to be removed with a brush or compressed gas.

cliveh · Dec 28, 2014

mporter012 said:
I've recently been pondering what else could be causing the scratches and dust i'm seeing on my negatives and I've been thinking that the plastic negative sleeves may be the culprit.

After my negatives are dry, I cut them and place in the plastic sleeves and then put them in a 3 ring binder. Dust collects inside the sleeves and around the edges of the sleeves, and my current theory is that this is the issue. Maybe I should just cut the negatives and put them in a plastic holder that entirely closes off Or in a ziplock?

Mark

If you switch to using translucent non-plastic negative sleeves, you will find it will help a lot. Plastic see through sleeves generate static and are a pain. Scratches are something quite different and you need to look at your MO to solve that one.

mikew78 · Dec 28, 2014

mporter012 said:
I know this subject has been brought up many time on here, and I've asked questions before about the process of getting cleaner negatives several times. I've become increasingly meticulous about my development process and I'm building a tent to hang negatives in to avoid any dust accumulation on negatives. I've recently been pondering what else could be causing the scratches and dust i'm seeing on my negatives and I've been thinking that the plastic negative sleeves may be the culprit.

After my negatives are dry, I cut them and place in the plastic sleeves and then put them in a 3 ring binder. Dust collects inside the sleeves and around the edges of the sleeves, and my current theory is that this is the issue. Maybe I should just cut the negatives and put them in a plastic holder that entirely closes off Or in a ziplock?

Mark

Are the scratches that you're find affecting your prints? (Sorry if I missed that.)

Avoiding plastic sleeves all together is problematic. Pretty much any plastic you use will create static and attract dust. If you use an air purifier and a humidifier, that will help with static and dust accumulation (they'll keep help limit dust in the air) but scratching would be a function of moving negs in and out of the sleeves. So for scratches you might try using a sleeve size/format larger.

Roger Cole · Dec 28, 2014

I don't have too much of a problem with dust on negatives. I do get very light longitudinal scratches on the base side of 35mm and roll film negs sometimes that do not print at all (so I don't really care.)

Dust on sheet film during exposure is another matter, can't be easily spotted out and can be enough to make me tear my hair out, if I still had hair.

Sent from my iPhone via Tapatalk using 100% recycled electrons. Because I care.

AgX · Dec 28, 2014

Parchment paper sleeves are a alternative to plastic sleeves and envelopes.

MartinP · Dec 28, 2014

If the negs are clean when they go into the sleeves, try not storing the sleeves in a binder in a dusty location? Put the sleeves in an archive box (the acid-free, adhesive-free archival boxes used for valuable documents, for example) instead of an open binder. When the box is closed, no dust gets in.

Plastic (some plastics anyway) sleeves are more archival than the traditional paper sleeves, but in a storage archive location the air would be dustfree as well as at a perfect temperature and humidity - so suitable paper neg sleeves/envelopes might be a good compromise to avoid attracting dust when outside the boxes...

GRHazelton · Dec 28, 2014

I've been giving my dried negatives a quick swipe with Edwal Film Cleaner before sleeving them. Seems to help; I hope so since the "magic potion" is about $30 for 4 ounces! :w00t: Ouch! I also scored a Kinetronics electric film cleaner. It was apparently made for a mini-lab printer since it has Fuji on it. Uses high voltage to neutralize static charge, and then fine brushes and a tiny fan to remove the dust. At least I think that's how it works.

Peltigera · Dec 28, 2014

I suspect the real problem is living in Chicago. Large cities are dusty places - if the dust is collecting in the sleeves, I doubt there is much you can do short of moving to a rural location.

Having said that, plastic does generate static electricity which will attract dust and I would echo the thought that the film needs longer than you would think to properly dry.

moltogordo · Dec 28, 2014

Christopher Walrath said:
Not to say you're doing it wrong, I don't know of a RIGHT way to do it. All I can say is take extra care. . . . . . .

I'm with Mr. Walrath . . . . be as meticulous as possible. I do the 24 hour thing before sleeving, too.

And if you're a printer, like I am, it's best to become familiar with basic retouching.

Sirius Glass · Dec 28, 2014

Sirius Glass said:
I wait at least 24 hours. Dust in not a problem for me, I use DustOff!

I store them in archival negative Print File pages.

mauro35 · Dec 29, 2014

I never wait 24 hours before sleeving my negatives. Maybe I should try that. But I used to have serious dust problems, especially in the winter, here in Finland gets really dry and static charges accumulate easily. The only thing that seemed to help was to give up plastic sleeves altogether. I now only use glassine sleeves.

Lamar · Dec 30, 2014

Regarding 135 B&W film dust reduction I have found this works best for me: For the last step I put the film in Photo-Flo mixed 3 ml to 1 liter of distilled water for about 1 minute. I make sure I have washed my hands well before removing the film but I do not dry my hands, this seems to reduce the foreign material after I finger wipe the film. I pull the film out of the tank and wipe once and only one with my fingers. I then just hang to dry. For me this has proven to produce the best negatives regarding dust specs, scratches, and drying stains. Although I do get some of each problem there is just less with this single finger wipe method. I found that if I do a finger wipe more than once I start getting more of the little dust specs. I think this is probably dead skin or some foreign material that comes off my fingers more so during any subsequent wipes as the film is tackier.

Neal · Dec 30, 2014

Dear Mark,

I use these clamshell binders. They collect dust on the outside but it stays there. It will hold a sheet of 7 strips, 6 images long.

Good luck,

Neal Wydra

GarageBoy · Jan 2, 2015

I sleeve with in 4 hours- Should I wait longer? I fear dust collecting the longer it sits out in the air

OptiKen · Jan 2, 2015

Michael R 1974 said:
I prefer to use fold lock-type sleeves rather than anything requiring any sliding action. Reduces the chance of getting tiny scratches which could cause printing problems (particularly with small format negatives) even if they aren't easily visible by eye on the negative. You might also prefer a material such as glassine. I always found those types of filing pages attracted less dust than plastic stuff like Print File pages but who knows.

Where do you find fold lock-type sleeves?

mporter012 · Jan 2, 2015

Neal said:
Dear Mark,

I use these clamshell binders. They collect dust on the outside but it stays there.

Something like this Neal? http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/con...d8x4p98-Ky3XGOxoC_tLw_wcB&Q=&is=REG&A=details

mporter012 · Jan 2, 2015

Thanks for all the advice. Has anyone hung their negatives in a plastic garment bag before? I'm reading this as one potential option.

Richard S. (rich815) · Jan 2, 2015

mporter012 said:
Thanks for all the advice. Has anyone hung their negatives in a plastic garment bag before? I'm reading this as one potential option.

I did. For me did not help much. I bought a long shower curtain rod and hung that over the middle of the tub and hang the negs from that inside the bath/shower area with the glass shower doors and the main bathroom door closed. While the films are on their final rinse I run the shower at hot for a few minutes to steam up the room and hopefully moisten any dust in the air to drop to the floor, then turn off the shower and hang the negs. Makes it a bit humid which makes drying time a little longer but helps keep dust off while drying.

cliveh · Jan 2, 2015

I sometimes wonder that worrying about dust and making an effort to get rid of it adds to the problem. When you displace dust with sprayed air, that air has to be displaced with other air, which perhaps carries more dust.

Dust free negatives.

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