Do I give up on C-41 in my PhotoTherm?

GDI · Sep 13, 2008

I read all the posts here (including MikeSeb's) and I can't figure out what to do about C-41 developer in my Phototherm.

The problem is that I can only buy the one shot developer in a case of 12, and that is a lot of developer. Does anyone know exactly what I can use as a substitute? I am not sure I can turn the Developer/Replenisher/Starter combo into an equivalent one shot, straight developer.

Any help would be appreciated! I will try to call Phototherm, but I'd like to see if anyone here has blazed a trail.

Thanks
Gary

Ian Grant · Sep 13, 2008

C41 is so easy.

What on earth are you thinking of doing. You've not said what chemistry you're thinking of buying.

Ian

MikeSeb · Sep 13, 2008

Gary, "mikeseb" here. I feel your pain, brother. Actually "doing" C41 is a breeze compared with procuring the stuff in economically rational quantities. Developer is the main issue.

I finally went with--because it's the least bad alternative--the the developer/starter and developer/replenisher, purchased from Adorama (in the US). Alas, Kodak evidently doesn't offer the one-shot no-starter developer in the 2L or 1 gal sizes anymore; I'd be willing to buy 12 of those if I could find them. The bleach and fixer are no problem since they seem to last forever; and since I've adopted the flexicolor fixer as my universal fixer for everything, I bought 25 gal of the stuff at B&H and had it shipped for free as a perk of NAPP membership. Cheapest fixer you can get, works great for B&W or C41.

It's confusing to figure out what to get; and even if you can find it--like at B&H--many vendors won't ship it. I am resigned to mixing small volumes from the concentrates with a syringe to try to extend the solutions' life.

Same issues with E-6; I recently bought a 5L E-6 kit to process my last remaining E-6 rolls--cheaper than sending them out.

epatsellis · Sep 13, 2008

Gary, I use the 5 gal Flexicolor developer with starter, inexpensive and works well in my W-L Pro 6. You can mix as little or as much as you want, the Kodak Pub. Z-131 covers the quantities of each part needed.

GDI · Sep 13, 2008

Ian Grant said:
C41 is so easy.

What on earth are you thinking of doing. You've not said what chemistry you're thinking of buying.

Ian

I'm thinking of developing some film!:rolleyes:

I should have stated that I I looking for a replacement for the Kodak 1 shot developer!

epatsellis · Sep 13, 2008

what part of the world are you in? Adorama and Calumet both ship C41 chemistry, if you're in the US, if not, I can give you the Kodak catalog #s for both the LORR and regular developers and starters if you need them.

GDI · Sep 13, 2008

MikeSeb said:
Gary, "mikeseb" here. I feel your pain, brother. Actually "doing" C41 is a breeze compared with procuring the stuff in economically rational quantities. Developer is the main issue.

I finally went with--because it's the least bad alternative--the the developer/starter and developer/replenisher, purchased from Adorama (in the US). Alas, Kodak evidently doesn't offer the one-shot no-starter developer in the 2L or 1 gal sizes anymore; I'd be willing to buy 12 of those if I could find them. The bleach and fixer are no problem since they seem to last forever; and since I've adopted the flexicolor fixer as my universal fixer for everything, I bought 25 gal of the stuff at B&H and had it shipped for free as a perk of NAPP membership. Cheapest fixer you can get, works great for B&W or C41.

It's confusing to figure out what to get; and even if you can find it--like at B&H--many vendors won't ship it. I am resigned to mixing small volumes from the concentrates with a syringe to try to extend the solutions' life.

Same issues with E-6; I recently bought a 5L E-6 kit to process my last remaining E-6 rolls--cheaper than sending them out.

Thanks Mike - I have done a few batches and it really is a piece of cake, and quick too. I've done a lot of E-6 and my local shop carries the kits. I may go ahead and have them get me a case, but may I try the starter developer first. How were your results? Same as with the straight developer?

Erie - I may see if I can get a small quantity to test, I'll review the Z-131.

Thanks again..

epatsellis · Sep 13, 2008

Gary,
I have a complete Z131 with all the ancillary and related info at Dead Link Removed , has everything you need in it.

GDI · Sep 13, 2008

epatsellis said:
Gary,
I have a complete Z131 with all the ancillary and related info at Dead Link Removed , has everything you need in it.

Got it thanks!

srs5694 · Sep 13, 2008

Depending on how much film you shoot and what your options are for raw chemicals, you may find it significantly more economical and/or reliable to mix your own C-41 developer from scratch. Several formulas are available on the Web, although some work better than others. I use this one, which I'm told isn't the closest to Kodak's formula, but it works well enough for me. I don't have other URLs handy at the moment, but I do have them, so ask if you want them. FWIW, I mix mine at 4x concentration (that is, I make 250ml from the instructions for 1l of solution). This helps it last longer, but of course I've got to dilute it 1+3 for use.

You'll need to obtain supplies from Photographer's Formulary, Art Craft, or some other supplier. (Both of these are in the US. I'm not sure of non-US suppliers for the necessary ingredients.

The last time I checked the numbers, home-brewed C-41 developer was about half the cost of Kodak's C-41 developer. That was before Kodak's latest dropping of smaller-quantity packages. If you develop a lot of film, of course, buying in large quantities may make more sense than mixing it yourself; but if you develop relatively little film, the big packages will go bad before you can use them, and the third-party stuff that's still available in small quantities all seems to come with blix rather than separate bleach and fixer, and it's more expensive on a per-liter basis to boot.

Bleach seems to be cheaper when bought ready-made, so there's little point in mixing that yourself. C-41 fixer can be a little less expensive when mixed yourself, IIRC, but not by much. As others have said, both of these items last longer than the developer, so buying in larger quantities isn't so awful.

alanrockwood · Sep 17, 2008

Gary,

One idea suggested in the Phototherm manual is to use "overflow solutions" e.g. from a minilab. If the lab is working right these will be at the right stage for one-shot development.

Of course, this all assumes that you can find a cooperating minilab that will supply you with some solution.

Alan

pelerin · Sep 17, 2008

MikeSeb said:
Gary, "mikeseb" here. I feel your pain, brother. Actually "doing" C41 is a breeze compared with procuring the stuff in economically rational quantities. Developer is the main issue.

I finally went with--because it's the least bad alternative--the the developer/starter and developer/replenisher, purchased from Adorama (in the US). Alas, Kodak evidently doesn't offer the one-shot no-starter developer in the 2L or 1 gal sizes anymore; I'd be willing to buy 12 of those if I could find them. The bleach and fixer are no problem since they seem to last forever; and since I've adopted the flexicolor fixer as my universal fixer for everything, I bought 25 gal of the stuff at B&H and had it shipped for free as a perk of NAPP membership. Cheapest fixer you can get, works great for B&W or C41.

It's confusing to figure out what to get; and even if you can find it--like at B&H--many vendors won't ship it. I am resigned to mixing small volumes from the concentrates with a syringe to try to extend the solutions' life.

Same issues with E-6; I recently bought a 5L E-6 kit to process my last remaining E-6 rolls--cheaper than sending them out.

Hi,
Per Kodak professional, the replacement for the 1 gallon c41 (the no-starter kit for small users) is c41 sm tank developer (175 6337). That sku is a 2 liter mix. I don't have a Kodak catalog in front of me but I'm sure that if you are willing to buy up to twelve that you would have enough units to make the min/mult for an order. If that is the case you wouldn't need to get it shipped, just get a local Kodak dealer to order it for you. I would offer to help but it would be long trip out to California to pick it up. As an alternative, Tetenal makes c41 kits (e.g., 1 & 5 l) that are shippable.
Celac

GDI · Sep 17, 2008

pelerin said:
Hi,
Per Kodak professional, the replacement for the 1 gallon c41 (the no-starter kit for small users) is c41 sm tank developer (175 6337). That sku is a 2 liter mix. I don't have a Kodak catalog in front of me but I'm sure that if you are willing to buy up to twelve that you would have enough units to make the min/mult for an order. If that is the case you wouldn't need to get it shipped, just get a local Kodak dealer to order it for you. I would offer to help but it would be long trip out to California to pick it up. As an alternative, Tetenal makes c41 kits (e.g., 1 & 5 l) that are shippable.
Celac

Thanks Pelerin, now if I can find someone reliable who will ship it. Any recommendations?

pelerin · Sep 17, 2008

GDI said:
Thanks Pelerin, now if I can find someone reliable who will ship it. Any recommendations?

Hi,
I think shipping will be a problem as with most color stuff from Kodak. I will check re-shipper requirements tomorrow. Where are you located?
Celac

GDI · Sep 18, 2008

pelerin said:
Hi,
I think shipping will be a problem as with most color stuff from Kodak. I will check re-shipper requirements tomorrow. Where are you located?
Celac

I am in Connecticut...

pelerin · Sep 23, 2008

GDI said:
I am in Connecticut...

Hi,
I have a solution. Drop me a PM if you are still interested.
Celac

GDI · Sep 25, 2008

pelerin said:
Hi,
I have a solution. Drop me a PM if you are still interested.
Celac

Thanks, I sent a PM.

Do I give up on C-41 in my PhotoTherm?

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