DIY toner (Hypo-Alum) - Pheeeew!

Well, following some advice I got here recently, I managed to mix some homemade Hypo-Alum Sepia toner (as per Photographers' Formulary). It's the first time I mixed any photo chemistry from raw ingredients (I did use some prepackaged powdered stuff before ).

I purchased the required chemicals at a local apothecary - where I also got the chemicals measured and packed.

I followed the PF instructions, but wasn't really prepared for the smell! Phew! I thought this one didn't smell of rotten eggs! But it does.... a kind of sulphury smell. Yuck!

Anyway, I just wanted to ask those of you more experienced if it's normal for this stuff to be milky white?
After I started with Sodium thiosulfate, the solution was a bit cloudy, but when I mixed in the Potassium alum, it got smelly real quick, and the solution turned quite miky white... opaque

I then added silver nitrate, being VERY careful not to touch or spill any of that stuff... It went well, some precipitate formed, but it soon partially dissolved. Finally I added the Potassium iodide, since I'm aiming for brown tone.

I mixed everything well, added the final quantity of distilled water, and packed the bottle away.

In short, I made the right decision to mix the stuff in the garage, with the window and doors wide open. Since I didn't wear any mask, I was careful not to stand near the fumes more than a couple of seconds at the time. Man, that stuff stinks....

I'll be doing my toning in the garage - that's for sure

I was also very careful to thoroughly wash eveything I used (plastic mixing bowl, glass rod used for stirring, etc.)...

Well, before I begin to actually use it, I also wanted to ask whether I should take special precautions with this toner... I mean, usually in the darkroom I don't even wear gloves - although I avoid dipping bare hands in the developer or fixer. I use tongs.

I suppose I should treat this toner with extra caution and wear gloves at all times while toning, right? And, like I said, I'll be doing the toning outside the house, probably in the garage, with windows and doors wide open.

Thanks in advance for any suggestions...

Denis

Don't use toners in the darkroom, especially the 'smelly' variety - they will fog both film and paper with the fumes. Besides, in order to see the tone forming you need good lighting or you will lose a lot of control over the results. I tone on the porch in indirect sunlight where there is plenty of fresh air and the results are always very pleasing.

- Randy

it does tend to have a milky look.

you can use tongs or nitrile gloves.

it needs to be used warm which results in a smell.

you can top off each session by adding some distilled water, or add more of the formula i.e. 1 liter after uses. this will enhance the toning speed, but either will work. use distilled water

add the alum slowly as it takes time to go into solution.

you can also use some old prints to help ripen the toner.

Did you like the image you got out of it? Did it maintain rich black and give orange brown or brown black tone? With what paper and which print developer?

Hypo-alum toner is least smelly of all sulfiding toners. If it smells excessively, you might not be following the right formula. Hypo alum is definitely a "classic" toner that went out of favor in recent years, so not many people actually tried it but they cut and paste the formula anyway. (This is true of all toners, but particularly about hypo alum toners.)

Thiosulfate solution should be clear. I don't know why you had cloudy look in it.

Addition of alum is what makes thiosulfate slowly decompose to make the actual toning agent. If the solution becomes smelly and milky very fast, you might not want to add the whole alum solution at that point.

If you get a lot of hydrogen sulfide smell, ventilation is the most important safety measure you should use. Other aspects are same as any other darkroom chemicals. You don't want to touch it, and you never want it in your eyes (use eye protectors), or anywhere near your face. If you have a habit of looking at prints very close to the tray, you should get a good face mask (a clear plastic shield to protect entire face, and you wear it on your head).

I use polysulfide toner (smelly) in my darkroom but it has a very powerful ventilation system. It's very nice to be able to tone prints I made at the end of each session.

Thanks for the info, Ryuji...

Ryuji said:

Did you like the image you got out of it? Did it maintain rich black and give orange brown or brown black tone? With what paper and which print developer?

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I have not yet actually used it - I'm looking forward to it, and will be sure to post the results.

I'm using Fotokemika's FR-16 developer (liquid concentrate - I could probably get the formula from the factory, if you're interested...). The fixer was also Fotokemika's - liquid rapid fixer FF-2.
I use Fotokemika's papers: I'll try the toner with some Emaks RC paper first, and then some Emaks FB, perhaps also Varycon.
I'm not sure that my results will be conclusive, though - being a total beginner in the toning process....

Hypo-alum toner is least smelly of all sulfiding toners. If it smells excessively, you might not be following the right formula.

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Perhaps the smell wasn't as bad as some other toners, but I thought it was supposed to be odourless, and the smell surprised me.

Thiosulfate solution should be clear. I don't know why you had cloudy look in it.
Addition of alum is what makes thiosulfate slowly decompose to make the actual toning agent.

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After dissolving the thiosulfate, the solution was still relatively clear - it turned milky white after adding alum, followed by the appearance of smell...
Perhaps I should have added the alum more slowly - I just added all of it at once.

After adding silver nitrate, yellowish specks of "crud" appeared, but dissolved relatively quickly. After adding the iodide, I noticed small silvery specks in the solution. Anyway, I mixed it some more, then poured into a 1 litre bottle and topped it to full capacity (1 litre) with the remaining distilled water.

I was extra careful and bought double-distilled water in a pharmacy
I don't trust "distilled" water in the grocery stores....

Thanks for the info, everyone!

Denis

you do need to add the alum slowly. i made the same mistake the first time i mixed this toner.

you will also find it helpful to wash the print in warmwater using a cotton swap to wipe the surface and sludge can leave strange marks on the surface of the paper.

this is before actually washing the print as one would do normally after toning.

Good advice, I also have a large kitchen sponge (plain sponge without any abrasive stuff) saturated with washing aid ready when I tone. Wipe the print surface with this after toning but before washing to get absolutely clean print.

The story continues...

I did my first toning today, using the toner prepared about a week ago.
I was surprised to see that the toner which was stored in a brown bottle in the dark, turned quite clear...

Anyway, I heated it (it got milky white again when heated), and put the tray with the toner in a larger tray with a hot water "jacket"... Still, it was rather messy - I kept running to the kitchen (did the toning in the garage) to get more hot water, etc...
The temperature control wasn't really good - I probably need to devise some kind of tray heater

In short, I "sacrificed" only 1 18x25 cm print (about 7x9 in) in a tray containing 1 litre of fresh toner.

Then I tried some test strips done yesterday, to see what will happen. The strips began yellowing after about 15 minutes, and one of them reached nice brownish tone in about half an hour.

After the test I proceeded with toning two 5x7 contact prints (printed on 7x9 paper). One was normal, relatively neutral, and the other already had a relatively warm tone. Both prints were done yesterday, in the same developer, during the same printing session...

The one that was more "neutral" toned better - or at least it seems to me, since the comparison with the same untoned print shows more pronounced difference.
The other, which already had rather warm tone, also toned to a more brownish tone.

However, after wiping the prints from the toner to remove the deposits, I put the prints into water (cold, directly from the pipe) for washing. I washed them for about 20-30 minutes in slowly running water, and was disappointed to see that the nice chocolate brown faded back to yellowish sepia

Still, I think I did OK for the first time

I guess I need to leave the print in the hot toner at least 45 minutes, and let it go more brown than needed - if the fading back of the browns during final wash is usual.

Perhaps I did something wrong? In short, the prints straight from the toner looked more toned (more brown) than after the final wash... The wash seems to have faded the browns back to sepia.

In short, I toned two prints done on Fotokemika Emaks KX PE2 (RC paper, grade 2), which were done yesterday in Fotokemika's FR-16 developer.

If anyone's interested, I could try and scan both prints - untoned and toned versions (I made two prints of each negative, and toned only one of each, leaving the untoned originals for comparison later...)

Thanks everyone for the advice!

Denis

Denis P. said:

The wash seems to have faded the browns back to sepia.

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A 20-30 minute cold tap water wash. Perhaps chlorinated water? Dan

dancqu said:

Perhaps chlorinated water? Dan

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Chlorination has nothing to do with it.

Denis P. said:

Then I tried some test strips done yesterday, to see what will happen. The strips began yellowing after about 15 minutes, and one of them reached nice brownish tone in about half an hour.

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Sounds good.

After the test I proceeded with toning two 5x7 contact prints (printed on 7x9 paper). One was normal, relatively neutral, and the other already had a relatively warm tone. Both prints were done yesterday, in the same developer, during the same printing session...

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Were they the same paper but came out to be different color after development? If so, you haven't given enough development time to them. Prints to be toned should be given long enough development to ensure complete development, and long enough fixing time to ensure complete fixing. Anything less can give you erratic results, weak image or image stain. You can always adjust the image hue by changing the toning time, and this is the best control variable you have.

The one that was more "neutral" toned better - or at least it seems to me, since the comparison with the same untoned print shows more pronounced difference.

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That is expected. Warmer print was most likely insufficiently developed.

However, after wiping the prints from the toner to remove the deposits, I put the prints into water (cold, directly from the pipe) for washing. I washed them for about 20-30 minutes in slowly running water, and was disappointed to see that the nice chocolate brown faded back to yellowish sepia

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Partially toned prints can change image tone fairly fast if kept in a tray of water. The best method is to immerse the toned print in working strength washing aid and give constant agitation for at least 30 seconds. This halts toning reaction and minimizes further change in image hue. If washing aid is not used, the print should be washed with fresh water and vigorous flow for at least 2 minutes when print is taken out of the toning bath. Washing aid is highly recommended.

You might want to make several test images, identically processed, and tone them for different time. Include one image that's way past your best color. Include one image that's about your best color, etc. In some toners, it's best to pull images before they reach your target color, and some opposite. Some toners don't give after-toning effect and the print should be pulled out of the toning bath right at the target color, but sulfur toners are rarely in this category.

Perhaps I did something wrong? In short, the prints straight from the toner looked more toned (more brown) than after the final wash... The wash seems to have faded the browns back to sepia.

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My guess is that the image was toned farther in your post-toning water bath. This is very common with many sulfiding toners, although I don't remember much details of hypo-alum specific cases, as I tested hypo-alum a few times and decided to stick with polysulfide.

(I made two prints of each negative, and toned only one of each, leaving the untoned originals for comparison later...)

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Incidentally, when you tone prints, especially until you get complete handle of your toning technique, I recommend to make a copious number of spare prints. If you have good success that's good, but when you screw up something you don't want to waste more time going back to make more prints...

Also, the details depend on the paper, developer and toner, but you'll often realize that the image tone becomes cooler and darker when the print is dried, and particularly so when you look at the dried prints a day or two after. This is common of most sulfiding toners. As you used to your toner, you'll learn to factor these in when you print and tone.