DIY Questions - IR Film changing box

athbr · Feb 20, 2020

Ran into a few IR goggle threads and that got me thinking.

I was thinking of constructing a film changing box (lightsafe with sleeves) add IR leds inside and fit an IR monocole through an opening. Then I could fit films to reel by visual inspection without a darkroom.

Has anyone tried this? Would the IR leds fog film?

Anticipating some people asking me why would I complicate my life in this way. As they say, boredom is the mother of invention.

koraks · Feb 21, 2020

It could work, but why not take the box and the ir filter from the equation and just use a darkened room (eg bathroom) with ir goggles? It'll be much more convenient.

AgX · Feb 21, 2020

It depends on the LED. There are IR LED's which emission spectrum already starts just below 800nm.

Thus already at verge of sensitivity of current IR-films.

RauschenOderKorn · Feb 21, 2020

It has been done before. I have seen a youtube video where they did this. Please don´t ask me for details, the only things I can remeber is that it was probably about coating emulsion.

AgX · Feb 21, 2020

In industrial labs there are such boxes for those cases the automat got messed op whilst splicing filmstrips.

Luckless · Feb 21, 2020

koraks said:
It could work, but why not take the box and the ir filter from the equation and just use a darkened room (eg bathroom) with ir goggles? It'll be much more convenient.

I can't speak for Athbr's needs, but for myself: A Dark-Glove-Box, with a safety curtain to hang over the glove entry, means I don't have to worry about my girlfriend opening the door on me, or having to rush to pack up everything to light-safe storage if she needs to use the bathroom while I'm trying to work.

And as someone who wears glasses, I would have an easier time being sure I'm not getting goggle-leak of visible light that might be able to fog material if I'm not careful.- There would be no visible light emission sources in the box beyond static or electrical shorts. Assuming I have my IR LEDs properly designed and filtered...

Plus, I could set a box up out in the living room and work on film stuff while watching TV with my girlfriend, rather than locking myself away in a closet or bathroom. And if something comes up, like having to go answer the door, then it is easy to pull the safety curtain over the gloves, withdraw my hands, and 'exit the darkroom' safely without needing to put everything away or install a big and bulky light-safe portal.

Andrew O'Neill · Feb 21, 2020

New55 was using an infrared camera inside a light tight box, with a monitor outside the box, to assemble film packs.

Luckless · Feb 21, 2020

Andrew O'Neill said:
New55 was using an infrared camera inside a light tight box, with a monitor outside the box, to assemble film packs.

I'm still waiting on mine and my girlfriend's father's schedules to line up so I can get into his stop to build my dark-box, but I'm also leaning towards an IR cam and computer screen.

Most digital cameras will work in IR, but some may require manual removal of an IR filter. General 1080p webcams are pretty cheap, so not an expensive thing to write off due to mishaps.

Going with trying to stick a stand-alone IR Goggle through the box just sounds like begging for back or neck problems.

BMbikerider · Feb 21, 2020

A normal changing bag works and when Kodak High speed IR was available that was all I used without a problem.

Andrew O'Neill · Feb 21, 2020

BMbikerider said:
A normal changing bag works and when Kodak High speed IR was available that was all I used without a problem.

He wants to use IR goggles to aid in loading conventional film onto reels...

BMbikerider · Feb 21, 2020

Ahhh! I missed that - sorry

koraks · Feb 21, 2020

Luckless said:
Plus, I could set a box up out in the living room and work on film stuff while watching TV with my girlfriend, rather than locking myself away in a closet or bathroom.

How much time do you spend exactly on fiddling with films and reels? I mean, how long does it take to spool a film onto a development reel or cut a length of film and roll it onto a cassette spindle - 4 minutes max?

Luckless · Feb 21, 2020

koraks said:
How much time do you spend exactly on fiddling with films and reels? I mean, how long does it take to spool a film onto a development reel or cut a length of film and roll it onto a cassette spindle - 4 minutes max?

Multiply that by a dozen or two rolls of film?

I'm also planning to use a dark-box to do more than just spool film, as it will double as a darkroom space for printing as well.

koraks · Feb 22, 2020

Alright, sounds reasonable. Although printing inside a box sounds cumbersome, even with ir vision. Then again, I once met a photographer in Rome who was doing paper negatives of tourists, which he developed inside his LF camera. Pretty neat.

radiant · Feb 22, 2020

koraks said:
Alright, sounds reasonable. Although printing inside a box sounds cumbersome, even with ir vision. Then again, I once met a photographer in Rome who was doing paper negatives of tourists, which he developed inside his LF camera. Pretty neat.

.. wait, how? :O

koraks · Feb 22, 2020

It was a DIY camera built from wood where he could remove the back and he has fitted textile sleeves to the sides. Inside he kept trays for developer and fixer. He timed development by simply counting out the seconds. After fixing he'd dump the print into a bucket of water he kept at hand.
After shooting a negative, he mounted it on a holder that was attached to the camera in front of the lens and shot a photo of it onto a new sheet of paper, which would of course then be the positive.

Cumbersome, but low tech and it worked quite well.

radiant · Feb 22, 2020

koraks said:
Cumbersome, but low tech and it worked quite well.

Pretty awesome, I think. Easier than doing wet plates on field I believe. Oh wish I had the energy and time to tour around the country venues and do wet plates of people.

AgX · Feb 22, 2020

BMbikerider said:
A normal changing bag works and when Kodak High speed IR was available that was all I used without a problem.

There were changing bag models reported of not being IR tight.

BMbikerider · Feb 22, 2020

I never had a problem with mine, even my 1st one when the rubberised lining of the outer bag started to flake off. Not wanting to waste anything I still have it as a reserve and if I am doing a lot of film developing, One is used for 35mm with the appropriate tank and the other for 120, this one with the larger tank. It saves time in the long run.

athbr · Feb 22, 2020

koraks said:
It could work, but why not take the box and the ir filter from the equation and just use a darkened room (eg bathroom) with ir goggles? It'll be much more convenient.

Two reasons:
1. The current space I'm in isn't ideal and I have to tape it up for printing then open it up when I'm done. Would be nice not to have to do it for film. Although I should probably get my space sorted tbh.

2. Wouldn't IR LEDs give better illumination? And if so, it would be easier to light up a box in IR than a room, I'd imagine. I admit I have never used IR goggles in my life so I might be talking out of my rear end on this one.

athbr · Feb 22, 2020

koraks said:
How much time do you spend exactly on fiddling with films and reels? I mean, how long does it take to spool a film onto a development reel or cut a length of film and roll it onto a cassette spindle - 4 minutes max?

Can't possibly underestimate how clumsy I am. If I can save myself from myself, it's worth a shot.

koraks · Feb 23, 2020

athbr said:
Wouldn't IR LEDs give better illumination?

Yes, absolutely, you're right about this. The question is how well you can use them ir goggles in a non-darkened room, but with a good eyepiece it should work I think.

Bill Burk · Feb 23, 2020

IR goggles are able to show you near infrared, the LED color that will work can be seen by human eye, faintly as a dim red.

You know, if you have some black slides, you could just tape them on the box as little windows that may give enough light in the box with goggles.

I would consider getting one of those you viewers for this box project.

DIY Questions - IR Film changing box

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