digital negs for silver contact printing

[sonya modotti]

hi everyone,

a few questions in regard to digital negatives for contact printing on silver paper:

- what is the advantage of using pictorico pghg white film rather than ohp transparency film?

- noticing that all of ron reeder's qtr profiles for pghg white film use the matte black rather than the photo black ink, is there any advantage to using the matte black?

many thanks,

sonya

 

[keithwms]

What to consider when weighing the relative advantages and disadvantages of various substrates (ohp or paper):

(1) substrate texture/granularity - how rough is the substrate and what actual lp/mm resolution does it impart.

(2) substrate transmittance- what light is actually passing through the substrate. What will actually work for you depends on your process and your light source etc.

(3) how the substrate diffuses the light. Generally we like to think that the light goes through the substrate undiffused but that is not so. Actually diffusion can be a good thing, it might depixelate or deband a print, but again it depends on what you are trying to achieve.

(4) if you want to pencil in, some papers are nicer for that than pictorico.


(5) cost!

So, looking at these issues (and probably a few more that more knowledgeable people will mention), I think you will see that you can go either way depending on your process.

P.S. I think Ron will comment on the ink choice. My own simpleton theory is that the ink choice depends on the transmission spectrum of the particular ink/dye/pigment across the relevant wavelength range i.e. how effectively it blocks the light you're using, versus the Dmin of the substrate in that wavelength range. But obviously tonal transitions are more important than absolute blocking effectiveness and that is a more complicated issue.

 

[Ron-san]

hi everyone,

a few questions in regard to digital negatives for contact printing on silver paper:

- what is the advantage of using pictorico pghg white film rather than ohp transparency film?

- noticing that all of ron reeder's qtr profiles for pghg white film use the matte black rather than the photo black ink, is there any advantage to using the matte black?

many thanks,

sonya

Hi Sonya-- I use matte black ink in my older Epson 4000 simply because I do not want to change between matte and photo black and i often use that printer for making matte photo prints as well as digital negatives. For the older ultrachrome inkset either matte or photo black can achieve high optical densities in both UV and visible light and, in my opinion, either ink works just fine. (some think the photo black makes a more scratch resistant neg, but I have not had a problem in that regard with matte black).
For the newer K3 inkset I still use matte black ink because it absorbs more UV light than photo black and it is easier to achieve the high densities you need for palladium printing with matte black. For printing on silver gelatin paper I bet either ink would work OK.
In sum, as long as the ink blocks enough light, either photo or matte is OK in my book.
In the old days ( a year or so ago) people found that digital negs made on Pictorico OHP yielded a somewhat granular appearance when contact printed onto silver gelatin paper. Making the dig neg on white film reduced this granularity and made a smoother image. The only reason I can think why this should be the case is the possibility that the white film diffuses the printer dot structure a bit (ie, makes a less sharp image). I bet if you put a slight diffusion layer between a pictorico OHP negative and the silver gelatin paper you would also smooth out the dot structure and could get relatively smooth images with OHP as well (but I have never done the experiment).
For myself, I have given away all my silver gelatin paper and have covered up my enlargers. I find that prints made on Ilford Galerie Gold Fibre Silk (an inkjet paper that has no gold, fibre, or silk in it) have all the Dmax and "silver gelatin" look that I could want. Without going to the bother of making a digital neg intermediate. I still use dig negs for palladium printing, but have given up the fight and converted to using the Epson 3800 and the K3 inkset for the "silver gelatin" look.

Cheers, Ron Reeder

 

[sonya modotti]

hi keith and ron,

thanks very much for your responses. very helpful,

sonya

 

[Daniel Balfour]

Sonya,

If you haven't as of yet, I would strongly recommend picking up a copy of Ron Reeder's book - Digital Negatives. It offers a lot of technique & helpful insights.

As for Pictorico -

Myself being an avid traditional printer I've learned from hard and bitter experience (the digital revolution & the discontinuation of most traditional media) NOT to put all my eggs in one basket! In concrete terms, that means employing a versatile workflow that is unmarried to any one particular substrate.

I have gotten some pretty good results using Pictorico white-film with silver-gelatin prints. But, at least for me, it won't end there. I'll be conducting a lot of tests with Inkpress media and other, less conventional, substrates. I'll be posting my results in these forums.

- Daniel

 

[donbga]

hi everyone,

a few questions in regard to digital negatives for contact printing on silver paper:

- what is the advantage of using pictorico pghg white film rather than ohp transparency film?

sonya

Sonya,

The Pictorico White Gloss film does give a smoother result when printing on gelatin silver but the final quality of your prints also depends on the quality of your printer. Generally speaking the latest generation of inkjet printers produces the smoothest results. Unfortunately the OHP product is quite expensive and difficult to find. An alternative product is Kodak backlit film, however it is available only in rolls and may have been discontinued. The cost per square inch is substantially lower. Inkpress white gloss film is also an alternative and is sold in cut sheets of various sizes. You can find it here:

http://www.inkjetart.com/inkpress_paper/Inkpress_White_Gloss_Film.html

You may also wish to try making digital negatives for gelatin silver prints using an inexpensive RC glossy inkjet paper. Working carefully, negatives made on inkjet paper can produce pretty good results even with older printers such the Epson 1280. One of the keys to getting the smoothest results is to perform a head alignment on your substrate of choice. This makes a big difference in the results. Any RC glossy inkjet paper can be used as long as there isn't a "watermark" on the back of the paper. I use a very inexpensive paper sold at Costco stores, 150 sheets for about $19.00. Unfortunately the size is limited to 8.5x11 inches, but other brands can be used if larger sizes are desired. RC glossy inkjet paper is a great choice if you wish to make bromoils since the need for an extremely sharp image isn't important for bromoil work.

Another very important concern if your aim is to achieve the highest quality print is to be able to obtain consistently uniform exposures through the testing and calibration steps and to be able to duplicate that when producing prints. This demands the use of a white light integrator such as the Metrolux. Ditto for the developing step. Paper developer temperture needs to be held constant through the testing and printing phases of your work.

Using a rip such as QTR gives the best control for creating digital negatives but don't discount the quality that can be achieved with colorized negatives. There are various methods for making colorized negatives and IMO, this method is easier for the beginner to grasp and use and does not force the user to print with an Epson printer which QTR does. Don't mis-interpret what I'm suggesting, QTR is a great product and provides fine control for digi neg. output but it does have a steep learning curve. You can use Ron's templates for starters but fine tuning your QTR curves requires quite a bit noodle work to understand the system, which for beginners is very non-intuitive but the payoff is big if you hang with it.

Finally, just remember that white gloss substrates and glossy inkjet paper are only suitable for gelatin silver printing as they are quite opaque to UV processes such as platinum/palladium and so on. These substrates have a base log density to UV light of over 4.0!

Good luck,

Don Bryant

 

[sonya modotti]

hi daniel and don,

thanks very much for your additional comments. i am going to do some tests this weekend, initially using ohp transparency film that i was able to readily aquire. i am using an epson 4880 with qtr and following ron's qtr guidelines, so hopefully good results are forthcoming : )

will follow up when i have a few prints to look at.

sonya