- Joined
- Sep 11, 2015
- Messages
- 668
- Format
- 35mm
I don't know if the minimum amount of developer varies drastically from one film to another. But we can say that most manufacturers seem to recommend minimal amounts that seem similar to each other for all films. I don't know a manufacturer that recommends a significantly lower volume of developer for particular films. One might hypothesize that purportedly "high silver" content films like Adox Silvermax and Ferriana P50 would need a greater volume of developers than purportedly low silver films like Kentmere. Even if claims about greater or lesser amounts of silver are true I have never heard different recommendations from manufacturers about developer volume. By analogy, there are those that make homebuilt small airplanes. In the US it was hard at first because the homebuilder had to prove their plane met all the same rigorous standards as commercial aircraft. But then it was decided that if the homebuilt exceeded federal requirements in all areas they would not have to go through such an arduous certification process. Commercial aircraft might have needed to push against the boundaries of a requirement to save every penny to be competitive and because they were making many examples of the same design. We know of examples of where they pushed too hard and it was disastrous. But with civil, home-built, aircraft is was different.Both sets of numbers reference particular developers. You would use different numbers for different developers. As an example, you need to use a minimum of 100 ml of stock X-Tol.
Seems there is no way there could be enough room for the minimum developer volume with something like the 4x5 Yankee tank.
Okay some say that the needed volume of developer depends
If I understand your question about "150 of what?". Anchell and Anchell and Troop (and potentially manufacturers) are clear that what they refer to with those volumes it is a developer in its most concentrated dilution per roll of film or 80 sq. inches of film. So for D-76, it would be the volume of stock solution per roll and the same for many other developers. With developers based on a concentrated syrup like Rodinal and HC-110 though, it is usually based on an amount of concentrate per roll.
But that's where people started getting into trouble, by following the minimum volume written on the tank. If they look at this volume and then use a 1:1 dilution they won't have enough stock. ...
Sorry Matt but your post makes no sense. The OP was simply asking if the total volume of developer mattered. I normally use 500ml of developer in a Patterson tank but I could use 1000ml or 1500ml I suppose, as long as it has at least 250ml of stock, I'm good to go. You mentioned a scenario of a highly dilute developer, if you used so little HC 110 syrup, agitation would be the least of your worries, your developer would quickly exhaust itself.
That’s so interesting! Thank you for that insight. I have a question, how about rotary and C-41? I use a jobo and use a little more than 100ml per roll as a one shot developer. Would I need to add more developer if I know I overexposed the roll or would it not matter since the developer is done for already? I’m curious of the quality of my C-41 rolls and if more developer would make them better due to that extra developer.
Thank you everyone! I’m so glad I asked.
I hear "if you value your photographs" so many times here...
Valuing your photographs doesn't mean selecting one of the four holy methods to process them. It doesn't mean taking no risks (which would have you never loading the camera). All it means (to the people who throw that phrase into a "how do I do this" thread) is that someone thinks you're doing it wrong, compared to their own sacred process methodology.
The level of variation between a push +2 roll and a pull -1 roll processed in minimal volume high dilution chemistry is well within what can be controlled in printing or scanning. What can't be controlled in the negative to positive process is having no negatives because you're stuck in analysis paralysis. Follow manufacturer instructions, shoot more film, and process to positives by your preferred method. And don't nitpick over whether you can use D-76 1+1 because you're running a roll of 135-36 exposed 2 stops below box speed in a single reel stainless tank. Millions of users over close to a century say it'll be fine.
do not skimp of using the absolute minimum volume of the chemicals, use enough volume to completely cover the film
But if you're using a Jobo rotary machine (or a Labbox, from what I read, or Zone VI tubes or imitations thereof) you pretty much can't fully cover the film; you're using less than that and keeping the film moving to ensure even development.
FWIW, for the past year and a half I've used Xtol stock, with replenishment, but several years ago, I used Parodinal 1:50 and even 1:100, with no extra working solution volume. I say again, D-76 1+1 or Xtol 1+1, 1+2 or even 1+3 will produce results close enough to normal to cover in printing/scanning, whether your film is a couple stops overexposed or a couple stops underexposed. If you find your negatives are coming out low contrast (a typical result of exhaustion), either develop longer (may not help much if it's actually developer exhausting during processing) or use a stronger working solution. Just don't spend so much time trying to figure it out that you don't shoot or develop or scan/print.
I hear "if you value your photographs" so many times here...
Valuing your photographs doesn't mean selecting one of the four holy methods to process them. It doesn't mean taking no risks (which would have you never loading the camera). All it means (to the people who throw that phrase into a "how do I do this" thread) is that someone thinks you're doing it wrong, compared to their own sacred process methodology.
The level of variation between a push +2 roll and a pull -1 roll processed in minimal volume high dilution chemistry is well within what can be controlled in printing or scanning. What can't be controlled in the negative to positive process is having no negatives because you're stuck in analysis paralysis. Follow manufacturer instructions, shoot more film, and process to positives by your preferred method. And don't nitpick over whether you can use D-76 1+1 because you're running a roll of 135-36 exposed 2 stops below box speed in a single reel stainless tank. Millions of users over close to a century say it'll be fine.
I was thinking of a list of manufacture's suggested minimums. I didn't expect that there was one, but was hoping to be pleasantly surprised.If there is it is probably wrong.Every formula is different so it is best to follow the manufacturers' guidelines.
Adrian was kind enough to share the info. about his experiments in developer volume. This is empirical information.
https://www.photrio.com/forum/threa...s-iso-and-dilution.174217/page-2#post-2269015
In this thread:
https://www.photrio.com/forum/threa...ip-between-dev-times-iso-and-dilution.174217/
I'm not aware of one, but my post #12 in this thread at least addressed the two types of interest to the OP:After all this hubub, is there a central location that lists minimum developer per roll according to developer type?
The class of developer that requires a minimum of 250ml stock solution includes D-76/ID-11, D-23, Perceptol, etc. Scene brightness distribution will determine whether full development can take place with less. If it's a low-key scene, i.e. less negative density to develop, one might squeak by with less solution. If it's high-key, i.e. a fully developed negative would have lots of density throughout, less than 250ml will result in less than full development. Player's choice: confidence or crap shoot.
XTOL is a different kind of developer. The same situation I just described applies to XTOL too, but that minimum stock solution number is 100ml, not 250ml...
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?