Dev Time For Ilford Pan 100 and Pan 400 in Xtol

I've contacted Ilford in regards to getting a time for these two films, but it seems they have forgotten about me since I have yet to hear back from them. Anyway I send my B&W to a lab to process, since I am unable to do it myself. They use Xtol straight at 24 degrees dip and dunk machine processing. Does anyone have times for these two unusual films for Xtol?

Secondly has anyone confirmed what these two films actually are? Are they FP3 and HP4? Or something else? I know they are grainier then the current FP4/ HP5+ films. Are they as grainy as say Forte/ Bergger films were?

Here is a fact sheet about these films: http://www.theimagingwarehouse.com/file.php?filename=WebCat-0005000400010002000e/Pan100-400.pdf

They are what they are - they aren't anything else. They are separate films that are less expensive to manufacture and are sold primarily in third world countries.

As for time for XTOL, have you checked the Massive Film Development Chart?

Here is the link to the "Massive Film Development Chart" from DigitalTruth.com:
http://www.digitaltruth.com/devchart.php
You can sort by film type and/or developer type.

Here is the link for Ilford Pan (100 and 400) in Xtol developer:
http://www.digitaltruth.com/devchart.php?Film=Ilford+Pan&Developer=Xtol&mdc=Search

They have also a very nice app with all the developing info, a nice darkroom timer (with a red or green safe light !!) and warning bleeps for (suggested) agitation of your developing tank.
You can also add your own developing methods (times, agitation, ...). See:
http://www.digitaltruth.com/apps/

Info from their website:
Darkroom Processing Timer App for Film Development
for iPhone, iPod Touch, iPad, Nokia and Android

The Massive Dev Chart is the world's largest film development chart with multi-step timer and darkroom support for Apple iPhone iOs, Nokia Symbianˆ3 and Android devices. It contains development times for most (over 8,000) combinations of black and white films and developers.

The smart and easy-to-use interface lets you adjust film development time automatically by temperature, store lists of your favorite customized film/developer combinations, modify preferred agitation schemes and find the correct volumes of liquid depending on the developer dilution.

The multi-step film development timer helps you to achieve consistent results, while convenient sound and visual notifications remind you to agitate your tank as you listen to your favorite iTunes music.

The Massive Dev Chart app is used by thousands of passionate black and white photographers around the world.

The developing chart doesn't give the dilution the lab will be using, nor the temperature. Again I have no intentions of developing this myself, so please don't mention it. I was hoping Simon would pipe in, but maybe not.

braxus said:

Again I have no intentions of developing this myself, so please don't mention it.

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Sorry about that: I should have read your first post better .....

braxus said:

The developing chart doesn't give the dilution the lab will be using, nor the temperature. Again I have no intentions of developing this myself, so please don't mention it. I was hoping Simon would pipe in, but maybe not.

Click to expand...

If doing the film yourself isn't an option, and the lab won't change how it develops film, only one choice remains - do some test rolls and have them do some test processing. It might cost you a few dollars to figure it out.

You can extrapolate and make some reasonable guesses. Find out times they use for a few traditional emulsion films they do, and look up the times those films have with XTOL at a different dilution or temperature. Find out how much your film's times vary with that same dilution and temperature, and make an educated guess as to how it might vary with your lab's procedure.

I'd tell you that developing film at home is easy and doesn't even require a darkroom, and will save you money if you do enough film, but apparently you don't want to hear it. So consider this advice to be for anyone else who reads this thread in the future.

Dear Braxus,

Firstly I must apologise that no one got back to you, not acceptable, I will find out what happened.

I am very sorry we do not supply processing times for XTOL as described used at elevated temperature in a dip and dunk automatic processing machine, we do not ( and would not ) produce this for any of our films.

Whilst many film manufacturers, including ourselves, do test films in many developers including those of competitors and publish, traditionally its the manufacturer of the developer who should offer a suitable time in the product in an automated process.

My suggestion ( if you have any other ILFORD PAN films ) is to ask them to do a test. I presume your lab is doing a sub 60 second developing time. If you do not have any other PAN films then I would suggest that you ask them to process the film at the same development time as they are using for any other iso 125 film or iso 400 film.

PAN 100 and PAN 400 are unique emulsions produced by HARMAN technology Limited :


Simon ILFORD Photo / HARMAN technology Limited :

braxus said:

I've contacted Ilford in regards to getting a time for these two films, but it seems they have forgotten about me since I have yet to hear back from them. Anyway I send my B&W to a lab to process, since I am unable to do it myself. They use Xtol straight at 24 degrees dip and dunk machine processing. Does anyone have times for these two unusual films for Xtol?

Secondly has anyone confirmed what these two films actually are? Are they FP3 and HP4? Or something else? I know they are grainier then the current FP4/ HP5+ films. Are they as grainy as say Forte/ Bergger films were?

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Who is your lab? The Lab?

Have they any other customers who might use the film, who they would put you in touch with?

The lab is Custom Color in Vancouver. They are one of the few remaining labs left there. As for anyone else using the film, as far as I know- they've never seen the film before.

braxus said:

The lab is Custom Color in Vancouver. They are one of the few remaining labs left there. As for anyone else using the film, as far as I know- they've never seen the film before.

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I'm fairly familiar with Customcolor - they do my E6 (through ABC).

You might consider making an enquiry with The Lab to see if they have worked with the film: Dead Link Removed

I'd send to THE LAB if they were close to me, but I live an hour and half out of Vancouver and get my B&W films sent through either London Drugs or Lens and Shutter which both send to Custom Color. Its not practical to drive to Vancouver to get developing done.

Looking at the information that is available, I note the following:

Ilford gives times (4 minutes) for the films in T-Max RS at 24C.

Kodak gives times for a bunch of their films in both T-Max RS and X-Tol stock at 24C.

The Kodak time for the new T-Max 400 (TMY2) in T-Max RS at 24C is 4 1/2 minutes - which is close to 4 minutes - just a 12.5 % increase over the Ilford recommendation for their Pan films in T-Max RS at 24C.

The Kodak time for the new T-Max 400 (TMY2) in stock X-Tol at 24C is 5 1/4 minutes - which isn't far from 4 minutes - just a 16.7 % increase over the Ilford recommendation for their Pan films in T-Max RS at 24C.

So I would ask Customcolor to use their times for TMY-2 plus 16.6%.

You could do the same sort of comparison and extrapolation with other Kodak films, like Tri-X 400.

braxus said:

The lab is Custom Color in Vancouver. They are one of the few remaining labs left there. As for anyone else using the film, as far as I know- they've never seen the film before.

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That begs the other option - if you're going to depend on someone else's lab, shoot film they can readily process. Pan-F Plus, FP4 Plus and HP5 Plus will be routine for them, I expect.