Current infra-red options....

xtolsniffer · Apr 2, 2014

Hi all,
well, I'm down to my last roll of Kodak HIE, carefully stored and thawed, so I guess it's time to move on. I know there is nothing quite like it, but I was wondering what is still currently available in the black and white infra-red market and what the characteristics are. There is lots of info out there on t'internet but I was hoping that with the huge range of experience on those here on APUG I might get a few personal recommendations and tips.

Ta!

iulian · Apr 2, 2014

Near infrared-films are, from what I know, the following:
- Ilford SFX
- Rollei Infrared 400s
- Rollei Superpan 200
- Rollei Retro 80s

xtolsniffer · Apr 2, 2014

I was going to give SFX a go as it's from good old Ilford and I can soup it in ID-11, and was thinking of a roll or two of the Rollei Infrared. I tried getting some Rollei last year but all my usual suppliers seemed to be out of stock. I did manage to try one roll of Maco/Adox infra-red but that seems to have disappeared now. Not great results with that as spots of the emulsion came off during processing.

ntenny · Apr 2, 2014

The Maco infrared was the same emulsion as Efke 820IR, I believe, so now of course gone. There's a guy in Croatia selling the last Efke stock in the classifieds, I think only in 120 format.

I did some experimenting with the Rollei IR film and wasn't especially blown away by it. Its IR sensitivity doesn't go very deep, and with an R72 filter its effective speed is only a little better than the Efke stock. I haven't shot SFX, but its sensitivity also drops off pretty quickly.

The comparison at http://www.digitaltruth.com/products/product_tests/infrared_film_005.php may be of interest. As you might expect, nothing really looks quite like HIE.

-NT

ME Super · Apr 2, 2014

I've shot the Rollei IR400s with a cheap chinese deep red (IR720) filter. I generally scan and print, and have gotten acceptable results anywhere from EI3 to EI25 in bright sun. Having said that, it seems I get the most detail at EI25. YMMV, especially if you're wet printing. I have no darkroom, so I do what I can.

DWThomas · Apr 2, 2014

As far as Wood effect and all, the EFKE stuff with a 760 nm filter was excellent; but alas, it's more or less gone. I have had good results with the Rollei IR400 and a 720 nm, or even an 89B (695 nm) filter, and I think the film is a bit finer grain. Many say it's great as a pan film, but to me, only for special uses at what it sells for. I've only run one roll of SFX200 to date, but the results with a 695 nm filter were better than I expected, it bears more testing (and it sells for a fair amount less than the Rollei).

I have tried the Rollei material with a 760 nm, but that is definitely working down in the mud on the spectral curve -- as in about ISO 1 (or lower).

BMbikerider · Apr 2, 2014

I have used the Rollie Infra Red, but for some reason this seems to attract dust like pins to a magnet! I have never know it so bad with any other film. However once the dust can be dealt with it has most of the Characteristics of Kodak HIE less the beautiful glow along the edges of tones. It's worth a try though.

ntenny · Apr 2, 2014

DWThomas said:
I have had good results with the Rollei IR400 and a 720 nm, or even an 89B (695 nm) filter

I thought the 89B was also a 720 nm filter? Same as the Hoya R72, IIRC.

I have tried the Rollei material with a 760 nm, but that is definitely working down in the mud on the spectral curve -- as in about ISO 1 (or lower).

Is that Wratten 87? I remember some people using those successfully with the Efke emulsion, albeit with huge filter factors. With the Rollei film I'm surprised it worked at all.

-NT

DWThomas · Apr 2, 2014

ntenny said:
I thought the 89B was also a 720 nm filter? Same as the Hoya R72, IIRC.

Is that Wratten 87? I remember some people using those successfully with the Efke emulsion, albeit with huge filter factors. With the Rollei film I'm surprised it worked at all.

-NT

According to info I found a few years back, the Wratten 89B is 695, there is a Wratten 88A that shows as 715. But then I have some doubt as to how consistent some of these numbers are if there are any different makers involved. There could also be some difference in the actual shape of the curves too, I suppose.

I had info that the Tiffen 87 is 770. I found the transition from a 720 to a 760 with the EFKE only required about one more stop of exposure, but about six more with the Rollei.

My 760 is some not-well-identified ePrey-acquired piece from the Far East, my 720 is also ePrey from the world-renowned Bower, and my 89B is a genuine Wratten I've had since circa 1965 -- so take anything I say with a few grains of sodium chloride!

My most recent work dredged up the 89B because it's a Series VII I can adapt to my Yashica 124G and not have to keep installing/removing the filter. The other two were acquired to use with my Bronica and are larger.

There are some IR filters that run up into the 800s and 900s, those would be like a steel plate for today's films. :confused:

NB23 · Apr 2, 2014

I got some extraordinary shots with SFX200 over time. My last shots were in Death Valley. I still have to print the outstanding landscapes that I saw but the negatives are beautiful so I'm confident that the prints will be beautiful.

Here is one shot I printed the other day, on RC paper, for my wife. I hope it can give you an idea...

Xpan + 45mm + BW092 filter. There is vignetting/falloff due to the lack of the Xpan center filter. I didn't want to stack filters.

Paul Cunningham · Apr 2, 2014

There is still HIE to be found, why not stick with it as long as you can?

xtolsniffer · Apr 3, 2014

I guess it comes down to SFX vs Rollei then? I'll be using a Cokin 007 (which is an 89B equivalent). I guess I can't expect results like HIE, but to be fair, I don't get through a lot of it as we don't get a lot of infra-red in Yorkshire....

Roger Cole · Apr 3, 2014

Paul Cunningham said:
There is still HIE to be found, why not stick with it as long as you can?

Really? All I've seen has been either ancient, exorbitant, or both.

I got something like 20 rolls each of 35mm and 120 plus a couple boxes of 4x5 of the Efke stuff when they went under. I've only shot one roll of it though, yet to develop it.

xtolsniffer · Apr 3, 2014

I only got to run through one roll of 35mm Efke before they disappeared, it seemed to be most like HIE of any of the other emulsions (from online examples), but I had to shoot it at about 2-3 stops overexposed from the recommendation using a 89B filter (I think the recommendation was ISO 25 using an 89B, I found that around ISO 1.5-3 worked if I remember correctly), it was very grainy and looked like spots of the emulsion can come off in development.

Paul Cunningham · Apr 3, 2014

True, it's not just lying around in everyone's living rooms collecting dust. In the past six months, I've come across EIR and HIE in 35mm and two boxes of HIE 4x5. Perhaps I've been luckier than most , but there is some out there.

Roger Cole said:
Really? All I've seen has been either ancient, exorbitant, or both.

I got something like 20 rolls each of 35mm and 120 plus a couple boxes of 4x5 of the Efke stuff when they went under. I've only shot one roll of it though, yet to develop it.

xtolsniffer · Apr 4, 2014

It's interesting that looking at the spectral sensitivity, both Ilford SFX and Rollei IR are actually pretty similar given that one is described as an 'extended red' and the other as 'true IR'. I might treat myself to a roll of each for my RB67 and put one in it's own back and shoot them side by side.

AgX · Apr 4, 2014

Be carefull in comparing spectral sensitivity curves of different origins, as long as you do not know for sure how they were obtained.

The IlfordPhoto curve is based on the radiation of an incandescant source of known temperature, the Agfa curve on an eqalized energy spectrum.

xtolsniffer · Apr 4, 2014

Ooh, that's technical! What's the difference?

AgX · Apr 4, 2014

If you make up a spectral sensitivity curve not only the spectral sensitivity of the film itself is of influence but the spectral characteristic of the light source the film is exposed to. One either can take that as it is (typical wedge spectrogram) or eqalize it to same energy, by filtration or calculation.

If only a cut-off frequency is concerned that does not matter. In all other cases one must consider variation of curves.

xtolsniffer · Apr 4, 2014

Wow, I had assumed that it would be equalised to a constant wavelength-independent output source level, as in acoustics.

Current infra-red options....

xtolsniffer

iulian

xtolsniffer

ntenny

ME Super

DWThomas

BMbikerider

ntenny

DWThomas

NB23

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Current infra-red options....

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