Curly negatives question

Tim Gray · Feb 24, 2021

My film has always dried with a slight curl, across the width of the film (a slight cupping, not curled like on the reel/spool). This is 99% 35mm, most of which is Kodak film. Been this way for years in 3 different houses. I usually run the shower before I hang to dry.

I’ve always dealt with this by sleeping the film and then putting it under a couple of large books for a few days. Seems to take most of the curl out.

Does anyone use something like a flower press for this? Two boards with some screws and wing nuts? Seems like a cheap and easier solution than lugging my biggest books around the house...

koraks · Feb 24, 2021

I just shrug,sleeve them and put them in a folder. Most of the curl flattens out over time. I don't find it creates problems when printing. But yeah, I do recognize the phenomenon. Some film stocks exhibit it more than others, and old/expired film is very prone to it as it has spent so much time being rolled up (yes, that does contribute to the lateral curl as well!)

pentaxuser · Feb 24, 2021

I have never really noticed this with Ilford 35mm film(HP5+) which has been my only 35mm film for some time now but I don't recall it happening with Kodak P3200 either although it was some time ago I developed it. I tend to leave the film hanging with metal clips to and bottom for may be a day or more so this may help eliminate the curl

pentaxuser

radiant · Feb 24, 2021

I'm pretty sure it is something to do with low humidity. During finnish summers the curling is really small and now this winter even Fomapan at 120 size is curling like Tri-X!

cliveh · Feb 24, 2021

When you mention "I usually run the shower before I hang to dry." Does this mean you have a shower? Or the film has a shower? Where do you hang the film to dry? And for how long? Do you attach a clip weight to the hanging end of the film?

pentaxuser · Feb 24, 2021

Tim what is your relative humidity in Ohio right now and over what does it range across the year? I have never seen mine below 60 % or above about low 70s where I live in the U.K.

Thanks

pentaxuser

ic-racer · Feb 24, 2021

What problem is this causing? Over 40 years I have had a few types of film dry with no transverse arching, but they are very difficult to get into the negative sleeves. Not only does the arch allow the negatives to be handled easier, without flopping all over the place, it keeps the emulsion off the cutting surface and away from the lower negative carrier during positioning.

Sirius Glass · Feb 24, 2021

I dry the film with a clip on the bottom for weight. After drying over night I put them in PrintFile sheets. I do not have a curling problem, however having steam from a shower could help them dry straight. It is a humidity problem.

radiant · Feb 24, 2021

In Finland we might have -20 degrees celcius outside with relative humidity between 90-98% but because of heated houses the humidity inside houses can be really low, somewhere between 20-30%.

Wallendo · Feb 24, 2021

The only modern film with which I have had trouble is TX400, and that is only with very low humidity. It does help to run the shower in the bathroom a few minutes before hanging. I have not noticed nearly as much curl the last 2-3 years. Maybe it's my latest move or possibly some change in the film. I don't have issues with TMax films. Harmon and Foma products tend to dry exceptionally flat for me.

Tim Gray · Feb 24, 2021

More info: clips with weights on the bottom, dry 3-20 hours, run the shower until the mirror in the bathroom fogs up then shut the door. Longer or shorter doesn’t seem to make a big difference, nor does the shower frankly. I should say that I had a bit of a film hiatus and am now developing some old film I had (Tri-X about 5 years old) so if it has gotten better that would be nice.

It’s been below freezing for about 20 days straight, so humidity is low. We run humidifiers in the house, but the humidity is probably at best between 35-40%.

It’s not a huge problem. I flatten them out with books. Not a big deal for printing. It can make a difference when scanning, so I usually do that post-flattening.

cliveh · Feb 24, 2021

Tim Gray said:
More info: clips with weights on the bottom, dry 3-20 hours, run the shower until the mirror in the bathroom fogs up then shut the door. Longer or shorter doesn’t seem to make a big difference, nor does the shower frankly. I should say that I had a bit of a film hiatus and am now developing some old film I had (Tri-X about 5 years old) so if it has gotten better that would be nice.

It’s been below freezing for about 20 days straight, so humidity is low. We run humidifiers in the house, but the humidity is probably at best between 35-40%.

It’s not a huge problem. I flatten them out with books. Not a big deal for printing. It can make a difference when scanning, so I usually do that post-flattening.

I don't understand why you are running the shower until the mirror fogs up? Why?

pentaxuser · Feb 24, 2021

Tim Gray said:
It’s been below freezing for about 20 days straight, so humidity is low. We run humidifiers in the house, but the humidity is probably at best between 35-40%.

It’s not a huge problem. I flatten them out with books. Not a big deal for printing. It can make a difference when scanning, so I usually do that post-flattening.

It would look as if its your humidity or lack of it that's the problem. I am glad that it's not a huge problem because I fear that you are probably stuck with it. Sorry

pentaxuser

Pieter12 · Feb 24, 2021

I don't know about inordinate curling along the shot side but for the long way, some film stocks just have more curl to them than others. Bergger Pancro 400 wants to roll back up in a spiral, CatLabs 80 lies flat and limp right off the spool.

Tim Gray · Feb 24, 2021

cliveh said:
I don't understand why you are running the shower until the mirror fogs up? Why?

Urban legend to reduce dust. Also, if it is a humidity problem, to get the humidity up a bit. Probably a pointless exercise.

relistan · Feb 25, 2021

Humidity is not the only factor. As @koraks said, older film tends to do this more. Another data point: I have recently done a lot of reversal processing. This very old Fomapan 400 lies absolutely flat when reversal processed. When processed as a negative I get the usual curling. So I think it must, in part, also have something to do with the changes in the emulsion from different development processes.

otto.f · Feb 26, 2021

Tim Gray said:
most of which is Kodak film

That’s it. Ilford curls less, and ADOX films hardly curl.

radiant · Feb 26, 2021

One trick with Tri-X is to respool the film emulsion side out just after it has dried (probably being a bit moist at that point?). Leave in spool overnight. The film comes out really flat that way.

Pat Erson · Feb 26, 2021

"most of which is Kodak film"

Am I the only to remember those horrible batches of Tri-x 135 that curved like hell, no matter what you did in the darkroom?
When was it? 2013? 2014?

otto.f · Mar 1, 2021

Pat Erson said:
"most of which is Kodak film"

Am I the only to remember those horrible batches of Tri-x 135 that curved like hell, no matter what you did in the darkroom?
When was it? 2013? 2014?

No you are not, before about 2008 TriX hadn’t this problem

eurekaiv · Mar 2, 2021

I might have to try that TX spool trick... that stuff curls on me worse than spring steel. I also find it incredibly difficult to get into a negative carrier for scanning and once in the carrier, it doesn’t lay flat enough for the scanner to maintain focus across the entire frame. HP5+ is perfectly flat every time. I prefer the look of TX by a small margin but basically, as bad as it curls I won’t really buy any more of it once I use up what I have left in a bulk loader.

radiant · Mar 2, 2021

One solution; do not scan - make prints! That is how I have solved all my scanning issues

Alan Edward Klein · Mar 2, 2021

I get my negatives back from pro labs flat. I don't know what they do. Maybe you could call them. It makes it a lot easier to scan although my new V850 has a built-in ANR glass in the film holder to keep them flat.

koraks · Mar 2, 2021

Perhaps it helps if the film is run warm and wet through rollers as a typical minilab does. I'm not going to try that at home though.

eurekaiv · Mar 2, 2021

vedostuu said:
One solution; do not scan - make prints! That is how I have solved all my scanning issues

The community darkrooms are closed due to 'rona or I'd be both scanning and printing.

Curly negatives question

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cliveh

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pentaxuser

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Tim Gray

relistan

otto.f

radiant

Pat Erson

otto.f

eurekaiv

radiant

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eurekaiv

Curly negatives question

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