Crossing over: a challemge

Ornello · Apr 6, 2005

sanking said:
I invite you to take the same challenge. Rent or borrow a 12X20" camera and use it for several months to make platinum/palladium prints and see how your work compares to some of the masters of ULF and Pt./Pd. Do nature work, or haul it around in the street for reportage photography if that is the only thing that turns you on.

You challenge to large format photographers to use a 35mm Leica is rather pointless because most of us, probably well over 95%, gravitated to large format after initially working with 35mm. I personally used only 35mm for the first 15 years of my involvement with photography, and I had several Leica cameras, including an M3 without a meter. I enjoyed it and made a lot of nice images, but eventually I became more interested in different subjects that caused me to move more and more in the direction of large format photography. So in answer to your challenge I have to say, as will a lot of others, been there and done that.

But exactly what is your larger point? Do you not accept the fact that superb work can be done in photography with any type of camera, from an inexpensive Holga or Diana to the most expensive Leica or ULF Ebony? Or do you really believe that the only true path is your way, reportage work with a sleek Leica? If so, you must be a very boring and pathetic person.

Sandy King

It's just a challenge. Personal insults are not appropriate, by the way. I don't have the slightest interest in producing work similar to what is produced by the devotees of LF 'Western ZS Aesthetic'. I find LF in the field terribly limiting. I have a wide variety of lenses, and the portability of the miniature camera allows me to take it anywhere that I can stand or crawl, without a tripod, and to get perspectives that you simply cannot.

I also can take photos in 'real time', which the user of the LF cannot. You are limited to what does not move.

Open the shutter.

Focus.

Adjust swings/tilts.

Refocus.

Close lens.

Insert holder.

Remove dark slide.

Trip shutter.

Replace dark slide.

In other words:

You cannot be serious.....

lee · Apr 6, 2005

I don't have the slightest interest in producing work similar to yours either.

give it a rest

lee\c

Ornello · Apr 6, 2005

lee said:
I don't have the slightest interest in producing work similar to yours either.

give it a rest

lee\c

The 'control' you think you have in LF work is just an illusion. Your time parallax is measured in minutes, not fractions of a second. That's my point.

Secondly, you have not seen 'my work'. I could send you some prints, if you wish.

I quit wearing a cowboy hat when I was 4 years old.

roteague · Apr 6, 2005

Ornello Pederzoli II said:
I also can take photos in 'real time', which the user of the LF cannot. You are limited to what does not move...

Try "pre-visualization".

Look at this image: (there was a url link here which no longer exists)

It was taken with a LF camera. Does it look like I was constrained to "what does not move"? Granted, I couldn't do a second shot seconds later, but I didn't need to, I knew where I wanted the elements to be. FWIW, I shot exclusively 35mm for almost 30 years, before switching to LF.

Ornello · Apr 6, 2005

roteague said:
Try "pre-visualization".

Look at this image: (there was a url link here which no longer exists)

It was taken with a LF camera. Does it look like I was constrained to "what does not move"? Granted, I couldn't do a second shot seconds later, but I didn't need to, I knew where I wanted the elements to be. FWIW, I shot exclusively 35mm for almost 30 years, before switching to LF.

I am unable to view it. Can you send it to me?

John McCallum · Apr 6, 2005

Ornello Pederzoli II said:
This challenge is directed to those who are exclusively LF workers:

Take a walk on the wild side. Get a Leica M3 or M4 (no meter) and force yourself to take photos without a meter, without a tripod, and without taking half a day per shot. Try spontaneous, unfettered street or documentary photography. See how good you really are! Learn to shoot from the seat of your pants, so to speak.

Did it a few days ago, fullfilling all of your criteria other than sans metering (which I don't understand the point of). But it wasn't for the purpose of "taking a walk on the wild side". It was mearly for the fun of photographing without the more rigorous mental activity required of LF photography, in the field. You know, like doing to see a Speilburg or Disney flick after a long day of College lectures.

A couple of my Disney flicks:

(there was a url link here which no longer exists)
(there was a url link here which no longer exists)

Unfortunately Sir, whilst the challenge is probably worthwhile the tone of your posts has little respect for the entitlement of LF photographers to do what they want.
"See how good you really are!" who is to judge how good I am? Who is to say I what need to learn? You?!

What qualifications do you have? Speak up if you dare,

lee · Apr 6, 2005

you can not view the file because you are not a subscriber.

Secondly, you have not seen 'my work'. I could send you some prints, if you wish.

I quit wearing a cowboy hat when I was 4 years old.

first I dont think I need to see your work. I still have a 35mm Leica M3 double stroke. I choose not to use it much. not enough challenge there

and now i see you have decided to make fun of me because I wear a cowboy hat. Tough come on down and take it off me jerk welcome to the ignore file.

lee\c

Ornello · Apr 6, 2005

John McCallum said:
Originally Posted by Ornello Pederzoli II
This challenge is directed to those who are exclusively LF workers:

Take a walk on the wild side. Get a Leica M3 or M4 (no meter) and force yourself to take photos without a meter, without a tripod, and without taking half a day per shot. Try spontaneous, unfettered street or documentary photography. See how good you really are! Learn to shoot from the seat of your pants, so to speak.
Did it a few days ago, fullfilling all of your criteria other than sans metering (which I don't understand the point of). But it wasn't for the purpose of "taking a walk on the wild side". It was mearly for the fun of photographing without the more rigorous mental activity required of LF photography, in the field. You know, like doing to see a Speilburg or Disney flick after a long day of College lectures.

A couple of my Disney flicks:

(there was a url link here which no longer exists)
(there was a url link here which no longer exists)

Unfortunately Sir, whilst the challenge is probably worthwhile the tone of your posts has little respect for the entitlement of LF photographers to do what they want.
"See how good you really are!" who is to judge how good I am? Who is to say I what need to learn? You?!

What qualifications do you have? Speak up if you dare,

More rigorous? Is that a typo? It's different, I'll grant you that. But don't say that to a wedding photographer. He knock your teeth down your throat. (Disclaimer: I am not a wedding photographer.)

Ornello · Apr 6, 2005

lee said:
you can not view the file because you are not a subscriber.

Secondly, you have not seen 'my work'. I could send you some prints, if you wish.

I quit wearing a cowboy hat when I was 4 years old.

first I dont think I need to see your work. I still have a 35mm Leica M3 double stroke. I choose not to use it much. not enough challenge there

and now i see you have decided to make fun of me because I wear a cowboy hat. Tough come on down and take it off me jerk welcome to the ignore file.

lee\c

It was a challenge. You made it a taunt.

John McCallum · Apr 6, 2005

(Disclaimer: I am not a wedding photographer.)

That's odd you really do sound like one. My apologies for any offense that might have been caused, to Wedding Photographers.

Ornello · Apr 6, 2005

John McCallum said:
That's odd you really do sound like one.

Huh? Not me!

roteague · Apr 6, 2005

lee said:
and now i see you have decided to make fun of me because I wear a cowboy hat. Tough come on down and take it off me jerk welcome to the ignore file.

I'll come down and stand with you Lee. I don't have a Stetson, but I have an Akubra. This guy is getting out of hand.

sanking · Apr 6, 2005

Ornello Pederzoli II said:
Personal insults are not appropriate, by the way.

The insult that you perceive was predicated on an if clause. I call this the hypothetical toad bumping its butt, as in "if toads had wings they would not bump their butts." What I said to you was this, "Or do you really believe that the only true path is your way, reportage work with a sleek Leica? If so, you must be a very boring and pathetic person."

The only way you could have found insult from my remark was by agreement with the antecedent, i.e. you really believe that "the only true path is your way, reportage work with a sleek Leica." Since that is obviously the case I do not find the insult that you perceive in any way inappropriate.

Sandy

Ornello · Apr 6, 2005

sanking said:
The insult that you perceive was predicated on an if clause. I call this the hypothetical toad bumping its butt, as in "if toads had wings they would not bump their butts." What I said to you was this, "Or do you really believe that the only true path is your way, reportage work with a sleek Leica? If so, you must be a very boring and pathetic person."

The only way you could have found insult from my remark was by agreement with the antecedent, i.e. you really believe that "the only true path is your way, reportage work with a sleek Leica." Since that is obviously the case I do not find the insult that you perceive in any way inappropriate.

Sandy

Ah, I read too quickly! You are correct! Of course I reject the if-clause.

I just don't want analogue photography to be represented only by 'Western' type LF users who live in Wyoming and take photos of landcsapes....

noseoil · Apr 6, 2005

Why feed the fire?

roteague · Apr 6, 2005

Ornello Pederzoli II said:
I just don't want analogue photography to consist only of cowboy-hat-wearing LF users who live in Wyoming and take photos of landcsapes....

Lee lives in Texas and I live in Hawaii. Lee does a lot more than landscapes, I can tell you - his images of cowboys at work is just outstanding. As for me, I do primarily landscapes and am happy with it.

lee · Apr 6, 2005

It was a challenge. You made it a taunt.

take it as you wish Jerk

lee\c

Ornello · Apr 6, 2005

lee said:
It was a challenge. You made it a taunt.

take it as you wish Jerk

lee\c

Eloquence, dear sir, enobles everyone...

lee · Apr 6, 2005

I just don't want analogue photography to be represented only by 'Western' type LF users who live in Wyoming and take photos of landcsapes....

and no one has said it should be that way you are the only one who seems to be disrespectful of the other types of image making. I dont care how you spend your money taking pictures. It would seem thou that with all the time you spend on line you dont make too many pictures. You just seem to spend your time railing against someone elses right to choose how they spend their time and money

lee\c

mark · Apr 6, 2005

The challenge does not apply to me I guess since I shoot multiple formats and forgo a meter on occasion, and have no desire to own a Leica, but I am somewhat confused as to the reason for it. Shooting without a meter is not difficult nor is 35mm. The way the "challenge" was worded
"See how good you really are!"
Definately sounds like you are placing 35mm reportage photography, or your way of shooting above everyone else. This does seem hypocritical since you have been railing on and on against those who use the ZS because of their arrogance. I can understand a challenge but I am not sure what this is.

Now if you want to mail me a Leica I'll give it a shot.

Donald Miller · Apr 6, 2005

Ornello Pederzoli II said:
Eloquence, dear sir, enobles everyone...

And you, dear sir, flatter yourself.

Jorge · Apr 6, 2005

People, people, remember...when you argue with a moron, people looking at you dont know which is which....ignore list...one more time..ignore list..

Jorge · Apr 6, 2005

One more time...repeat after me...ignore list...

blansky · Apr 6, 2005

Gentlemen and ladies, it appears that what we have here is a person who enjoys spending his time pushing peoples buttons and then pretending to take the high road.

His intent is clear and his tone is that of an person who does not have much of a life.

I suggest we simpy ignore him and let him go on his way.

Michael

roteague · Apr 6, 2005

Jorge said:
One more time...repeat after me...ignore list...

Done!!!! Now, I'm going to work off the anger by lifting weights at the gym.

Crossing over: a challemge

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