Contact printing / adox lupex

Craig75 · Nov 10, 2020

Ive only used 5x4 film to make salt prints but i am interested in making contact prints onto silver gelative paper and adox lupex seems a good way to learn.

What makes contact paper different than enlarging paper?

Does the light source make a difference? Im assuming i can use a bare filament bulb but how would that differ (if at all) to making contact prints under diffusion enlarger light or condenser enlarger light?

I have a pin registration and hole punch with a perspex glass top (the canadian one) that i never had time to learn how to use before i lost my darkroom. Can i use that as a contact frame or will the perspex scatter the light too much (? If thats a thing)

Many thanks in advance. Im sure i had all this info in a book but they got trashed so im totally blind

removed account4 · Nov 10, 2020

hi craig75
from my understanding lupex is a silver chloride paper like azo and lodima so it is very very slow, very much like salt prints. in fact you might think of it as silver gelatin salt print paper they require a very very bright light. I haven't used lupex but if it is like lodima/azo I use a 300Rw bulb about 3feet above the paper. like salt prints you need nice beefy contrasty negative and then bob's your uncle.
this article is for azo but you might find it useful for printing on lupex seeing they are kissing cousins >>>. http://michaelandpaula.com/mp/azoamidol.html
I haven't ever used amidol but some swear by it with silver chloride paper, I use dektol or ansco 130, but you can use anything. many people selenium tone it in a very weak selenium toner..
have fun
John
ps. I can't respond to your perspex frame.. you just need some plate glass, maybe the same set up you use for salt prints.

mshchem · Nov 10, 2020

Contact paper is old school. It was used to print billions of b&w snaps from the beginning up through the 60's. Lupex is an expensive fiber base exhibition quality paper. You might be better off starting with a resin coated paper. The papers like Lupex are wonderful to use, and produce great results.

Craig75 · Nov 10, 2020

Nice. I shall have a read.

Im assuming i need old school filament bulb rather than LED?

I was using a pcb/circuit board printer which had a built in contact frame so thats not a goer but just googling i have an alistair inglis punch and 5x7 registration easel with a perspex cover. Im assuming the perspex diffuses (?) the light for unsharp masks so i should swap it out for glass - seems like the registration pins could be useful for adding burning / dodging masks and keeping everything lined up.

Craig75 · Nov 10, 2020

mshchem said:
Contact paper is old school. It was used to print billions of b&w snaps from the beginning up through the 60's. Lupex is an expensive fiber base exhibition quality paper. You might be better off starting with a resin coated paper. The papers like Lupex are wonderful to use, and produce great results.

Yes no point wasting quality paper on amateur efforts. Do i need to use fixed grade paper or will multigrade and a bare bulb get me around grade 2?

My steowedges could be in one of three places so i cant test it myself

mshchem · Nov 10, 2020

Craig75 said:
Yes no point wasting quality paper on amateur efforts. Do i need to use fixed grade paper or will multigrade and a bare bulb get me around grade 2?

My steowedges could be in one of three places so i cant test it myself

Multi grade papers print normal contrast with a simple incandescent bulb. Contact printing using an enlarger with a color head, or VC head makes anything possible, split grade, high, low etc. You don't need a super slow silver chloride contact paper. However if you look at the prints made with the Lupex/Azo type papers, made by a master printer, who takes advantage of the slow speed to burn and dodge, use toners. These prints stand out.

RalphLambrecht · Nov 10, 2020

Craig75 said:
Ive only used 5x4 film to make salt prints but i am interested in making contact prints onto silver gelative paper and adox lupex seems a good way to learn.

What makes contact paper different than enlarging paper?

Does the light source make a difference? Im assuming i can use a bare filament bulb but how would that differ (if at all) to making contact prints under diffusion enlarger light or condenser enlarger light?

I have a pin registration and hole punch with a perspex glass top (the canadian one) that i never had time to learn how to use before i lost my darkroom. Can i use that as a contact frame or will the perspex scatter the light too much (? If thats a thing)

Many thanks in advance. Im sure i had all this info in a book but they got trashed so im totally blind

Other than being less sensitive than enlarging paper, I don't think there's very little difference between contact and enlarging paper.

koraks · Nov 11, 2020

Craig75 said:
Im assuming i need old school filament bulb rather than LED?

Doesn't matter; any light source will do as long as it has a decent blue component. The paper is likely mostly or even only blue sensitive (although the datasheet doesnt say, unfortunately).

The paper is about 3 stops slower than e.g. Adox MCC which puts it somewhere in the ballpark of warmtone papers such as Fomatone (which is likely a bit faster still than Lupex).

Craig75 · Nov 11, 2020

mshchem said:
Multi grade papers print normal contrast with a simple incandescent bulb. Contact printing using an enlarger with a color head, or VC head makes anything possible, split grade, high, low etc. You don't need a super slow silver chloride contact paper. However if you look at the prints made with the Lupex/Azo type papers, made by a master printer, who takes advantage of the slow speed to burn and dodge, use toners. These prints stand out.

Yes start with resin and work up over time. There will be no master printing going on! I just remembered my fibre washer is in a storage unit anyway so resin is the way to go for me in temp accomodation.

Enlarger would be my immediate choice too for simple reproducible results and filtration but thats in storage too so its going to have to be a bare bulb.

Do people have their fav ways of dodging and burning contact prints? Drawing masks? Using their hands? Other? I only have a 5x4 camera. Hands sounds quite tricky with a contact print and a relatively small image.

This sounds a simple way to make a temporary darkroom with minimal equipment. Quite why i didnt think of this instead of the grind of learning salt printing....

Thanks everyone!

Craig75 · Nov 11, 2020

koraks said:
Doesn't matter; any light source will do as long as it has a decent blue component. The paper is likely mostly or even only blue sensitive (although the datasheet doesnt say, unfortunately).

The paper is about 3 stops slower than e.g. Adox MCC which puts it somewhere in the ballpark of warmtone papers such as Fomatone (which is likely a bit faster still than Lupex).

"Doesnt matter" is my favourite expression in photography. That always equals simpler life.

removed account4 · Nov 11, 2020

RalphLambrecht said:
Other than being less sensitive than enlarging paper, I don't think there's very little difference between contact and enlarging paper.

yup, although silver chloride paper might have a longer tonal range.. I like it because if the negative has the right density it is so easy to contact print and the light is so bright I can get a tan at the same time.

removed account4 · Nov 11, 2020

RalphLambrecht said:
Other than being less sensitive than enlarging paper, I don't think there's very little difference between contact and enlarging paper.

yup, although some suggest silver chloride paper might have a longer tonal range.. I like it because if the negative has the right density it is so easy to contact print and the light is so bright I can get a tan at the same time.

==

Craig75 said:
Do people have their fav ways of dodging and burning contact prints? Drawing masks? Using their hands? Other? I only have a 5x4 camera. Hands sounds quite tricky with a contact print and a relatively small image.

This sounds a simple way to make a temporary darkroom with minimal equipment. Quite why i didnt think of this instead of the grind of learning salt printing....

I just use my hands to burn and dodge. if you are doing / have done salt printing. this will be a walk in the park, its the same but a little different.. you might want to try some of your salt print negatives and see how they look, you might find there is no difference between exposure/processing between the two papers. the light just needs to be bright.. as my uncle said ( about AZO ). you can leave the room and go outside with the light exposing that paper.

have fun !
John

Craig75 · Nov 12, 2020

jnantz said:
yup, although some suggest silver chloride paper might have a longer tonal range.. I like it because if the negative has the right density it is so easy to contact print and the light is so bright I can get a tan at the same time.

==

I just use my hands to burn and dodge. if you are doing / have done salt printing. this will be a walk in the park, its the same but a little different.. you might want to try some of your salt print negatives and see how they look, you might find there is no difference between exposure/processing between the two papers. the light just needs to be bright.. as my uncle said ( about AZO ). you can leave the room and go outside with the light exposing that paper.

have fun !
John

Yes thats a good point. Reading the michaelandpaula page, silver chloride contact paper sounds very much like salt paper - looooong scale, hard to block up shadows, slow etc; im assuming because they both use a simple chloride emulsion but with a different sensitiser and chems to make contact paper have a much longer shelf life than salt paper. (?)

Yes it does sound fun and will take up lot less room than salt printing which seems to sprawl out uncontrollably

removed account4 · Nov 12, 2020

yeah, you will definitely find some similarities. on the upside you gotta make and use salted paper relatively fast, im not sure about lupex, but azo seems to last a long long long time. I've got some from the 1930s/40s and have been printing on it in the last year.

( when I said you may find no difference between exposure and processing, I meant for your film, not the prints .. )

grainyvision · Nov 12, 2020

Is there any contact printing paper other than Lupex still manufactured? I'd definitely like to mess around with a cheaper RC chloride paper. I've coated my own chloride emulsion, which, if you have the room and infrastructure for that can be really nice and is the easiest emulsion to make (little risk of fogging etc, but expect slow enough speeds that enlarger light won't work)... but I have a very limited workspace area for something like that so despite doing it once I'm not doing it again until I get more room.

BTW, to control contrast on regular chloride emulsions, lith printing can give very nice results. My homemade one was a bit too low in contrast, but lith printing made it easy to increase to usable levels given my normal contrast 4x5 negatives

removed account4 · Nov 12, 2020

sometimes there are deals on Eboink but you have to search often. there are some completed auctions right now for paper that sold at an affordable price, and ATM there are like 3-4 500sheet boxes of FB grade 2 4x5 for less than they cost originally.. I have never seen any rc, .. it was sold in Mexico for a long while so who knows what might pop up at the yard sale.

Craig75 · Nov 13, 2020

earlz said:
Is there any contact printing paper other than Lupex still manufactured? I'd definitely like to mess around with a cheaper RC chloride paper. I've coated my own chloride emulsion, which, if you have the room and infrastructure for that can be really nice and is the easiest emulsion to make (little risk of fogging etc, but expect slow enough speeds that enlarger light won't work)... but I have a very limited workspace area for something like that so despite doing it once I'm not doing it again until I get more room.

BTW, to control contrast on regular chloride emulsions, lith printing can give very nice results. My homemade one was a bit too low in contrast, but lith printing made it easy to increase to usable levels given my normal contrast 4x5 negatives

There is Foma Fomalux as well which looks the same thing but that might be discontinued.

Lith is a good idea.... i have tim rudmans lith book. I had the moersch easy lith starter kit too but kept putting it off. A year with no proper darkroom though means i have no excuse not to try now.

The hive mind strikes again

Contact printing / adox lupex

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