Color film suggestion for Grand Canyon and surrounding areas

mtnbkr · Jan 23, 2022

It looks like I'll be taking a trip to the Grand Canyon area this summer. I've never been before, nor have I even been to a desert region (lived my entire life in the Mid-Atlantic and Southern US...lots of green). I'm getting back into film photography after a 10 year absence, but many of the films I used to know and love are gone. Also, even then I wouldn't be sure what's best for that environment.

The camera is a Canon VT rangefinder with a Canon 50mm/1.8 and a Voigtlander 15mm/4.5. Film-wise I mostly shoot B&W and will be taking Fuji Acros II to cover my B&W needs. Since returning to film, the only color I've used is Fuji Superia 400, Lomo Metropolis, and Lomo Purple (the last two being shot in a Hawkeye Brownie box camera). I don't think any of those will be appropriate (though Metropolis could be "interesting").

So...what's a good choice? I'll have a digital camera for "people" photography (family travelogue stuff), so my film choice doesn't have to take skin tones into consideration. Enlargements of photos we like will also be in order if that matters.

Chris

Photomultiplier · Jan 23, 2022

I would like to stand up for Velvia 50 or Provia 100F (if slide Film is an option for you). Even when i started at the age of 17 without much experience, the exposure was easy enough to nail, so there is not much to be afraid of. (Save for bright skies where one better uses a Grad-Filter of about 2 Stops or polarizer)
Provia 100F is more neutral and a bit less temperamental regarding contrast while Velvia 50 has an color rendition that is a league of its own.
If you like to use negative film, my choice would be Ektar 100. The colors look great, almost like slide film.
But anyway, trying a roll of Velvia/Provia is always a good idea, just because the breathtaking colors and the experience of viewing such a brilliant colored positive. Plus you do not have to worry about inversion, you see exactly what you get.

Alex Burke has a nice info page about color film for landscape uses (both slide and negative):
https://www.alexburkephoto.com/blog/2013/02/25/color-film-choices-for-landscapes

Chris

Paul Howell · Jan 23, 2022

If you are traveling with access to refrigeration I recommend taking both Ektar 100 and Porta 400, Ektar is snappy higher contrast while Porta is lower contrast good for shots of the canyon at sunset or sunrise. Having both will give you flexibility depending on the lighting. If you are going to be on the road without access to refrigeration Kodacolor 200 Color +, Color + is designed to be used in hot climates without refrigeration.

mtnbkr · Jan 23, 2022

Photomultiplier said:
I would like to stand up for Velvia 50 or Provia 100F (if slide Film is an option for you). Even when i started at the age of 17 without much experience, the exposure was easy enough to nail, so there is not much to be afraid of. (Save for bright skies where one better uses a Grad-Filter of about 2 Stops or polarizer)
Provia 100F is more neutral and a bit less temperamental regarding contrast while Velvia 50 has an color rendition that is a league of its own.
If you like to use negative film, my choice would be Ektar 100. The colors look great, almost like slide film.
But anyway, trying a roll of Velvia/Provia is always a good idea, just because the breathtaking colors and the experience of viewing such a brilliant colored positive. Plus you do not have to worry about inversion, you see exactly what you get.

Alex Burke has a nice info page about color film for landscape uses (both slide and negative):
https://www.alexburkephoto.com/blog/2013/02/25/color-film-choices-for-landscapes

Chris

I'll be going with negative film. I've probably shot 10 rolls of slide film in my life and I don't have a light table, scanner (yet at least), or projector. Prints are easier to view and share with family.

Thanks for the link, I found the descriptions and example photos very useful. Ektar100 looks good and was on my tentative list already.

Chris

mtnbkr · Jan 23, 2022

Paul Howell said:
If you are traveling with access to refrigeration I recommend taking both Ektar 100 and Porta 400, Ektar is snappy higher contrast while Porta is lower contrast good for shots of the canyon at sunset or sunrise. Having both will give you flexibility depending on the lighting. If you are going to be on the road without access to refrigeration Kodacolor 200 Color +, Color + is designed to be used in hot climates without refrigeration.

Except at the hotel, I won't have access to refrigeration. I suppose a cooler would work, but since we're flying out, I don't know what we'll have in that regard.
How sensitive are those film to heat? What's likely to happen?

Chris

Wallendo · Jan 23, 2022

I don’t think Superia 400 is necessarily a bad choice. It may be more grainy than the “professional” films, but will have great color.

i personally would go with E-6 (slide) film. Portra 400 is a safe choice. With an older rangefinder without the high shutter speeds of modern cameras, Portra 400 would force you to shoot with a closed down aperture (f11 or f16). I tend to shoot around f8 and would more likely choose Portra 160.

Ektar 100 is a great colorful film, and would be my choice if a needed to shoot print film. It can be finicky and I would highly recommend shooting a roll or two before your trip to see if it works well for you.

in fact, whatever you choose, shoot a few rolls before your trip. My feeling is that once-in-a-lifetime images should not be attempted with new equipment or films.

bdial · Jan 23, 2022

you may well want to travel with a small cooler anyway for having some cool water and or snacks on hand.
Exposing the film to excessive heat for a prolonged time is likely to cause some color shift. But it’s not hard to protect it adequately. It doesn’t need refrigeration.
For traveling around the desert, make sure you always have some water with you.

destroya · Jan 23, 2022

if has to be a neg film, then I would go with ektar or portra 160. a 400 speed film will be to fast in the bright light of the grand canyon, unless you like shooting at F11 or 16 all day. I would bring a roll of velvia 50 if you have one, just to see what the results are. I love how the orange/copper color rocks come out with it

Alan Edward Klein · Jan 23, 2022

Ektar 100 is a nice film. But if you're shooting by hand without a tripod, it may not be fast enough especially during magic hour - an hour after sunrise and an hour before sunset when the lighting is great but you need slower shutter speeds. I would take a small travel tripod with you regardless of the film you finally decide on.

Paul Howell · Jan 23, 2022

Ektar and Porta are professional films and subject to color shifts if not refrigerated. I live in the desert and have shot both Kodak and Fuji pro level color films without having access to refrigeration, at the end of a two week shoot there was notifiable color shift. If you are flying you might want to read up on the new airport scanners, make sure you have your film in a separate bag and have it hand checked, keep your film out of the scanner. A cooler will work, you can use ice or reusable freezer bottles. I would use a consumer grade film, these films are designed for storage without refrigeration. Saying that, if you are going to scan rather than print, I would expect that any color issues can be dealt in post. Any, in addition your Acros, I would take a couple rolls of Tmax 400 or Trix, allow to shoot hand held in dimmer light. And takes filters, yellow, green orange, and polarizer.

runswithsizzers · Jan 23, 2022

I'd take Ektar and / or Portra. As others have noted, it would be good to try a few test rolls beforehand. I usually visit the desert lands of the American SW in September/October. Starting in about mid-July until the end of September there are many days that start in the mornings with a clear blue sky - then clouds appear in the afternoon - which sometimes develop into thunderstorms. There will be some/many afternoons with white puffy clouds/thunderheads that can be dramatic against the blue sky. You have seen enough photographs of the Grand Canyon to know the predominant colors of the rocks will be various shades of red, orange and yellow - and I believe Ektar might do well there. But while I have spent a fair bit of time photographing the desert SW, my experence has been limited to slide film and digital, so I'm guessing about color negative film.

I doubt if you will want to use a polarizing filter on your rangefinder, but with a polarizing filter, even Portra 160 can be very colorful. And with a polarizing filter, Ektar can be almost too much! <example 1> <example 2>

I don't know if your itiinerary is set, but I would recommend the North Rim over the South rim, if that is an option. The higher elevation makes the North Rim a little cooler in the summer, and there is less crowding (tho it is still plenty crowded). But, depending on your connections, it is more difficult to get there.

braxus · Jan 23, 2022

I was at the Grand Canyon 10 years ago, back in 2012. You have to cut through some haze to get colors that show up, or it will just look washed out. The only two films I'd use to do this would be Velvia 50 or Ektar 100. You need to bring the colors and contrast up a bit. I also shot digital, and I really had to crank up the levels for it to really look good. With film, you usually are stuck with the look of the film, unless you manipulate afterwards. I wouldn't suggest Portra (its too muted in contrast and color). Gold 200 would work too, but you want finer grain then that.

mtnbkr · Jan 23, 2022

Wallendo said:
I don’t think Superia 400 is necessarily a bad choice. It may be more grainy than the “professional” films, but will have great color.

i personally would go with E-6 (slide) film. Portra 400 is a safe choice. With an older rangefinder without the high shutter speeds of modern cameras, Portra 400 would force you to shoot with a closed down aperture (f11 or f16). I tend to shoot around f8 and would more likely choose Portra 160.

Ektar 100 is a great colorful film, and would be my choice if a needed to shoot print film. It can be finicky and I would highly recommend shooting a roll or two before your trip to see if it works well for you.

in fact, whatever you choose, shoot a few rolls before your trip. My feeling is that once-in-a-lifetime images should not be attempted with new equipment or films.

I'm not opposed to Superia, I happen to like it, but I was thinking a finer grained film might be better for this trip.

I did some digging around at The Darkroom, where I send my film to be developed, and they appear to charge the same for slide film as negative, including printing, so I may go with slide film after all. It'll be easier to pick out images for enlargements.

Chris

mtnbkr · Jan 23, 2022

bdial said:
you may well want to travel with a small cooler anyway for having some cool water and or snacks on hand.
Exposing the film to excessive heat for a prolonged time is likely to cause some color shift. But it’s not hard to protect it adequately. It doesn’t need refrigeration.
For traveling around the desert, make sure you always have some water with you.

We'll probably have a cooler, but I'm not bringing one from home, so I can't be certain what we'll have. This is actually 3 families ranging from young children to adults in their 70s. We'll have water, snacks, etc.

Chris

mtnbkr · Jan 23, 2022

Alan Edward Klein said:
I would take a small travel tripod with you regardless of the film you finally decide on.

Got one and it'll be going with us.

Chris

mtnbkr · Jan 23, 2022

Paul Howell said:
Ektar and Porta are professional films and subject to color shifts if not refrigerated. I live in the desert and have shot both Kodak and Fuji pro level color films without having access to refrigeration, at the end of a two week shoot there was notifiable color shift. If you are flying you might want to read up on the new airport scanners, make sure you have your film in a separate bag and have it hand checked, keep your film out of the scanner. A cooler will work, you can use ice or reusable freezer bottles. I would use a consumer grade film, these films are designed for storage without refrigeration. Saying that, if you are going to scan rather than print, I would expect that any color issues can be dealt in post. Any, in addition your Acros, I would take a couple rolls of Tmax 400 or Trix, allow to shoot hand held in dimmer light. And takes filters, yellow, green orange, and polarizer.

Is heat a problem if it's just an hour or two at a time? I doubt we'll be out in the canyon the entire time given the diversity of ages, capabilities, and interests.

The issue with the airport scanners is another one. I need to get educated on that since I haven't flown with film since before 9/11/01 (really!).

Chris

Sirius Glass · Jan 23, 2022

I would not worry about keeping the film cool except in the car. An ice or food chest would provide heat insulation. Do not go overboard or over think this.

Regardless of film use UV or haze filters to cut the haze. Polarizing filters can increase the intensity of the colors and bring out the clouds so check the effect with and without it. And use lens hoods.

For color prints I would recommend Ektar 100 and Portra 160 or 400.

mtnbkr · Jan 23, 2022

runswithsizzers said:
I'd take Ektar and / or Portra. As others have noted, it would be good to try a few test rolls beforehand. I usually visit the desert lands of the American SW in September/October. Starting in about mid-July until the end of September there are many days that start in the mornings with a clear blue sky - then clouds appear in the afternoon - which sometimes develop into thunderstorms. There will be some/many afternoons with white puffy clouds/thunderheads that can be dramatic against the blue sky. You have seen enough photographs of the Grand Canyon to know the predominant colors of the rocks will be various shades of red, orange and yellow - and I believe Ektar might do well there. But while I have spent a fair bit of time photographing the desert SW, my experence has been limited to slide film and digital, so I'm guessing about color negative film.

I doubt if you will want to use a polarizing filter on your rangefinder, but with a polarizing filter, even Portra 160 can be very colorful. And with a polarizing filter, Ektar can be almost too much! <example 1> <example 2>

I don't know if your itiinerary is set, but I would recommend the North Rim over the South rim, if that is an option. The higher elevation makes the North Rim a little cooler in the summer, and there is less crowding (tho it is still plenty crowded). But, depending on your connections, it is more difficult to get there.

Thanks. We'll be there in June. It's those colors that is making me consider color film. I mainly shoot B&W in my film cameras and rely on my digital camera for color work. But, I want to see if I can get some good wide angle shots on film with that 15mm lens.

Polarizers and other filters in general are challenging with the rangefinder. The Canon lens is an odd size I can 't seem to find anywhere and the Voigtlander lens simply doesn't have the capability.

The itinerary is still being discussed. One of the three families has been there before, but it'll be the first time for the rest of us.

Chris

mtnbkr · Jan 23, 2022

Sirius Glass said:
Regardless of film use UV or haze filters to cut the haze. Polarizing filters can increase the intensity of the colors and bring out the clouds so check the effect with and without it. And use lens hoods.

My two lenses are going to make that challenging. One is an odd size and the other doesn't have filter threads. I can improvise, but it make take three hands.

Chris

Sirius Glass · Jan 23, 2022

mtnbkr said:
My two lenses are going to make that challenging. One is an odd size and the other doesn't have filter threads. I can improvise, but it make take three hands.

Chris

Do not bother with three hands. If you are going to modify your body, go directly to four hands since the cost and recovery time are about the same either way.

runswithsizzers · Jan 23, 2022

mtnbkr said:
Thanks. We'll be there in June. It's those colors that is making me consider color film. I mainly shoot B&W in my film cameras and rely on my digital camera for color work. But, I want to see if I can get some good wide angle shots on film with that 15mm lens.

Polarizers and other filters in general are challenging with the rangefinder. The Canon lens is an odd size I can 't seem to find anywhere and the Voigtlander lens simply doesn't have the capability.

The itinerary is still being discussed. One of the three families has been there before, but it'll be the first time for the rest of us.

Chris

The "b&w-for-film-and-digital-for-color" strategy is probably a good one. Been thinking along the same lines, myself. And it is certainly more practical to use a polarizer on a camera with through-the-lens viewing (if you have one)!

Honestly - and I am not trying to start trouble here - but if you are traveling with a group of that size, family obligations, etc. - then I would probably suggest concentrating more on enjoying the experience, and less on trying to do "serious" photography. If you can get away by yourself for a few hours, then by all means, enjoy your primes and film. But when traveling with a large family group, I'd be more inclined to settle for a single camera plus a single lens (all-purpose zoom?), and keep things simple. We all know "that look" you get from your significant-other when you are digging around in the camera bag while the rest of the group is ready to move on. ;-)

Paul Howell · Jan 23, 2022

It will simplify your workflow to bring just B&W film, but if this is a once in a lifetime trip, get a LSM wide that will take filters. Canon, Minolta, Leica, all made pretty good 28 and 35mm 3.5 to 2.8 that are not all that expensive. For black and white you will want contrast filters and a U.V haze filter.

Alan9940 · Jan 23, 2022

I'd highly recommend Porta 400 for two reasons: 1) it handles higher contrast scenes very well (gets kinida sunny out here in the desert!) and 2) the color rendition of that film is simply a "marriage made in heaven" for our earthy color tones IMO. You didn't mention if you'll be hiking any, but, regardless, make sure you have PLENTY of water with you when out and about. It's so dry here that you'll sweat and not even know it. Good luck and have fun!

Sirius Glass · Jan 23, 2022

Sirius Glass said:
I would not worry about keeping the film cool except in the car. An ice or food chest would provide heat insulation. Do not go overboard or over think this.

Regardless of film use UV or haze filters to cut the haze. Polarizing filters can increase the intensity of the colors and bring out the clouds so check the effect with and without it. And use lens hoods.

For color prints I would recommend Ektar 100 and Portra 160 or 400.

Additional comment: Portra 400 will cover the great Subject Brightness Range [SBR] and if you take your light readings without the sky in view*, then you will get more shadows and more color depth.

* A method I always use. It works by the way very well with slides.

Tony-S · Jan 23, 2022

Ektar 100 + tripod + polarizer. If you also expect waterfalls add a 3-stop neutral density filter.

Color film suggestion for Grand Canyon and surrounding areas

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