Collecting Also Ran

Paul Howell · Jun 21, 2011

I have a few Mirandas and now want to add to my collection of also ran 35mm SLRs from the 60 and 70s, thinking about Kowa, Peti, Topcon 100 or unxi, will not include any brand still around like Nikon and Canon, or cameras that were pretty well make such as Minolta or Konica both of which lated until the 2000 in one form or another?

Neanderman · Jun 21, 2011

Mamiya-Sekor. My first SLR.

Shawn Rahman · Jun 21, 2011

I've heard great things about Praktica Super TLs, especially with the Zeiss lenses. I think the shutter release position is pretty cool on these.

Paul Howell · Jun 21, 2011

Shawn Rahman said:
I've heard great things about Praktica Super TLs, especially with the Zeiss lenses. I think the shutter release position is pretty cool on these.

I had not thought of Praktica, one of the early models had a motor drive. From I read quailty was poor, will add to my list along with the Mamyia, both 42mm and the later AX mount.

tomalophicon · Jun 21, 2011

Not sure how old they are the Yashica SLRs were a bit also ran in my opinion.

tony lockerbie · Jun 21, 2011

You can't go wrong with the Petri's, especially the earlier models. They are interesting looking, and most important, quite extinct! The only problem is finding one that still works, not easy! I have a couple of the Kowas, ditto with the working bit.
There are the Yashica TL's and the Mamiyas already mentioned, but I wouldn't really consider them also rans.

MattKing · Jun 21, 2011

Chinon and Zenit are two that I would consider adding to the list.

Diapositivo · Jun 21, 2011

Exacta (or what was sold with the Exacta brand in the Eighties).

I don't consider Fuji (Fujifilm) SLR of the Eighties "also ran" but that depends on the overtone of the expression. They were high quality professional gear, but did not manage to succeed. Rolleiflex 35mm SLR could also be considered depending on what you mean.

There were some AGFA SLR (or so branded) in the Eighties, with the typical big red shutter release, if I didn't dream about them.

The last Alpa (not the "Made in Switzerland" ones) could also be considered in this category.

Anyway Miranda and Topcon also produced top-of-line material. I remember a person, a family friend, with a Miranda with removable pentaprism (not an obvious feature).

So if top quality is not excluded, Alpa, Contax, Leica and Rolleiflex could be in your collection, which you could rename as "also expensive"

elcabezagrande · Jun 21, 2011

For SLR only, the Kodak Retina Reflex could also be considered an "also ran", the Kodak SLR never really caught on. Chinon could be considered as well.

Paul Howell · Jun 22, 2011

I am not condsidering quailty, just that the camera for what ever reason did not last, was sort of odd in some way and I can pick one up on the cheap. I would like an Aplha but doubt that I can afford one. I have several Chinons in both 42mm and K mount, a 3 pin Mamyia 42mm for open apature metering. So I will add Rolli SL35, not the upscale Rolli 2000 (?) which were make in such small numbers I doubt I can find one or afford it. 42mm Yaschia is good, the Topcon 100 with leaf shutter not the pro level Ds. Kowa and East German cameras. Fuji is a toss up. Great lens.

I have a brace of Mirandas, good quailty, the EE had both spot and average metering, nice range of accessories. I talked with one the folks who worked for the American company that owned Soilgar and Mirdanda a couple of years ago, she stated that the lens were made by Kowa and Kiron. Never able to confirm.

jeffreyg · Jun 22, 2011

I believe that Sears sold a rebranded Pentax in the 60's or 70's.

http://www.jeffreyglasser.com/

Paul VanAudenhove · Jun 22, 2011

There was an Argus/Cosina available in the '70s.

Paul Howell · Jun 22, 2011

jeffreyg said:
I believe that Sears sold a rebranded Pentax in the 60's or 70's.

http://www.jeffreyglasser.com/

The 42mm mounts I have seem branded Sears appeared to be Rioch. Rioch did make an odd 42mm, the 450 (?), had spot metering and a really small waist level view finder built in the eye level, switch on the side moved a small mirror. I dont know made the Sears K mounts, they seem to match up with the Pentax K models. I should add Sears and Penneys to my list.

elcabezagrande · Jun 22, 2011

The Sears K mount cameras are also rebranded Ricohs. JCPenney used to sell Practika cameras with their house brand on them. Montgomery Ward sold rebadged Konicas.

ic-racer · Jun 22, 2011

Fuji 801 and Fuji EBC screw mount lenses of the era would make a nice addition to anyone's collection.

Ian Grant · Jun 22, 2011

Another vote for the Chinon's 70's/early 80's. I had 2 a CE-4 & CE-4s and loved them the f1.4 & f1.8 standard lenses were superb. I lent mine with power winders & my Vivitar S1 70-210 f2.8 to a friend shooting the Le Mans 24hr race for Lucas (then a major UK motor parts manufacturer) and they were out performing Nikons and Canons. Lucas were pleased with the images and he got plenty of work plus the calendar contracts for the next few years

Ian

BobD · Jun 22, 2011

I also like the road-less-traveled approach to SLR collecting. In the German corner
I have an Agfaflex (with 3 lenses now), a Selectaflex, an Icarex TM and a couple
Edixa-flexes.

In the Japanese flavor I have a Yashica Pentamatic (1st model) with 2 lenses.
There were 3 Pentamatic models. These cameras used a unique bayonet lens
mount shared by no other cameras. Yashica made about a half dozen lenses for
them and there were a few third party lenses and adapters made for them too.
Pentamatics don't usually cost much but finding lenses other than 50mm can be a
challenge as not many were made. They are well made cameras, Yashica's first
35mm SLRs, not to be confused with the "Penta J" camera which has an M42 mount.

elcabezagrande · Jun 22, 2011

BobD said:
In the Japanese flavor I have a Yashica Pentamatic (1st model) with 2 lenses.
There were 3 Pentamatic models. These cameras used a unique bayonet lens
mount shared by no other cameras. Yashica made about a half dozen lenses for
them and there were a few third party lenses and adapters made for them too.
Pentamatics don't usually cost much but finding lenses other than 50mm can be a
challenge as not many were made. They are well made cameras, Yashica's first
35mm SLRs, not to be confused with the "Penta J" camera which has an M42 mount.

Bob, I like the Yashica M42 mount cameras, particularily the TL Electro X. Several months ago, while scouring the eBay listings for Yashinon lenses, I stumbled across a Yashinon-R version of the fantastic lens discussed in this thread on mflenses forum:

http://forum.mflenses.com/kyoei-acall-180-3-5-m42-a-rare-lens-t14579,highlight,kyoei+acall.html

the Yashinon-R (Yashica "Y" mount) 180mm, 1:3.5, with 12-blade aperture. From the pictures posted in the above thread, this lens might be well worth seeking out for your Pentamatic.

Excalibur2 · Jun 23, 2011

Well I have a Centon K100 that has a PK mount......I think the rumour is:- that it is a copy of a Pentax made in China or Korea.

Diapositivo · Jun 23, 2011

It probably does not fit with the requirement of being cheap, but the Rectaflex fills the other requirements. The first and last and only Italian SLR. Not just that, Roman too!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rectaflex

I saw only one of them in my life, in Germany in the Eighties, at the neck of a lucky and proud owner. They really are collectors' items now.

TheFlyingCamera · Jun 23, 2011

What about Exactas? There seem to be tons of them around on the used market, usually for pretty cheap. Also the Contaflexes.

Paul Howell · Jun 23, 2011

Ian Grant said:
Another vote for the Chinon's 70's/early 80's. I had 2 a CE-4 & CE-4s and loved them the f1.4 & f1.8 standard lenses were superb. I lent mine with power winders & my Vivitar S1 70-210 f2.8 to a friend shooting the Le Mans 24hr race for Lucas (then a major UK motor parts manufacturer) and they were out performing Nikons and Canons. Lucas were pleased with the images and he got plenty of work plus the calendar contracts for the next few years

Ian

I also have a CM and CE 3 with the winder and a 50 1.7 Marco lens, lastest marco lens I have seen. The CE 3 was sold under the GAF label, I think it is a better camera than the ES. The winder is just ok, sounds like a sewing machine.

I will look for Yashcia, still debating Fuji, some models were a little odd, top shutter speed 1/700. But geat glass. I guess if were collecting cars I would have Yugos and Pintos.

Ian Grant · Jun 23, 2011

Like Scott (thefyingcamera) I do like Exacta's, they are fun to use and there's plenty about still in good working order. and you can build up a good system for not too big an outlay. There's a wide array of lenses from a variety of manufacturers for them as well.

More collectible are the lesser known Praktina's made by KW and originally designed while under the ownership of Charles Noble a German born American. (Quite an interesting story in itself worth looking up). Under communist control the company was merged with Zeiss Contax to form Praktica, and they intern later absorbed Exacta,

The Praktina was the first full 35mm SLR system to have a motor drive, you sometimes see system parts selling for high prices to collectors at camera fairs.

Ian

Paul Howell · Jun 23, 2011

Ian Grant said:
Like Scott (thefyingcamera) I do like Exacta's, they are fun to use and there's plenty about still in good working order. and you can build up a good system for not too big an outlay. There's a wide array of lenses from a variety of manufacturers for them as well.

More collectible are the lesser known Praktina's made by KW and originally designed while under the ownership of Charles Noble a German born American. (Quite an interesting story in itself worth looking up). Under communist control the company was merged with Zeiss Contax to form Praktica, and they intern later absorbed Exacta,

The Praktina was the first full 35mm SLR system to have a motor drive, you sometimes see system parts selling for high prices to collectors at camera fairs.

Ian

Was Pentacon and Praktina make by the same company? I have Exacta on my list as well, one of the later models from the 70s.

Ian Grant · Jun 23, 2011

For legal reasons the original East German part - Zeiss Ikon VEB had to drop the name Contax for their SLR cameras after WWII as the rights to trade names in the West was given to the new Zeiss Ikon in West Germany. So the East German Contax became the Pentacon, the Praktina evolved into the Practiflex the merged company VEB Pentacon made Praktica's but also used the name Pentacon on some cameras and later Meyer lenses.

Zeiss in both the East & West hoped to remerge and so there were still some links in the late 40's until the mid 50's and some inter trading. CZJ made some lenses for the west and it's thought some Opton lenses for Rollei's were re-badged after passing the West German quality controls.

Ian

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