Clueless Film Noob

ZENGHOST · Jul 9, 2014

Hey, just your (below) average film noob here and thought I'd introduce myself since I'm probably gonna have lots of dumb questions. So I really have no film experience, save a Canon Elph APS 370z that I had in the 90's and more recently a Superheadz Slim and Wide that I picked up last year (fun, plastic camera). I've been a digital shooter for over 10 years now, but after picking up the Superheadz, I started to think about picking up something that I could actually control but never got around to it. Unfortunately it came up again when my Canon 1DIV got stolen from the trunk of my car just before Christmas last year and I was without a camera for a couple of months. During that time I pulled my dad's old camera stuff out of storage and started messing around with it. It was an old Nikon F2 that had belonged to my grandfather before my father and that my dad used to take pics of my sister and I growing up. I remember that I hated sitting still for all those pics and now I'm the one taking the pics. I did pick up a Canon 1DX to replace my stolen cam and got sidetracked again, but have recently been looking at film once again. I doubt that F2 will ever replace my 1DX, but I feel like I need to at least explore the film world. My dad also noticed me messing around with his old stuff and went to grab my late uncle's photo stuff for me to look at and I've now inherited a Mamiya RB67 Professional to play with. So after putting it off for months, I finally sent my F2 out to get "Soverized" and am looking forward to getting that back. I think I do need to have someone look at the lenses I have, though, since they could probably use some servicing. For the Mamiya, it could use some TLC since it's got all sorts of crap inside the body so if anyone has any advice on where to send it (as well as the lenses), I'd appreciate it. I just purchased a Polaroid back for it off of eBay and a bunch of instant film (FP-100C, FP-100B and FP-3000B) and will hopefully be experimenting with those soon. The funny thing is that I've gotten so caught up with this stuff that I went out and bought a Zeiss Ikon Ikonta 523/2 6x9 folder f4.5 / 105mm Novar off of eBay so that will be coming to me shortly as well. So I haven't even taken a single shot with film yet, but have all this film and have been looking constantly at cameras. I don't see myself going all film at any point, but I certainly have caught the bug for now and I'll just have to see how long it lasts. Sorry for being so long-winded, hopefully you are still conscious after reading my autobiography.

shutterboy · Jul 9, 2014

Before I comment about whether you are dumb or not, I must say you are stinking rich at least. BTW welcome to APUG.

dehk · Jul 9, 2014

Well you might as well start shooting it, since you have em.

Jeff Kubach · Jul 10, 2014

Welcome to APUG! You ought to use film more, it is a lot more fun.

Jeff

ZENGHOST · Jul 10, 2014

Thanks for the welcome.

Shutterbug--if only that were true. My purchases are a combination of saving, credit card and bill me later

dehk--I plan to but the only one I'm in possession of right now is the Mamiya and I'm still trying to figure out how to use it (or if it even still works). I'm still watching tutorials on it.

Jeff--thanks. Hopefully it's more fun than frustrating.

jcc · Jul 10, 2014

Might want to keep an eye out for a Canon 1V (or 1V HS). You'll be able to use your EF lenses (I assume you have some), and the controls will be pretty much the same as your 1D-bodies.

ZENGHOST · Jul 10, 2014

jcc said:
Might want to keep an eye out for a Canon 1V (or 1V HS). You'll be able to use your EF lenses (I assume you have some), and the controls will be pretty much the same as your 1D-bodies.

cool, thanks for the info.

Jaf-Photo · Jul 10, 2014

ZENGHOST said:
Thanks for the welcome.

Shutterbug--if only that were true. My purchases are a combination of saving, credit card and bill me later

Well, you have to be rich to get credit these days

The Mamiya is s great camera. My suggestion would be to start with that and see if you enjoy the whole analog process.

If the bug bites you, then you should look for an analog EOS body that is compatible with your, no doubt impressive, array of L-lenses.

Cheers!

pentaxpete · Jul 10, 2014

Blimey !! ( 'London-Speak' for Goodness Gracious ) -- you are very lucky to start with such gear -- I started in 1951 with my Mum's Kodak Hawkeye Box Camera which she got by saving up 'Black Cat' Cigarette coupons in the 1930's ( as she didn't smoke it took a LONG TIME!)
Over here in UK FILM was a rareity after the war as all production went to the Armed Forces -- it was only ten years later that we could get film and one roll cost a week's pocket money for me !! I used to cycle round all the Chemists shops asking if they had any 'Outdated film cheap for a poor Schoolboy' and got a lot of Kodak Verichrome and Ilford FP3 and Selochrome for 6 pence a roll 120 size!

Xmas · Jul 10, 2014

ZENGHOST said:
Thanks for the welcome.

Shutterbug--if only that were true. My purchases are a combination of saving, credit card and bill me later

dehk--I plan to but the only one I'm in possession of right now is the Mamiya and I'm still trying to figure out how to use it (or if it even still works). I'm still watching tutorials on it.

Jeff--thanks. Hopefully it's more fun than frustrating.

Down load the user manual - Free
http://www.butkus.org/chinon/mamiya/mamiya_rb67_pro-s/mamiya_rb67_pro_s.htm

buy some cheap film
http://www.ilfordphoto.com/aboutus/page.asp?n=31

Do an art course

Jaf-Photo · Jul 10, 2014

pentaxpete said:
Blimey !! ( 'London-Speak' for Goodness Gracious ) -- you are very lucky to start with such gear -- I started in 1951 with my Mum's Kodak Hawkeye Box Camera which she got by saving up 'Black Cat' Cigarette coupons in the 1930's ( as she didn't smoke it took a LONG TIME!)
Over here in UK FILM was a rareity after the war as all production went to the Armed Forces -- it was only ten years later that we could get film and one roll cost a week's pocket money for me !! I used to cycle round all the Chemists shops asking if they had any 'Outdated film cheap for a poor Schoolboy' and got a lot of Kodak Verichrome and Ilford FP3 and Selochrome for 6 pence a roll 120 size!

Reminds me of that Monty Python piece about living in a shoe box on the motorway

Kyle M. · Jul 10, 2014

If your anything like me you'll soon find that the Mamiya is your favorite, get yourself a good hand held light meter (if you don't already have one) and tripod, and you'll be set. I've only been shooting film for a little over a year and developing my own B&W the whole time and I've tried about 20 different cameras, the Mamiya is the only one thats kept me interested the whole time. I had a Nikon F2 for awhile but got away from 35mm to stick with medium format, and I actually just sold my 6x9 Ikonta to a friend yesterday. Got myself down to just the RB67 so I cn concentrate on that, theres just so much you can do with it, and it has amazing macro capabilities especially with extension tubes or the 50mm lens.

shutterboy · Jul 10, 2014

Kyle M. said:
I actually just sold my 6x9 Ikonta to a friend yesterday.

Even I would just stick to my Hasselblad 501cm. But I keep shooting 35mm on my Canon 1V because for street shots and likes, I need autofocus.:confused:

Except Zeiss, and a Canon macro, I do not think any of the common lenses were manufactured keeping manual focus in mind (long throw et all).

jcc · Jul 10, 2014

Also, I just noticed your location, have you checked out the Treehouse over on Ward (if you're on Oahu)?

ZENGHOST · Jul 10, 2014

Jaf-Photo said:
Well, you have to be rich to get credit these days

The Mamiya is s great camera. My suggestion would be to start with that and see if you enjoy the whole analog process.

If the bug bites you, then you should look for an analog EOS body that is compatible with your, no doubt impressive, array of L-lenses.

Cheers!

True, luckily I think I built up most of my credit before my photography addiction .

I think I'm looking forward to the Mamiya the most because of the polaroid back and the bigger negatives with medium format. I'm also hearing good things about bokeh/shallow DOF compared to 35mm.

I don't know about an impressive array, but that would be cool if I could use some of those with film.

pentaxpete said:
Blimey !! ( 'London-Speak' for Goodness Gracious ) -- you are very lucky to start with such gear -- I started in 1951 with my Mum's Kodak Hawkeye Box Camera which she got by saving up 'Black Cat' Cigarette coupons in the 1930's ( as she didn't smoke it took a LONG TIME!)
Over here in UK FILM was a rareity after the war as all production went to the Armed Forces -- it was only ten years later that we could get film and one roll cost a week's pocket money for me !! I used to cycle round all the Chemists shops asking if they had any 'Outdated film cheap for a poor Schoolboy' and got a lot of Kodak Verichrome and Ilford FP3 and Selochrome for 6 pence a roll 120 size!

Yeah, I had a lot of stuff fall into my lap. I also have a couple of Olympus XA's to mess around with too. Have to check if those are functioning properly. If it was as big of a struggle for me to get supplies as you had, I would never have gotten started.

Xmas said:
Down load the user manual - Free
http://www.butkus.org/chinon/mamiya/mamiya_rb67_pro-s/mamiya_rb67_pro_s.htm

buy some cheap film
http://www.ilfordphoto.com/aboutus/page.asp?n=31

Do an art course

Thanks for the links. Will take a look through the manual. I'm more of a visual learner so youtube stuff has been great too, and there's so much info that I've been sifting through online. All part of the experience, though. At least there's tons more resources available than when I first got into photography.

I've picked a bunch of rolls of both 35mm and 120 in addition to the instant stuff. I've got a range of brands and ISO's--some Ektar, Ilford, Superia and Portra. Want to pick up some Velvia to mess around with too. Hopefully I can figure out which ones I like best.

Art course isn't really possible with my schedule right now, but I definitely want to do some in the future.

Kyle M. said:
If your anything like me you'll soon find that the Mamiya is your favorite, get yourself a good hand held light meter (if you don't already have one) and tripod, and you'll be set. I've only been shooting film for a little over a year and developing my own B&W the whole time and I've tried about 20 different cameras, the Mamiya is the only one thats kept me interested the whole time. I had a Nikon F2 for awhile but got away from 35mm to stick with medium format, and I actually just sold my 6x9 Ikonta to a friend yesterday. Got myself down to just the RB67 so I cn concentrate on that, theres just so much you can do with it, and it has amazing macro capabilities especially with extension tubes or the 50mm lens.

Thanks, I hope that the Mamiya is more or less functioning because it's so heavy, that it's gonna cost a fortune just to ship it out. I would definitely like to get it cleaned up at some point, though. I'm open to any pointers on using the Mamiya (or anything, really). Do you use yours for landscape or portraits or both? I'm looking forward to trying it for portraits, but at some point want to explore landscapes with it, although the Ikonta is what I got for landscapes since it's a bit more portable. Was there something you didn't like about the Ikonta?

Luckily I have a Sekonic L-358 that is way more light meter than I need anyway (got it for my studio stuff), so I'll be using that, plus in a pinch people have been telling me the light meter apps are decent too.

I upgraded my tripod to an RRS last year, but the Mamiya weighs a ton so I'll have to see how well my ballhead handles. I need to pick up a plate for it before I can try it, though.

shutterboy said:
Even I would just stick to my Hasselblad 501cm. But I keep shooting 35mm on my Canon 1V because for street shots and likes, I need autofocus.

I have a feeling I will struggle a lot with manual focus too (since I suck with it in digital), so I suspect something with autofocus is in my future as well.

jcc said:
Also, I just noticed your location, have you checked out the Treehouse over on Ward (if you're on Oahu)?

Yep, I actually bought that Superheadz plastic camera from them a couple of months after they first opened. I'm kinda far from them and parking is a pain so I don't get there as much as I'd like, but since I bought that camera, they really got a lot of stock in. At that time they were only plastic cameras--Dianas, Holgas, etc., but now they have a pretty nice collection of higher end stuff. Plus they took over supplying the university courses with film once Imageworks closed and they've also been doing some swap meets, but I keep missing them because of other obligations. Good people there.

Thanks for the welcomes, comments and suggestions, everyone.

ZENGHOST · Jul 10, 2014

This is the Mamiya bundle that I inherited from my uncle (polaroid back that I bought later not pictured)

Don't know what everything is but bascially got the RB67 body with both 120mm and 220mm backs, the P adapter, magnifying hood, extra grid focusing screen, 45mm extension tube, shutter release cable, hard and soft cases and three lenses. Lenses are 50mm f4.5, 90mm f3.8 and 250mm f4.5. The 50mm looks like it's got some fungus or something--at least the front element is pretty foggy.

This is what it looks like inside:

Kyle M. · Jul 10, 2014

ZENGHOST said:
True, luckily I think I built up most of my credit before my photography addiction .

I think I'm looking forward to the Mamiya the most because of the polaroid back and the bigger negatives with medium format. I'm also hearing good things about bokeh/shallow DOF compared to 35mm.

I don't know about an impressive array, but that would be cool if I could use some of those with film.

Yeah, I had a lot of stuff fall into my lap. I also have a couple of Olympus XA's to mess around with too. Have to check if those are functioning properly. If it was as big of a struggle for me to get supplies as you had, I would never have gotten started.

Thanks for the links. Will take a look through the manual. I'm more of a visual learner so youtube stuff has been great too, and there's so much info that I've been sifting through online. All part of the experience, though. At least there's tons more resources available than when I first got into photography.

I've picked a bunch of rolls of both 35mm and 120 in addition to the instant stuff. I've got a range of brands and ISO's--some Ektar, Ilford, Superia and Portra. Want to pick up some Velvia to mess around with too. Hopefully I can figure out which ones I like best.

Art course isn't really possible with my schedule right now, but I definitely want to do some in the future.

Thanks, I hope that the Mamiya is more or less functioning because it's so heavy, that it's gonna cost a fortune just to ship it out. I would definitely like to get it cleaned up at some point, though. I'm open to any pointers on using the Mamiya (or anything, really). Do you use yours for landscape or portraits or both? I'm looking forward to trying it for portraits, but at some point want to explore landscapes with it, although the Ikonta is what I got for landscapes since it's a bit more portable. Was there something you didn't like about the Ikonta?

Luckily I have a Sekonic L-358 that is way more light meter than I need anyway (got it for my studio stuff), so I'll be using that, plus in a pinch people have been telling me the light meter apps are decent too.

I upgraded my tripod to an RRS last year, but the Mamiya weighs a ton so I'll have to see how well my ballhead handles. I need to pick up a plate for it before I can try it, though.

I have a feeling I will struggle a lot with manual focus too (since I suck with it in digital), so I suspect something with autofocus is in my future as well.

Yep, I actually bought that Superheadz plastic camera from them a couple of months after they first opened. I'm kinda far from them and parking is a pain so I don't get there as much as I'd like, but since I bought that camera, they really got a lot of stock in. At that time they were only plastic cameras--Dianas, Holgas, etc., but now they have a pretty nice collection of higher end stuff. Plus they took over supplying the university courses with film once Imageworks closed and they've also been doing some swap meets, but I keep missing them because of other obligations. Good people there.

Thanks for the welcomes, comments and suggestions, everyone.

I use my Mamiya for pretty much everything, I've carried it here, there, and everywhere, even on a couple of 2-3 mile hikes. I don't mind hand holding it and it rarely is on a tripod, everyone is different as far as steadiness goes I can hand hold it just fine down to 1/30 of a sec. with the 90mm lens. As far as pointers go I find focusing to be pretty easy I have a split image screen in mine but just recently got it, had a matte screen before. I only own the waist-level finder and always use the magnifier. If you have the original RB67 Professional and not the later Pro-S or Pro-SD theres no interlocks on the film back. IE. you can accidentally double expose, or pull the darkslide out of the back when it's off the camera and ruin your film. I also believe you have to flick the little lever below the advance knob before you can go to the next frame. Thats all I can think of right now but if you have any other questions on the RB let me know and I'll do my best to answer them. As far as the Ikonta goes it took amazing photos, was light and compact, and easy to use. But I've been trying to get back into a one camera groove and concentrate on the craft not the gear so I let it go to a friend who's been wanting it since she first saw it. That and I didn't care for having to guess my subject distance to focus, I did just fine with it but the constant fear of fudging up a good shot turned me off on it.

Kyle M. · Jul 10, 2014

ZENGHOST said:
This is the Mamiya bundle that I inherited from my uncle (polaroid back that I bought later not pictured)

Don't know what everything is but bascially got the RB67 body with both 120mm and 220mm backs, the P adapter, magnifying hood, extra grid focusing screen, 45mm extension tube, shutter release cable, hard and soft cases and three lenses. Lenses are 50mm f4.5, 90mm f3.8 and 250mm f4.5. The 50mm looks like it's got some fungus or something--at least the front element is pretty foggy.

This is what it looks like inside:

Supposing everything is in working order thats everything you should ever need. Thats a shame about the 50mm if it has fungus it's a great wide angle, though the 90mm is slightly wide as well. I've almost bought a 50mm several times but I've never needed anything wider than the 90mm so I've just held back, that and I'm afraid it might be too wide for most things. The 250mm is a great portrait lens, though possibly slightly long if your looking for full body portraits. One thing I forgot to mention make sure both the body and lens are cocked before attaching or detaching the lens. lenses should be stored with the shutter uncocked to keep tension off the shutter springs. When the two prongs on the back of the lens are lined up with the green and red dots the shutter is cocked, to fire the shutter push in the small silver button on the back of the lens and rotate the 2 prongs clockwise, to cock the shutter simply rotate them the other way until you hear a click.

ZENGHOST · Jul 10, 2014

Kyle M. said:
I use my Mamiya for pretty much everything, I've carried it here, there, and everywhere, even on a couple of 2-3 mile hikes. I don't mind hand holding it and it rarely is on a tripod, everyone is different as far as steadiness goes I can hand hold it just fine down to 1/30 of a sec. with the 90mm lens. As far as pointers go I find focusing to be pretty easy I have a split image screen in mine but just recently got it, had a matte screen before. I only own the waist-level finder and always use the magnifier. If you have the original RB67 Professional and not the later Pro-S or Pro-SD theres no interlocks on the film back. IE. you can accidentally double expose, or pull the darkslide out of the back when it's off the camera and ruin your film. I also believe you have to flick the little lever below the advance knob before you can go to the next frame. Thats all I can think of right now but if you have any other questions on the RB let me know and I'll do my best to answer them. As far as the Ikonta goes it took amazing photos, was light and compact, and easy to use. But I've been trying to get back into a one camera groove and concentrate on the craft not the gear so I let it go to a friend who's been wanting it since she first saw it. That and I didn't care for having to guess my subject distance to focus, I did just fine with it but the constant fear of fudging up a good shot turned me off on it.

I definitely have trouble hand-holding it. Focusing while hand-holding is a pain for me, give you props on that one. I also have enough trouble lugging my DSLR and lenses around as it is. I figure the Ikonta should be small enough to add to my regular pack without too much issue so I can throw in some landscapes on film while I'm shooting the digital stuff too. The one I got is coming from certo6 so it should work pretty well.

I've read about the double-exposure thing and I can guarantee that I will do it accidentally at least a couple of times. Not sure about the lever below the advance knob, will have to check that when I get home. Was thinking about picking up some extra backs later--do you think it would it be worth the extra cost to pick up Pro-S or Pro-SD backs as opposed to the Pro back I have?

So far I've figured out the general workings as far as shutter, dark slide, focusing, film loading, disassembly, etc., my next step is figuring out how to set aperture and shutter speed. I'm probably overcomplicating it, but it didn't seem as intuitive as I was hoping. I hope to test it out this weekend.

Thanks for the help.

ZENGHOST · Jul 10, 2014

Kyle M. said:
Supposing everything is in working order thats everything you should ever need. Thats a shame about the 50mm if it has fungus it's a great wide angle, though the 90mm is slightly wide as well. I've almost bought a 50mm several times but I've never needed anything wider than the 90mm so I've just held back, that and I'm afraid it might be too wide for most things. The 250mm is a great portrait lens, though possibly slightly long if your looking for full body portraits. One thing I forgot to mention make sure both the body and lens are cocked before attaching or detaching the lens. lenses should be stored with the shutter uncocked to keep tension off the shutter springs. When the two prongs on the back of the lens are lined up with the green and red dots the shutter is cocked, to fire the shutter push in the small silver button on the back of the lens and rotate the 2 prongs clockwise, to cock the shutter simply rotate them the other way until you hear a click.

That's good info for the shutter, I'll have to check when I get home to make sure I did't leave the shutter cocked. I have no idea if I was leaving them cocked when attaching/detaching. I'd better be careful with that too.

Sirius Glass · Jul 10, 2014

If you gott'em shoot'em

Welcome to APUG

ZENGHOST · Jul 10, 2014

Sirius Glass said:
If you gott'em shoot'em

Welcome to APUG

Thanks, Sirius

Kyle M. · Jul 10, 2014

ZENGHOST said:
I definitely have trouble hand-holding it. Focusing while hand-holding is a pain for me, give you props on that one. I also have enough trouble lugging my DSLR and lenses around as it is. I figure the Ikonta should be small enough to add to my regular pack without too much issue so I can throw in some landscapes on film while I'm shooting the digital stuff too. The one I got is coming from certo6 so it should work pretty well.

I've read about the double-exposure thing and I can guarantee that I will do it accidentally at least a couple of times. Not sure about the lever below the advance knob, will have to check that when I get home. Was thinking about picking up some extra backs later--do you think it would it be worth the extra cost to pick up Pro-S or Pro-SD backs as opposed to the Pro back I have?

So far I've figured out the general workings as far as shutter, dark slide, focusing, film loading, disassembly, etc., my next step is figuring out how to set aperture and shutter speed. I'm probably overcomplicating it, but it didn't seem as intuitive as I was hoping. I hope to test it out this weekend.

Thanks for the help.

I've only got 1 back it's a Pro-SD back on a Pro-S body which is nice because the pro sd backs don't have foam light seals to go bad, the pro S back that came on it had bad foam and I've been too lazy to re-foam it. Not sure if you'll gain double exposure prevention though I think thats triggered by the body on the Pro-S and SD, though the SD does have a lock so you can't pull the dark slide with the back removed. I believe you only have to trip the lever below the film advance when your actually on a frame, the advance should move freely on an unloaded back. The later models had a pin that popped out of the body and turned half the frame counter window red after you had exposed a frame, then you couldn't double expose without flicking a separate switch. The Pro-SD back also has a convenient dark slide holder so you don't have to hold it in your teeth or put it on the side of the body. My Ikonta was also from Certo6, if you got the one he had listed up until a few days ago 523/2 I believe? Then it's pretty much the same as mine was other than yours has a viewfinder in the top plate, mine had the pop up finder.

Setting shutter speed and aperture is just like any other camera, take a reading with your light meter then set the indicated aperture on the aperture ring and shutter speed on the shutter speed ring. The 50mm lens has a floating element and you need to set the subject distance on the ring on the front of the lens. You can either guess this distance or use the fancy little graph on the right side of the bellows. On the other two lenses you have that ring at the front is simply a depth of field chart, set the subject distance in the center then read off you DOF between the corresponding aperture marks.

ZENGHOST · Jul 10, 2014

Kyle M. said:
I've only got 1 back it's a Pro-SD back on a Pro-S body which is nice because the pro sd backs don't have foam light seals to go bad, the pro S back that came on it had bad foam and I've been too lazy to re-foam it. Not sure if you'll gain double exposure prevention though I think thats triggered by the body on the Pro-S and SD, though the SD does have a lock so you can't pull the dark slide with the back removed. I believe you only have to trip the lever below the film advance when your actually on a frame, the advance should move freely on an unloaded back. The later models had a pin that popped out of the body and turned half the frame counter window red after you had exposed a frame, then you couldn't double expose without flicking a separate switch. The Pro-SD back also has a convenient dark slide holder so you don't have to hold it in your teeth or put it on the side of the body. My Ikonta was also from Certo6, if you got the one he had listed up until a few days ago 523/2 I believe? Then it's pretty much the same as mine was other than yours has a viewfinder in the top plate, mine had the pop up finder.

Setting shutter speed and aperture is just like any other camera, take a reading with your light meter then set the indicated aperture on the aperture ring and shutter speed on the shutter speed ring. The 50mm lens has a floating element and you need to set the subject distance on the ring on the front of the lens. You can either guess this distance or use the fancy little graph on the right side of the bellows. On the other two lenses you have that ring at the front is simply a depth of field chart, set the subject distance in the center then read off you DOF between the corresponding aperture marks.

Yep, that's the one I got. I think it's gonna get here sometime next week just in time for my annual trip down to Kalaupapa on Molokai next weekend so I hope to get some shots down there with it (I'm not gonna lug the Mamiya down there).

Yeah, it's the floating element/distance setting part that was throwing me off since I've never dealt with anything like that. When I read about it, it confused me a bit so I'm just gonna have to try it and see what happens. Thanks for the tips, that helps a lot.

I didn't realize the SD back doesn't have the foam seals, that's good to know.

Clueless Film Noob

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency