Folks,
(This is a very long post, so I apologize in advance)...
I intend to get a 6x6 camera to use to complement the 6x17 camera that I recently purchased (plus the digital that I have been using exclusively for the past 12+ years, which currently is the Fuji GFX system).
I used to have a Mamiya 6MF body and the three lenses and I LOVED it. It is the camera that I most regret selling these days. It was relatively light and compact (collapsable lens mount) and the lenese appeared to be really, really sharp. I originally got it as a "handheld" complement to the LF and ULF gear that I was shooting at the time. Overall, I thought it was a great camera system and I will happily re-purchase that again if that ends up being my decision based on feedback from the rabble.
However, since I am starting at scratch, I thought I should consider the other viable 6x6 systems out there. I think that would be the Hasselblad 500CM and lenses and the Bronica SQ-A and lenses. The Rolli isn't reliable enough in my thinking. Too expensive as well.
Both of these systems are so much cheaper than they were 20 years ago (and seemingly, the Mamiya 6 gear has gotten much more expensive relatively speaking)... All of these were really top-grade gear with high prices when new, so the perofrmance of any one system is probably going to be excellent.
I am thinking of a body, a back or two for the H or B systems, and maybe three lense for starters; 50mm, 75/80mm, and 150mm. I may never go beyond that.
However, I have a few concerns/thoughts I wanted opinions on...
1. Longevity. The Bronica and the Mamiya both use electronic shutters. Are we reacing the end of life for this equipment an will there be any paths to repair? The Bronica gear is pretty inexpensive so I guess you just buy another one and continue until that one fails... and repeat. The Mamiya is not so cheap, but you could do the same thing. Is there an inherent aspect to the electronic shutters (like some rubber part or some piece of electrical winding) that inherently has a life to it and that life is absolute such that in another 10 years, ony 5% of the lenses from those companies will still be functional?
The Hasselblad is mechanical and will probbaly require more CLA than the others, but at least those should be possible to do that. Im not clear on whether the M or B systems have a lot of forward support and longevity potential.
2. Lens performance. I'm not a real pixel-peeper in this respect, but I would not want to put together a system only to discover that the one lens I like to use the most is a bit of a dog... That lens in 6x6 is probably going to be the 50mm. (I'd guess it was with the M6 set I had, with the 50, 75, and then the 150 in far third place). The Mamiya 50mm was really excellent. I was very happy with it, and my thinking is that it could be sharper into the corners than the other two because they didn't need to make it nearly as retrofocal to fit on that camera (no mirror box to avoid). I've seen some comments that the CZ 50mm lense is really excellent and also some comments that the Bronica 50mm isn't their best lens...
I suspect that at 80mm and longer, they all are really close to equal in performance... it's only at the wide end that I suspect the differences may occur.
3. Camera factors. I know the Mamiya 6 pretty well No nonsense, and seemingly reliable (with that concern about the electronics in the future). What about the B and the H systems? The Bronica feels a little more workman-like but the Hasselblad has had millions of weddings and other shoots to prove that they are a good, reliable system. Is there anything about these that I should know about? What about the film backs? I know the H should have matching serial numbers... anything like that for the B system?
I consider changing film mid-roll to be a major asset, so that is in favor of the H and B systems. I also would prefer to have a TTL fiewfinder, also in favor of the H and B systems.
4. Cost. The Bronica wins this one hands-down. Second is the H, and last appears to be the Mamiya system, but of course, the H could go higher when considering more modern lenses, backs, etc. I'm not talking any exotics, just the shooting quality gear. One gotcha on this might be the Hasselblad SWC body/lens, which I could see myself wanting to get at some point if I did have a H system. It's a rabbit hole, folks. The Mamia system is small and I'd run out of gear to buy quickly.
The cost of putting together one of these isn't really a big deal for any of them, but I'd prefer to spend less on the gear and more on film and travel.
5. Intangables. So what else is there? I am familiar with the B system from my years working at a camera shop in HS and college. The owner used an SQ-A for weddings, etc. I've certainly seen plenty of H gear over the years but never shot with any. It was too costly to consider back then.
I intend to use an external meter, so I don't need the most modern body or the pentaprism. I would like a gridded screen. Is there a marked difference in groundglass performance between the B and the H?
Another thing comes to mind... those ding-dang filters on the H system; ugh.
Pride of ownership? Not sure that matters much to me at all, but pride in high quality craftmanship? YES. I think all three meet that requirement.
-----
Many thanks for reading and comments on the merits of one vs. another system are appreciated while I try to make a buying decision.
---Michael
(This is a very long post, so I apologize in advance)...
I intend to get a 6x6 camera to use to complement the 6x17 camera that I recently purchased (plus the digital that I have been using exclusively for the past 12+ years, which currently is the Fuji GFX system).
I used to have a Mamiya 6MF body and the three lenses and I LOVED it. It is the camera that I most regret selling these days. It was relatively light and compact (collapsable lens mount) and the lenese appeared to be really, really sharp. I originally got it as a "handheld" complement to the LF and ULF gear that I was shooting at the time. Overall, I thought it was a great camera system and I will happily re-purchase that again if that ends up being my decision based on feedback from the rabble.
However, since I am starting at scratch, I thought I should consider the other viable 6x6 systems out there. I think that would be the Hasselblad 500CM and lenses and the Bronica SQ-A and lenses. The Rolli isn't reliable enough in my thinking. Too expensive as well.
Both of these systems are so much cheaper than they were 20 years ago (and seemingly, the Mamiya 6 gear has gotten much more expensive relatively speaking)... All of these were really top-grade gear with high prices when new, so the perofrmance of any one system is probably going to be excellent.
I am thinking of a body, a back or two for the H or B systems, and maybe three lense for starters; 50mm, 75/80mm, and 150mm. I may never go beyond that.
However, I have a few concerns/thoughts I wanted opinions on...
1. Longevity. The Bronica and the Mamiya both use electronic shutters. Are we reacing the end of life for this equipment an will there be any paths to repair? The Bronica gear is pretty inexpensive so I guess you just buy another one and continue until that one fails... and repeat. The Mamiya is not so cheap, but you could do the same thing. Is there an inherent aspect to the electronic shutters (like some rubber part or some piece of electrical winding) that inherently has a life to it and that life is absolute such that in another 10 years, ony 5% of the lenses from those companies will still be functional?
The Hasselblad is mechanical and will probbaly require more CLA than the others, but at least those should be possible to do that. Im not clear on whether the M or B systems have a lot of forward support and longevity potential.
2. Lens performance. I'm not a real pixel-peeper in this respect, but I would not want to put together a system only to discover that the one lens I like to use the most is a bit of a dog... That lens in 6x6 is probably going to be the 50mm. (I'd guess it was with the M6 set I had, with the 50, 75, and then the 150 in far third place). The Mamiya 50mm was really excellent. I was very happy with it, and my thinking is that it could be sharper into the corners than the other two because they didn't need to make it nearly as retrofocal to fit on that camera (no mirror box to avoid). I've seen some comments that the CZ 50mm lense is really excellent and also some comments that the Bronica 50mm isn't their best lens...
I suspect that at 80mm and longer, they all are really close to equal in performance... it's only at the wide end that I suspect the differences may occur.
3. Camera factors. I know the Mamiya 6 pretty well No nonsense, and seemingly reliable (with that concern about the electronics in the future). What about the B and the H systems? The Bronica feels a little more workman-like but the Hasselblad has had millions of weddings and other shoots to prove that they are a good, reliable system. Is there anything about these that I should know about? What about the film backs? I know the H should have matching serial numbers... anything like that for the B system?
I consider changing film mid-roll to be a major asset, so that is in favor of the H and B systems. I also would prefer to have a TTL fiewfinder, also in favor of the H and B systems.
4. Cost. The Bronica wins this one hands-down. Second is the H, and last appears to be the Mamiya system, but of course, the H could go higher when considering more modern lenses, backs, etc. I'm not talking any exotics, just the shooting quality gear. One gotcha on this might be the Hasselblad SWC body/lens, which I could see myself wanting to get at some point if I did have a H system. It's a rabbit hole, folks. The Mamia system is small and I'd run out of gear to buy quickly.
The cost of putting together one of these isn't really a big deal for any of them, but I'd prefer to spend less on the gear and more on film and travel.
5. Intangables. So what else is there? I am familiar with the B system from my years working at a camera shop in HS and college. The owner used an SQ-A for weddings, etc. I've certainly seen plenty of H gear over the years but never shot with any. It was too costly to consider back then.
I intend to use an external meter, so I don't need the most modern body or the pentaprism. I would like a gridded screen. Is there a marked difference in groundglass performance between the B and the H?
Another thing comes to mind... those ding-dang filters on the H system; ugh.
Pride of ownership? Not sure that matters much to me at all, but pride in high quality craftmanship? YES. I think all three meet that requirement.
-----
Many thanks for reading and comments on the merits of one vs. another system are appreciated while I try to make a buying decision.
---Michael
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