Chems

ajuk · Feb 6, 2006

I have got Developer, Stop and Fix I bourght a few months ago, and I used it a few months ago, are any of these chems still any good?

argus · Feb 6, 2006

That depends on several factors:
- type of chemistry
- method of storing

Can you describe those in detail please?

G

jim appleyard · Feb 6, 2006

The only thing to do is try them on test rolls.

Marco Gilardetti · Feb 6, 2006

Of course we're talking of undiluted liquids, not working solutions which expire in few hours (days to be positive...)

Developer: most probably not.
Stop: almost surely yes.
Fixer: it depends. Look if it has deposits or stains.

As cheap as they are, I wouldn't risk using expired chemicals, however.

Wayne · Feb 6, 2006

ajuk said:
I have got Developer, Stop and Fix I bourght a few months ago, and I used it a few months ago, are any of these chems still any good?

You have not provided anywhere near enough detail to answer your question. What are the chemicals exactly, are they dry, liquid, opened or not?

Bob F. · Feb 6, 2006

Given the costs of fresh chemicals, if in any doubt, dump the dev and fixer and make up anew. If you find you need to keep developer and fixer for a few weeks or even months, keep the stock strength solutions in completely full air tight bottles (drop in glass marbles to fill the bottle to the brim is one option).

Using these conditions, some paper developers at working strength will keep for a few weeks, but I would not try that with working strength film developer. Likewise, working strength fixer can last quite a while - run a clearing time test with a bit of film leader to check it is still active

Stop bath is just a mild acid so will keep almost forever.

Cheers, Bob.

ajuk · Feb 6, 2006

I have got
Ilfosol S, and Jessops Econostop.

Yes thay have been opened.

Oops looked at the instructions, says,

will Keep:
24 months in full airtight bottle
4 months in half fully tight capped Bottle.

srs5694 · Feb 6, 2006

A few additional thoughts: AFAIK, stop bath should keep well for many months, if not years. One test for fixer is to smell it; many fixers start smelling like rotten eggs when they go bad. (I wouldn't rely on this alone, but if you smell bad eggs when you open the bottle, it's almost certainly gone off.) Manufacturers often err on the side of caution when giving estimated keeping times. OTOH, as Bob suggests, it shouldn't cost a lot to replace the chemistry if you're in doubt as to its quality.

dancqu · Feb 6, 2006

ajuk said:
Oops looked at the instructions, says,
will Keep: 24 months in full airtight bottle

There you go 24 months in full air tight bottles.
I'm off and on in the darkroom; lots of off. When
I bring chemistry into stock I break it down into
smaller Air Tight Glass Boston Round Bottles.

I've Ammonium Thiosulfate concentrate going
on three years in stock which shows no sign of
deterioration. If you go for those glass bottles
be sure they have the Polycone or Polyseal
caps. Those are screw caps with a PE
cork insert. Dan

ajuk · Feb 6, 2006

Of course I am about 3 months into the 4 month stage, went into town and got some Rodinal anyway, I don't think Ilforsol would be a good idea for HP5.

I think Ill risk the Fixer it looks fine.

Marco Gilardetti · Feb 7, 2006

ajuk said:
I think Ill risk the Fixer it looks fine.

Er... It's exactly the one I would NOT risk...

Bob F. · Feb 7, 2006

ajuk said:
Of course I am about 3 months into the 4 month stage, went into town and got some Rodinal anyway, I don't think Ilforsol would be a good idea for HP5.

I think Ill risk the Fixer it looks fine.

Do a clearing time test - if a piece of leader clears in less than a minute, it will be fine (assuming you have not exceeded the recommended number of films through the fixer).

According to the HP5+ data sheet, Ilfosol is Ilford's recommended developer for sharpness with HP5+. I would expect Rodinal will give even sharper results but at the expense of more grain. However, I have read that some like the combination (not tried it myself).

Have fun, Bob.

Jack Lusted · Feb 7, 2006

Hi,
I've used Ilfosol and it's okay for HP5. However, I've recently converted to ur-Rodinal (R09) as I found Ilfosol far too soft. R09 is IMO a whole lot nicer to work with than Ilfosol - very sharp and does not go off!!

Jack

ajuk · Feb 8, 2006

BTW Looks like I got the last bottle of Rodinal in the shop

I will try the leader thing, I take it I jest cut off a piece of leader that has been exposed to light and chuck it into the Fixer?

Phillip P. Dimor · Feb 8, 2006

Yup, just clip some film from a 35mm can and toss it into the fixer. The film should go clear from 1 to 4 minutes. If it takes longer than that or never clears then your fixer is exhausted. There is also a fixer testing solution, you add one drop of the tester to a bit of fixer and if a cloudy precipitate forms the fixer is exhausted.

Bob F. · Feb 8, 2006

ajuk said:
BTW Looks like I got the last bottle of Rodinal in the shop

I will try the leader thing, I take it I jest cut off a piece of leader that has been exposed to light and chuck it into the Fixer?

Yup - agitate it (swirl it around a bit) and you should see the film go clear within about 30 secs (assuming your fixer is at "film strength" dilution - usually 1+4) - longer than 1 minute suggests a problem.

[edit: I am assuming FP4+ or HP5+ - Tmax for example takes longer to clear]

Cheers, Bob.

ajuk · Feb 12, 2006

Cut off a piece of FP4 from a film I have in the fridge, the pre diluted Fixer from about 2 months ago cleared it in what felt like under a minute, worth the risk now, should I still mix up some more fixer, but it would be from the same bottle.

Gerald Koch · Feb 13, 2006

There are two reasons to discard fixer. One, there has been enough film run through it and the clearing time has become twice as long as fresh fixer. Two, in the case of an acid fixer, it has become milky showing that it has started to sulfurize.

dancqu · Feb 13, 2006

Gerald Koch said:
... it has become milky showing that
it has started to sulfurize.

Perhaps it might be rejuvenated by the
addition of sodium sulfite. Dan

ajuk · Feb 14, 2006

Gerald Koch said:
There are two reasons to discard fixer. One, there has been enough film run through it and the clearing time has become twice as long as fresh fixer. Two, in the case of an acid fixer, it has become milky showing that it has started to sulfurize.

The pre mixed stuff has onlyu been used once before.

Bob F. · Feb 14, 2006

As FP4+ cleared in under a minute you should be good to go. I would normally fix FP4/HP4 for 3-4 times the clearing time, but as you don't know what the clearing time was in the fresh fixer, I'd give it 4 minutes to be safe. You don't want it in there too long or it will start to eat silver (how long is too long, is a moot point...). Check at the end of the 4 mins that there is no cloudiness on the film caused by insufficient fixing. If there is, just shove it back in the fixer for another few mins - the time in room light will not effect it as long as it's been in the fixer for a couple of minutes.

As before, if in doubt, just make up some fresh from the concentrate (the concentrate keeps much longer than the working strength solution) , but it sounds like it will be OK. When you do make up fresh, do the clearing time test again and mark the time on the bottle of working strength fixer. Do the clearing time test before every subsequent film and when the clearing time becomes twice what it was in fresh fixer, chuck the fixer and make up a new working strength bottle. I use Tetenal fixer test strips to test mine, but the "double the clearing time" concept is a well used one.

Good luck, Bob.

dancqu · Feb 15, 2006

Bob F. said:
...make up some fresh from the concentrate
(the concentrate keeps much longer than the ...
Good luck, Bob.

Of course how much to make up depends on how
much film is to be put through any one session. For
each roll allow 1/48 liter, that is 20 ml or 2/3 ounce.
Add to enough water to handle the amount of film
to be processed. The fixer is very dilute so agitate
regularly for 4 minutes then check for clear. If clear,
1 or 2 minutes more, if not, another 3 or 4.

The fix is fresh each use so no worry there. No
need to test. And with the very dilute fix your film
enjoys gentle processing and archival results.

If you keep your concentrate well sealed in
smaller bottles it will last for years. Dan

Chems

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