Censorship in photography

darkosaric · Nov 26, 2014

So,

I was discussing my favorite film director Abbas Kiarostami - and I came to conclusion that he made master pieces in Iran under censorship, but when he had total freedom in other countries - his films are not so good as works from Iran. Same is for the movies from Croatia: before the war in the 1990's - in the communism many films were great, but after democracy came - nothing.

From another side in comedy world I consider Ricky Gervais, Larry David and Louie CK top of the top - and they do not have any form of censorship (or self-censorship) at all.

So naturally this makes me think about censorship and self-censorship in photography. One thing is limit yourself - and this is good, art can be improved when forced in some limits, but is there a censorship and self-censorship in photography? One thing that cross my mind is that people in western countries are avoiding to take pictures of children on public places. I know it is legal in many countries, but considered a no go zone - so people will stop them self. Is this some kind of self-censorship?

What are your toughs about this? Can censorship or self-censorship be good for photography and art in general?

Thanks,

MDR · Nov 26, 2014

It has been proven again and again that censorship often leads to more creativity simply because you have to find ways to circumvent the censors. Ever wondered why they sing so much in Indian Movies, the songs often criticize the social situations or have themes like sex that would fall pray to censorship, the censors don't take the singing serious and let it pass. Self-Censorships isn't as effective as real censorship imo because in real censorship there is an element of fear and/or adventure that is lacking in self-censorship.

ParkerSmithPhoto · Nov 26, 2014

In her book "The Creative Habit" choreographer Twyla Tharp talks about the value of restraints and limitations in creativity.

For example, Beethoven could sit down and write any music in the world, which is terribly difficult, but by sitting down to write a piano sonata, he's given himself a form and a structure within which to work. Avedon's white background was a way of saying "no" to all of the possible choices he could make as a portraitist, thus he could focus on the subject.

Tharp relates the story about how she was once given a production with (for her) a virtually unlimited budget. She said because anything was possible, it was a disaster!

Rick A · Nov 26, 2014

But, is self imposed form and structure a form of censor, or merely focus to obtain a specific result?

Alan Klein · Nov 26, 2014

I find I'm more productive when I have a goal in mind either selected by me or others such as at work. It focuses my thoughts, energy and creativity. While I can think creatively about many things, without the goal, I tend to get lazy and my mind wanders. As far as being creative and productive in a dictatorial society, it's said that nothing focuses the mind like the hangman's noose.

Thomas Bertilsson · Nov 26, 2014

I watched 'Masterchef Junior' yesterday on TV. It's a rare occasion that I watch TV anymore, but I like cooking programs.

They are children between 8 and 12 years old who compete for a coveted first price. They are cute kids with amazing skills and personalities. On this episode they had to deliver perfectly cooked eggs, which is really difficult to do. The quantity of perfectly fried eggs they delivered equated the quantity of ingredients they were allowed to use in their next challenge.

The eight-year-old girl who delivered two perfectly fried eggs, the least amount of them all, came up with the second best plate of the following challenge. The person who had the most perfect eggs had ten, and he was nearly eliminated.

Hardship and challenge breeds creativity. I have always thought so. That is why I like simple tools where I have to apply myself with dedication to get anywhere.

John Koehrer · Nov 27, 2014

You self censor whenever you do a project. A. Adams was better at the grand landscape than E. Weston and still life.
Sometimes it's not a conscious choice but your comfort zone.

RE: Kid photography by strangers. The US has had a number of pedophiles in the news lately. Priests, politicians, boy scout leaders.
Can't forget the ever present teacher or even Sunday school teacher either.
Parents are protective of their offspring so there's a perception that anyone taking a picture of their child is a pervert.
To face reality, some are.

dasBlute · Nov 27, 2014

there is a saying about oppression, 'if you squeeze too hard, you make diamonds'

darkosaric · Nov 28, 2014

dasBlute said:
there is a saying about oppression, 'if you squeeze too hard, you make diamonds'

This is a good saying !

Ko.Fe. · Nov 30, 2014

Iran, Croatia - have no clue.
i'm watching most of Soviet made movies, naive, not true but this is where I grew up.
I can't watch Russian made, only very few of them.
More time it pass, less movies you could watch anyway. Music, art...

StoneNYC · Dec 1, 2014

If you think about it, someone like Louis CK (who I've met a few times on set of his TV show) is very focused and yet he limits himself too, by ONLY addressing taboo topics. He can't do all comedy, just taboo and self deprecating comedy.

It's a different kind of limitation.

Old-N-Feeble · Dec 1, 2014

Would one call specialization a form of self-limitation? For example: An artist who only paints female nudes or a pianist who only plays jazz or a race car driver who only drives Formula 1.

darkosaric · Dec 1, 2014

I would say that self censorship comes out of fear or pressure - but self limitation and specialization comes out of need to improve yourself. One could say that specialization is a form of self-limitation because it comes from the same goal - to improve yourself.

analoguey · Dec 2, 2014

Censorship and editing are two different things, of late I have seen them being mixed up far too often.
Similarly the correlation and causation bits.

Art doesnt become better because of "censorship" it becomes better because one can relate to something or make the audience connect to something. The directors you refer to probably could not connect with the post as they could with pre-(revolution/change..whatever).

IMNSHO people either want or don't want censorship because they don't want to think/edit for themselves, they prefer someone else do it - carrying the can is messy.

analoguey · Dec 2, 2014

MDR said:
Ever wondered why they sing so much in Indian Movies, the songs often criticize the social situations or have themes like sex that would fall pray to censorship, the censors don't take the singing serious and let it pass.

HUSH!!
Dont tell the producers, movie stars or the tax men!!
They think they are spending all that money on musicians, singers, dance(r)s, locations and post-production cos they are turning a profit (on the launch date!). What do they know? :munch:

How did you get an inside track with the censors btw? :-/

cuthbert · Dec 3, 2014

Ko.Fe. said:
Iran, Croatia - have no clue.
i'm watching most of Soviet made movies, naive, not true but this is where I grew up.
I can't watch Russian made, only very few of them.
More time it pass, less movies you could watch anyway. Music, art...

I think the main difference between Soviet and Russian cinema is that during Communism it was considered a form of "Art" with capital A so the government was pushing directors and actors to do their best for the State, also without the "problem" of attracting the audience against competitors horrible Hollywood movies like Transformers were inconceiveable, so you could get philosophical (and loooong) sci-fi movies like Solaris or Stalker, both products that Hollywood could and would never make.

Same thing for Yugoslavia, Tito's regime actively promoted the Legend of the partisans so they made hundred of partizanska movies, some of them critically acclaimed even in West and with Western cast as well, to the point that even Americans started to shoot WWII in Yugoslavia because it was cheap and had a lot of props like T-34 dressed up like German Tigers (Kelly's heroes is an example).

Now the Russian, ex Yugo but even Italian cinema (that flourished from the 50s to the early 90s) can't simply compete against the Hollywood blockbuster war machine...still this has little to do with the thesis: "Censorship makes you work better".

Mainecoonmaniac · Dec 3, 2014

It's a fine balance

I think censorship is necessary. Especially in the age of the internet with cyberbullying and trolls. I think us Americans are opinionated to the point of having a big mouth and at times, they don't have facts supporting their views. What I have a problem with is the morality police protecting us from things they think moral folk should not see. Here's an example.
http://hyperallergic.com/165797/city-councilmen-cry-porn-over-pregnant-nude-at-moca-jacksonville/

This is politically motivated of course like Jesse Helm wanting to defund the NEA.

RalphLambrecht · Dec 3, 2014

As it's often said: the ones who can do,the others teach

Old-N-Feeble · Dec 3, 2014

RalphLambrecht said:
As it's often said: the ones who can do,the others teach

The way I heard it was: "Those who can, do. Those who can't, teach. Those who can't teach, teach teachers".

darkosaric · Dec 3, 2014

Mainecoonmaniac said:
... us Americans ...

http://hyperallergic.com/165797/city-councilmen-cry-porn-over-pregnant-nude-at-moca-jacksonville/

I can not, and I never will understand American attitude to women breasts. Movie Alien: Sigourney Weaver taking the shower - NO! Chopping heads off and blood all around - YES!
I could understand this in Afghanistan, or Saudi Arabia, but in No.1 country in the world? And form another side so progressive and advanced in many other thing like same sex marriage. USA is truly land of extremes .

But yes - this is a very fine example of censorship .

pbromaghin · Dec 3, 2014

Old-N-Feeble said:
The way I heard it was: "Those who can, do. Those who can't, teach. Those who can't teach, teach teachers".

And those who can't teach teachers, teach gym.

Mainecoonmaniac · Dec 3, 2014

I agree with you

darkosaric said:
I can not, and I never will understand American attitude to women breasts.

Yes Americans sexualize breast. The extreme Conservative right here in the US cannot stand symbols of power that is not white and not male. The photo depicts a pregnant women. What more powerful than the ability to create a human being? Men have a part of it too

darkosaric · Dec 9, 2014

Stupidity won't win

Mainecoonmaniac said:
I think censorship is necessary. Especially in the age of the internet with cyberbullying and trolls. I think us Americans are opinionated to the point of having a big mouth and at times, they don't have facts supporting their views. What I have a problem with is the morality police protecting us from things they think moral folk should not see. Here's an example.
http://hyperallergic.com/165797/city-councilmen-cry-porn-over-pregnant-nude-at-moca-jacksonville/

This is politically motivated of course like Jesse Helm wanting to defund the NEA.

Dead Link Removed

Some news about this example that you post

StoneNYC · Dec 9, 2014

darkosaric said:
Dead Link Removed

Some news about this example that you post

Awesome!!!! And what a great response!

Old-N-Feeble · Dec 9, 2014

Ray S said:
- Take what ever pictures you like and you'll be fine... - Just do not show yourself...

If you do show yourself just don't overexpose.

Censorship in photography

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