Carbon Transfer Video

Andrew O'Neill · Jun 9, 2011

Here is a video I made. It's an overview of the carbon transfer printing process.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EmpTgDlsr3o

Barry S · Jun 9, 2011

Great job--thanks! The video is a really nice overview of the process for those of us just starting out in carbon.

gmikol · Jun 9, 2011

Andrew...that's a well done video. Good work.

It's tough to see in the video, but could you describe your "pouring station" a bit? How thick is the steel? What is the base material? How is it attached?

Thanks--

Greg

Renato Tonelli · Jun 9, 2011

Very nice.

I was considering a workshop with S.King at he Formulary but work schedule has conspired against it.

heespharm · Jun 9, 2011

awesome makes me wanna try it...

holmburgers · Jun 9, 2011

Really great video. If anyone were to ever ask me what a carbon print is, I would show them this video.

Vaughn · Jun 9, 2011

I like how you kept it from becoming a "How to" video -- which might take 5 to 7 segments as long as the single video you made.

I have done demos of the entire process for groups -- showing all the steps you did in the video. Those demos usually last two hours!

I am giving a carbon printing workshop in Vancouver, BC on June 24 and 25. Andrew, I hope you might be able to drop by. It is at Focal Point where I believe you have given a talk previously and showed some of your carbon prints.

Vaughn

Andrew O'Neill · Jun 9, 2011

awesome makes me wanna try it...

That was my motivation to making this. It's such a beautiful thing to behold, a carbon print. If you ever get a chance to attend a workshop, do it. Nothing beats hands on with someone (like Vaughn and Sandy) who knows the process inside and out. Mind you, I've never taken a carbon workshop, but hope to this summer with Sandy. Vaughn, I will do my best to drop by! It would be swell to meet you.
Everyone, thank you for your kinds words. Now it's down to the darkroom to sensitize some new tissue and get printing!

Andrew O'Neill · Jun 9, 2011

Hi gmikol, I have two stations for pouring tissue. With this system, I can pour 20, 9x11 tissues in about 1.5 hours. The base is 3/4 masonite. I glued (contact cement) galvonized steel sheeting on top of the masonite. You can see in the pics roughly its thickness. I stuck in metal screws on each corner to aid in leveling. Hope this helps!

brucemuir · Jun 9, 2011

Thank you Andy.
The relief effect is quite beautiful.

vyshemirsky · Jun 10, 2011

I was quite surprised by the amount of sugar you put in your glop. Could you share the details of your recipe? Did you try the hot rod method for smoothing out the tissue? Beautiful results judging by what I've seen from your video. I have constant problems with the tissue peeling off with the primary support paper when developing, as well as constantly fighting small bubbles.

Andrew O'Neill · Jun 10, 2011

Hi vyshemirsky,

Thanks for watching the video. In the video, I put in 50g of sugar, but now I put in 70grams. Yes, that is a lot, but I have found that with a 10% gelatin solution, I would sometimes get weird lines that would clear or wouldn't. By adding even more sugar, solved this problem. My 8% gelatin tissues are fine with 50g of sugar.
Yes, I tried the hot rod method, but gave it up due to all the wasted glop that would spill out over the magnetic frame. The comb is so easy and much less messy. I thin Vaughn just uses his fingers, which would work just as well.
What are you using as primary support? How long do you soak your tissue? Are you making your own tissue?
I used to have problems with bubbles, too. How much isopropyl alcohol do you pour into your glop? I pour 50ml per litre. Letting the glop gas out in hot water for about an hour (minimum) helps. When I'm at the pouring stage, I always give the glass container containing glop a spritz with isopropyl, as there are usually a couple of small bubbles on the surface. If you see any right after your pour, pop the gently with your finger. I always soak my tissue support (yupo or RC) in warm water with a small amount of isopropyl alcohol added. The mating bath is dead water that I keep in a 4 litre milk jug. It's usually around 20C. Dead water is great as it has had time to gas out... no more bubbles. Make sure you squeegee your tissue support down firmly. I spritz the surface with a bit of alcohol just incase of any bubbles. Since I have done all of the above, no more bubble issues.

My recipe (10% gelatin):

900ml distilled water
100g gelatin (250 bloom or Knox brand which is a lower bloom)
70g sugar
4g Lamp Black water colour
50ml isopropyl alcohol (70%)

8% solution: 900ml distilled water; 80g gelatin; 50g sugar.

Filter, gas out, and Bob's your uncle.

Have you checked out Sandy King's carbon forum on yahoo? Dead Link Removed

Or Bostick & Sullivan's? http://bostick-sullivan.invisionzone.com/

If I can be of any help, just let me know!

Cheers!

andrew

Leigh B · Jun 10, 2011

That's quite neat, Andy. I'm tempted to try it.

All I have to do is find some negatives that are worth the effort.

- Leigh

Andrew O'Neill · Jun 10, 2011

Give it a shot, Leigh. Just make sure the negative that you choose is contrasty... one that would print say, on a zero or number one VC filter. Which film do you use?

Leigh B · Jun 10, 2011

Hi Andy,

In LF I'm shooting Acros (4x5) and FP4+ (4x5 and 8x10), both developed in Diafine.
It's a compensating developer, so I get good tone range.

I have a 600-watt VC head on the enlarger, so a decent amount of light is available.
How do you determine exposure?

- Leigh

Andrew O'Neill · Jun 10, 2011

Just finished watching the Canucks kick Boston butt... yay!

FP4 is a great film for carbon printing, but I'm not sure if Diafine would give you enought density range. I've never tried Acros, but I've heard great things about this film.
Were you planning on using your enlarger to expose carbon tissue? 600 watt is pretty powerful. Is the light a halogen? if it is, it might work to expose tissue. I would expose without the lens so there is more light. Lenses cut a lot of UV, too. I use an old UV exposure table I got from a retired screen printer. It's a big clunker with a 1000W halogen light, and two FLB tubes. Kind of overkill, but exposures are between 8 and 10 minutes.
When you ask, "how do you determine exposure?" is that for the film or tissue?

andrew

Leigh B · Jun 10, 2011

Hi Andy,

I missed the UV exposure section of the video due to a distraction. Sorry. I was thinking in terms of exposure times for the tissue, as you answered, rather than for the film.

Density will be an issue, since initially I will be using existing negatives. I've been shooting for over 50 years, so I have a few.

Acros and FP4+ are very similar.

Thanks.

- Leigh

Curt · Jun 11, 2011

Andy, what's the largest size print that you make? Great video, I enjoyed it very much, it's hard to tell someone what the process is in just a verbal form.

Curt

I'm looking forward to the workshop in Vancouver in two weeks, those games are nail bitters aren't they.

CMB · Jun 11, 2011

Dichromate Toxicity

Andrew O'Neill said:
Here is a video I made. It's an overview of the carbon transfer printing process.

Dichromate is a highly toxic and corrosive carcinogen which should be used with great care. It is therefore quite alarming to see a how-to video intended primarily for novices in which dichromate sensitized carbon tissue is handled at various stages using gloveless hands. The procedure shown is dangerous not only for its potential for contact dermatitis but also for poisoning if the contaminated fingers come into contact with the mouth or food of the process worker. Furthermore, dichromate in the power form (e.g.weighing) can be lethal if inhaled and a toxic dust mask should be worn. I suggest the video be modified and/or a warning be posted in the comments section.

Charles Berger

vyshemirsky · Jun 11, 2011

My support was fixed out RC paper. My glop was 10% gelatine with much less sugar (something like 40g) and a little of glycerine. I was adding at least 50ml of IPA (98%) to the glop, and I found it clouds the glop first, it must be because of the concentration of alcohol used - a known reaction of pure alcohols with water. I would probably get the alcohol diluted down to 70% next time. I didn't filter the glop, and I hope that would help significantly with fighting bubbles. No hot rod either, just my fingers. my latest experiments weren't too bad already - just one or two odd spots due to bubbles.

Mating bath was about 13C. The biggest improvement was to put a sheet of glass over the mated pair and a weight on top of that. Without a weight I was tearing the tissue every time. Developing at 45-50C. Maybe too hot, but I find it difficult to melt my glop below that.

Having a dog doesn't help with a dust free environment, I like your idea of putting a developing tray over a fresh tissue. I am considering building a drying box with a HEPA filter blower. That would also be helpful to dry my film.

Sorry for off topic - was that a d*gital negative in your video?

eclarke · Jun 11, 2011

Excellent!! I'm also happy to see any darkroom video..Evan Clarke

R Shaffer · Jun 11, 2011

Great job. Really enjoyed the video.

I'm gonna try the alcohol spritz just prior to pouring the tissue.

gmikol · Jun 11, 2011

CMB said:
Dichromate is a highly toxic and corrosive carcinogen which should be used with great care. It is therefore quite alarming to see a how-to video intended primarily for novices...[snip]...I suggest the video be modified and/or a warning be posted in the comments section.

Charles, there is no doubt that dichromate is a substance which must be treated with care. I disagree with you on a couple of points, though.

1) This is not really a how-to video, so much as it is an overview, as Andrew described it and as I see it. It is much less detailed, IMO, than the video you posted a number of days ago of Tod Gangler prepping and pouring a magenta tissue. That might properly be called a "how-to" video.

2) Nowhere in the video does Andrew identify the sensitzer as a dichromate compound. It is simply identified as "sensitizer". As carbon printers we, of course, recognize it as being dichromate.

I think it's reasonable to assume that for anyone interested in the process from a purely informational standpoint (i.e. to understand the general nature of the process or how it differs from other conventional or alt- processes), the exact nature of the sensitizer (and the risks associated with handling it) are not really relevant. It's also reasonable to assume (IMO) that anyone interested in the process from a practical standpoint, and who has educated themselves to the point of equating sensitizer = dichromate, is most likely aware of the risks of dealing with dichromate.

If one were to plaster that video with warnings about the hazards of handling dichromate, then the message of the video becomes "Carbon printing is a toxic process". Perhaps a more general, "Please remember to handle all chemicals with appropriate care." warning?

Just my $0.02

--Greg

Leigh B · Jun 11, 2011

CMB said:
Andrew O'Neill said:

Dichromate is a highly toxic and corrosive carcinogen which should be used with great care. It is therefore quite alarming to see a how-to video intended primarily for novices in which dichromate sensitized carbon tissue is handled at various stages using gloveless hands.

Click to expand...

Charles,

It's the responsibility of every practitioner to evaluate the safety of their materials and processes.

That's true in every industry. I'm a machinist, and can tell you that most powered machine tools will kill you if you permit it. But only IF YOU permit it.

It is NOT the responsibility of every educator to explain every possible hazard. If they waste time doing such, the information being conveyed gets lost in the noise.

Our modern society is tending strongly to support the concept that individuals are not responsible for their actions, but society in general IS responsible for the actions of the individual.

What hogwash.

- Leigh

Andrew O'Neill · Jun 11, 2011

I always wear gloves. You can see that I am wearing gloves, but forgot for a few scenes. Sorry about that!

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