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Ste_S

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I have a EOS 300x and love it. Every now and again I get twitchy and wonder about getting one of the more 'advanced' bodies - 30v, 3 or 1V, especially as I've noticed prices seem to be rising slightly at the moment.

Any reason to change ? The EOS 300x has the 35 zone metering system and the E-TTL II flash system that's better than the older pro bodies. I quite fancy trying eye control out I guess ?
 

EdSawyer

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1V is the best camera Canon has ever made, even up until today. It's really worth having one, esp. @ the prices they sell for nowadays.
 

film_man

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The eye control is just a small thing that may not even work for you (it just doesn't work with some people's eyes and certainly not with glasses).

If you move "up" one level to a 30 body then the main advantages are a bigger viewfinder and a second control wheel. I also find the bigger body a bit nicer to hold without going overboard on the weight. You also get a limited number of custom functions, for me the one leaving the film winder out is the one that makes the difference as you can now change films mid-roll and then reload. The faster winder is cool plus the 30 is one of the quietest Canon SLR you can get. You can even do decent manual focusing. The shutter is more responsive too (I find the 300 has a bit of a lag compared to other cameras) and it feels smoother and better damped too.

The 3 and the 1V will get you an even better viewfinder plus the best AF and a body that is much more substantial and durable. You get custom functions for pretty much anything so you can setup the camera how you like. 1/3 stops? Done. 1/2 stops or maybe full stops? Which button does AF. Which button does AE lock and so on. The other major improvement on these cameras is that you can now replace the focus screen. An Ec-S screen is amazing for seeing depth of field to f/1.8 (the normal screen are f/2.8) and as such focusing much more accurately, especially if you are in to manual focus lenses. So you can get a Zeiss ZE lens for example and use it to its full potential or use any other manual lenses from Nikon, LeicaR, etc. The shutter is very fast and responsive, it is really noticeable compared to a 300.

I wouldn't worry myself about the ETTLII unless you have one of the new flashes that only use that. Personally I've been using either off camera flash with a flash meter or just sticking a Nikon SB80DX on the body in it's auto mode and it works fine.

I have owned all these bodies, 300, 300V, 300X, 30E, 3, 1N and 1V. I would say if you don't feel you need the manual focus and speed of the pro bodies (3/1) the 30 is a great upgrade. The viewfinder difference alone is significant. On the other hand the price difference between a 30 and a 3 is quite small nowadays.

You might as well buy a 3 and a 30, try them and sell them if you don't like them, you'd lose maybe £20-30 tops, consider it rental.
 

Hatchetman

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I have the EOS 3 with eye control. I never use that function. Maybe if I used it often and exclusively I would trust it more and know exactly how it was going to react under various conditions. Nice camera though. No complaints other than the silly batteries you have to use.
 

MattKing

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The models with the additional rotary control on the back are definitely worth considering.
For me, the eye control focus works both with and without glasses (separate calibrations) and I like it a lot. I certainly understand though why it isn't offered any more - a feature that doesn't work for everyone is a retailer's nightmare!
It is also worth looking for the corresponding battery packs that allow use of AA batteries. The extra size and weight is unfortunate, but the battery flexibility, additional control options and ergonomic flexibility are real pluses.
I really should sell some of my extra bodies!
 

Cholentpot

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The models with the additional rotary control on the back are definitely worth considering.
For me, the eye control focus works both with and without glasses (separate calibrations) and I like it a lot. I certainly understand though why it isn't offered any more - a feature that doesn't work for everyone is a retailer's nightmare!
It is also worth looking for the corresponding battery packs that allow use of AA batteries. The extra size and weight is unfortunate, but the battery flexibility, additional control options and ergonomic flexibility are real pluses.
I really should sell some of my extra bodies!

Agree with matt here.

It's the batteries that keep my from using my A2 more often. Those things are expensive. If I would have known at the time I would have got something that takes AAs instead.

Any suggestions for sub $50 EOS cameras that take AA?
 

flatulent1

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ECF works well if you're willing to 'teach' it. Not once, not twice, but several times, in all sorts of shooting conditions. I am left-eyed, and wear bifocals. I have no problem with ECF.

The 1V and 3 were Canon's very best film cameras. I also recommend the Elan 7N and 7NE as being wonderful to work with, and amazingly quiet, though they're plastic bodied. The 1N is also a very good camera, though of course a bit older.
 

MattKing

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Agree with matt here.

It's the batteries that keep my from using my A2 more often. Those things are expensive. If I would have known at the time I would have got something that takes AAs instead.

Any suggestions for sub $50 EOS cameras that take AA?
A Rebel 2000 with an accessory battery holder pack!
I have an extra (but it would be expensive to ship).
 
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What's the attraction...?
I have produced all of my pre-2009 transparency work with a Canon EOS 1N+power drive booster E1 and multifunction intervalometer back (1994 purchased, in continuous use until switching to MF in 2009), and a swag of L-series lenses. Really, I never cared much for whatever camera was being trumpeted after the 1N as being "better" (in whatever way perceived or actual) when my photography was already doing well with what I had! Reliability in all environments was a first-call requirement 20+ years ago and the 1N, like the 1V, do not shirk at getting wet, dusty, hot, chilled, sweaty or even dropped (but don't do that often!).

These big pro cameras will benefit from established competency in photography, but they can cause stumbling and confusion in the time needed to establish fluency with their operation, and this will most unlikely be immediate if you are stepping up from a consumer-level camera: the 1-series really do require freewheeling system-setting fluency on-the-go.

My concern has always been in the quality and application of the available lenses, and this is where I believe your thinking and money should be spent. Investing in quality lenses is never cheap, especially Canon's/Nikon's, but it is better than glossing over a heavy (2.4kg abouts), technology-laden camera that only holds the film...

You already know the 1V is a professional-level camera descended form the 1N, with excellent E-TTL flash functionality (especially management of wireless multiflash setups, which so very, very few people make use of) but its metering, besides being clustered centrally, was also directly descended from the EOS 1N but has the same number of modalities and more points (not always a benefit). Doubling-up of top panel push buttons/mode selectors, custom functions and the modus operandi of the power drive booster essentially remain close to the same as the 1N. You certainly would not be using either camera with a silly 2CR5 battery, and instead loading up with 8 AA batteries in the power drive booster to really throttle the machine and especially, increase hand-holding flexibility and stability and shooting reliability over the weak and insipid 2CR5 stocks. And yes, a PDBE1 will throttle 10 frames off in a second (with a fast L-series lens matched to it), just for kicks.

The EOS 3, 30 and 33 were just awful cameras that tried to upstage the 1V. This backfired. The 1V sitting on the top shelf on black velvet, did not need interlopers or impersonators, or silly eye controlled focus (I got to experience this with a stand-in EOS 5 and later EOS 50E and only the 50E impressed in its versatility, as the 5 suffered repeated failure of the mode control dial and back cover latch). Used 1V bodies go for around $550 to $790 here in Australia with power-drive booster E1 attached (as would be expected for serious use). The 1N is about $440 to $600.

From recent discussions, Canon does not appear to service either the 1N or 1V (nor other EOS film bodies) now because parts are no longer available. Independent repairers can easily take up the void, and indeed, the dust removal from my 1N was a 1.5 hour job and $49.50 -- probably 5x that with Canon...

An ordinary, unremarkable summary: buy whatever camera takes your fancy. But put your money and photographic skill into quality lenses.
 
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My money would be on the 1n for value, unless you can get a 1v for not a lot more. I have no idea what the prices are these days. They are heavier though, so that is a real factor. If you want lighter then the last version of the Elan whatever it was called would be nice. The Elans were also a lot quieter than the 1 series and as I think Matt stated above, they have the rear thumb wheel which is fantastic.

As far as durability goes, you should see my 1n....

I agree with Poisson about the Eos 3. The 1 series was better.
 

MattKing

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The other thing to watch for is the fact that the name of each model varied with the market it was sold in.
Here in Canada there are cameras from all the markets - it can be incredibly confusing!
 

CMoore

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The other thing to watch for is the fact that the name of each model varied with the market it was sold in.
Here in Canada there are cameras from all the markets - it can be incredibly confusing!
Why did/do manufactures do that.?
Why call it an ABC in one place, and an XYZ in another.?
Thank You
 

Cholentpot

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Why did/do manufactures do that.?
Why call it an ABC in one place, and an XYZ in another.?
Thank You

It's even worse in the digital line. A T6i is not the same camera as a T6 or a T6s. Everywhere else they use a number system.
 
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Why did/do manufactures do that.?
Why call it an ABC in one place, and an XYZ in another.?
Thank You

Canon's EOS cameras have been made in many countries under licence and re-designated as a condition of licensed manufacturing. Manufacturing facilities exist(ed) in the Phillipines, China, Taiwan, Portugal, Mexico, Japan. The cheapest plastic EOS bodies and plastic-mount entry-level EF lenses were made in the Phillipines, China, Taiwan and Mexico. The top-shelf bodies came direct from the two Japanese factories. Professional-level EOS bodies (1N, 1V and all variants thereof) are always known the same model designation in whatever international market. But they were often supplied with user manuals in the language of the market where they were bought e.g. if an EOS 1V was picked up in Portugal, the instructions would be in Spanish!

Nikon has a similar arrangement with international markets and manufacturing.
 

MattKing

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In addition to the differences in manufacturing location, many of the marketing decisions are made by the local distributors, not the manufacturers.
So things like model names and numbers are specified by those distributors, and not the manufacturers.
This can make a certain amount of sense - considering that the model name for the Rebel 2000 (North America) was the Kiss III in Japan.
I just couldn't see myself going up to a camera store clerk and asking about a Kiss III:wink:.
If you think the Canon international naming is confusing, you don't want to look at Gossen meters!
 
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If you think the Canon international naming is confusing, you don't want to look at Gossen meters!

Dunno. I see Gossen Starlite Pro meters gathering dust on dealer shelves; what else are they known as?? They look nice. Maybe people are much more partial to Sekonic... bandit:
 

MattKing

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Dunno. I see Gossen Starlite Pro meters gathering dust on dealer shelves; what else are they known as?? They look nice. Maybe people are much more partial to Sekonic... bandit:
The distributor in the US for years required that models known under one designation in the rest of the world be badged differently in the US.
So, for example, the world knew a meter as a Profisix, while US consumers saw it on the shelf as a Luna Pro SBC.
 

tomfrh

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I’ve tried most of them, including the 1v and 3.

My favourite is the 30v, it does almost as much as the 1v and 3, but is much lighter. It’s a much better camera than the 300x.

I got rid of all my EOS and settled on three 30v’s - one BW, one C41, and one BW

They have eye control but it’s a gimmick in my opinion. Canon dropped it for a reason.
 

CMoore

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The whole Canon EF/FD (film) thing is kind of "weird". Not sure if there is any other Brand of 35mm equivalent.?
At the time, it was pretty divisive. To this day, i have never used, nor even held an EF Canon. There are probably a lot of EF users that do not own, or have maybe never used the FD stuff.?
A soon as somebody says Canon (for film) I automatically think FD.
For somebody getting into film.....it (EF, Rebel, Etc) might be a great suggestion.You can probably get some fabulous deals on bodies. Not sure what the lens sell for (compare to FD) ...they can screw onto a Digital SLR, can't they.?
 
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mjork

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For me, the main benefit of the above-budget level EOS cameras is the thumb wheel on the back. That combined with the dial on top is simply the best film camera user interface ever made...
You would get that just by going to the Elan 7N. I think that's a better choice than a 1 because it's lighter and smaller.
Eye control on my 50E wasn't a good experience (probably because of my glasses).
 

MattKing

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My Elan 7N came to me for free, and my Elan 7NE cost me $25.00 on Craigslist.
Good choices, but they are among the EOS bodies that don't meter correctly with non-EF lenses mounted via adapter.
 

film_man

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The EOS 3, 30 and 33 were just awful cameras that tried to upstage the 1V. This backfired.

In what way did the 3/30/33 try to upstage the 1V? It was very clear what each line tried to do and at what price point. Also, not sure how the 3 is an awful camera, it is effectively the same camera as the 1V. What you pay extra for a 1V is more weather sealing, 100% viewfinder and a faster motordrive.
 

NJH

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Agree on the lens statement. Any one of the 70-200 L lenses is reason enough perhaps to buy an EOS camera.
 

neilt3

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The whole Canon EF/FD (film) thing is kind of "weird". Not sure if there is any other Brand of 35mm equivalent.?
At the time, it was pretty divisive. To this day, i have never used, nor even held an EF Canon. There are probably a lot of EF users that do not own, or have maybe never used the FD stuff.?
A soon as somebody says Canon (for film) I automatically think FD.
For somebody getting into film.....it might be a great suggestion.You can probably get some fabulous deals on bodies. Not sure what the lens sell for (compare to FD) ...they can screw onto a Digital SLR, can't they.?

Minolta did the same .
The manual focus cameras were the "SR" mount , when they brought out the Minolta 7000AF in 1985 they came up with the "A" mount .
The only way of using the older SR mount lenses on an A mount body was with 2x teleconverter , either for the shorter lenses (the "S" for 135mm-300mm IIRC) or the longer version 2x ( "L" for 300mm plus) .
No A/F and no automatic aperture stopdown .
 
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