canon advice

bob100684 · Sep 25, 2007

After a couple of years shooting film with an old nikon and digital with a canon drebel, I think its time to go for a canon film body so that I don't wind up having to double the lens collection. Does anyone here shoot with a canon film rebel? I've only handled one a couple times and honestly they felt cheap and light, is the elan a better bet, and how much functionality would I really be giving up by choosing a rebel over the elan or gaining choosing the elan over the rebel?

Dan Henderson · Sep 25, 2007

I had (still have but have not used in a long time) an Elan 7e that I liked alot. I moved up to an EOS3, which I cannot recommend highly enough. I have no experience with the Rebel so cannot compare it to the Elan, but I think you get some extra things like a stop down button on the elan that is missing on the Reb. Maybe a few more shooting modes too.

bob100684 · Sep 25, 2007

Thank you for the reply. Somehow I thought one of the rebels had a stop down button, but that would be an extremely nice feature. Does your elan have miror lock up? Also, any advice about a macro lens or which one would be appreciated. I'm looking at the 100mm version but would also consider some of the 3rd party lenses if they are up to snuff.

Lee Shively · Sep 25, 2007

I have a Rebel 2000--rather, my wife now has it since I don't use it anymore. It's not a bad camera but I'd definitely consider it a backup instead of a primary. In my opinion, the main shortcoming of the Rebels--digital and film--is the use of mirror prisms instead of glass prisms. Real prisms make for brighter viewfinders.

I would recommend a used Canon. The A2/A2E/EOS 5 models are dependable, lightweight bodies with excellent features. They do have a documented problem with the command dial breaking, however. Also, right now you can get an EOS 1n pretty cheap. It's a full-featured pro model. For a plastic skinned camera, it's heavy, rugged and dependable. I've not used any of the Elan models but I haven't heard anything bad about them either.

bob100684 · Sep 25, 2007

Lee Shively said:
I have a Rebel 2000--rather, my wife now has it since I don't use it anymore. It's not a bad camera but I'd definitely consider it a backup instead of a primary. In my opinion, the main shortcoming of the Rebels--digital and film--is the use of mirror prisms instead of glass prisms. Real prisms make for brighter viewfinders.

I would recommend a used Canon. The A2/A2E/EOS 5 models are dependable, lightweight bodies with excellent features. They do have a documented problem with the command dial breaking, however. Also, right now you can get an EOS 1n pretty cheap. It's a full-featured pro model. For a plastic skinned camera, it's heavy, rugged and dependable. I've not used any of the Elan models but I haven't heard anything bad about them either.

Thank you for the advice.

celluloidpropaganda · Sep 25, 2007

www.keh.com - check their Canon auto focus selection - anything you want from $125 (Elan 7e) to $290-350 for an EOS 3 to $450 for the 1n.

Their 'excellent' grade is, in my experience, close to new and better than almost anything you find on Ebay.

film_guy · Sep 25, 2007

I have both the Elan 7N and also the EOS 3, and I started digital photography back when the first Digital Rebel or 300D was introduced. The Elan 7N feels like the 10/20D, while the EOS 3 feels more like a professional camera aka the 1D-series cameras.

I'd go for an Elan 7-series camera over the film Rebel, since it feels much better in my hands. But if you don't mind spending an extra $100-150, I highly recommend going with at least an EOS 3, and if money is no problem, the 1V is a great buy too.

Palantiri7 · Sep 25, 2007

I own the EOS 5, and the EOS 3. The 3 is far better built, and is far more advanced, which is a moot point because I switch off most of the automation. What the 5 has on the 3 is lack of shutter noise. The 5 is as quiet as a mouse while the 3 sounds like a gun going off by comparison. Well, I exaggerate, but not by much!

nicolai · Sep 25, 2007

I have an Elan 7n and I've never wanted it to do something it couldn't. (If I shot sports, I'd probably want a higher frame rate, but I don't.)

I'm not familiar with the third party lens situation, but I have the 100mm/2.8 macro and am very satisfied with it (one of the only Canon EOS lenses I really like out of the five I own (I got spoiled by starting out shooting rangefinder primes)).

film_guy · Sep 26, 2007

If you're going to use a lot of flash, and would prefer Canon's latest flash-system, you'd be better off going with the Elan 7N-series SLRs, since they have ETTL-II, while the 1V and 3 have only ETTL. It doesn't make much of a difference to me, since I only use flash on approx. 5% when I shoot film.

ben-s · Sep 26, 2007

I own an EOS 500, which is very small and light - In fact, so light as on first inspection to seem cheap and slightly flimsy. This is an illusion, as it has stood up well to the heavy use I have given it. There are only a couple of things I don't like about it - The plastic lens mount (although it has never actually been a problem), and the design of the pop up flash. The flash has a small lip that sticks out very slightly, and on a number of occasions I have caught this and yanked the flash up. While this hasn't caused any damage, it can't be good for the camera. It's worth noting that the EOS 5 also has the same design of flash.

A friend has an EOS 50E, which I really like. It seems well built, and it has a rear command dial as well as the front one.

I like the look of the 30 & 33v, and I have used the 33V briefly. they seem generally good cameras.

A while ago, I had an accident with my other EOS 500. I won't go into the sordid details, but basically I put my finger through the shutter curtain
Thus I went camera hunting, and found an EOS 1N. After thinking for about 2.5 nanoseconds, I bought it.
The 1N suits me perfectly. As a camera, it is very fast and responsive, and the design is great. The build quality is extremely high, and the grip fits my hand as if it were custom made.
One feature I haven't used myself, but others might, is the silent wind. This slows the wind & rewind speed down, so it becomes very quiet.
It is also completely safe with all types of IR film, using a mechanical rather than an infrared counter.

I'm still trying to find an excuse to run HIE through it at 6 FPS...

bob100684 · Sep 26, 2007

ben-s said:
I own an EOS 500, which is very small and light - In fact, so light as on first inspection to seem cheap and slightly flimsy. This is an illusion, as it has stood up well to the heavy use I have given it. There are only a couple of things I don't like about it - The plastic lens mount (although it has never actually been a problem), and the design of the pop up flash. The flash has a small lip that sticks out very slightly, and on a number of occasions I have caught this and yanked the flash up. While this hasn't caused any damage, it can't be good for the camera. It's worth noting that the EOS 5 also has the same design of flash.

A friend has an EOS 50E, which I really like. It seems well built, and it has a rear command dial as well as the front one.

I like the look of the 30 & 33v, and I have used the 33V briefly. they seem generally good cameras.

A while ago, I had an accident with my other EOS 500. I won't go into the sordid details, but basically I put my finger through the shutter curtain
Thus I went camera hunting, and found an EOS 1N. After thinking for about 2.5 nanoseconds, I bought it.
The 1N suits me perfectly. As a camera, it is very fast and responsive, and the design is great. The build quality is extremely high, and the grip fits my hand as if it were custom made.
One feature I haven't used myself, but others might, is the silent wind. This slows the wind & rewind speed down, so it becomes very quiet.
It is also completely safe with all types of IR film, using a mechanical rather than an infrared counter.

I'm still trying to find an excuse to run HIE through it at 6 FPS...

interesting...part of the reason I chose the digital rebel over nikon's offering is the latch for the pop up flash is metal as opposed to plastic, which at least in the two stores I visited had broken from people pulling the pop up flash up.

ben-s · Sep 26, 2007

bob100684 said:
interesting...part of the reason I chose the digital rebel over nikon's offering is the latch for the pop up flash is metal as opposed to plastic, which at least in the two stores I visited had broken from people pulling the pop up flash up.

Yeowch! Either the nikon is very weak (I find this hard to believe - while I'm not a nikon user personally, the ones I've handled seem well built) or the people yanking them had absolutely no business being within 10 feet of a camera...

The catch on the 500 is plastic, but it's fairly thick. I'd be quite surprised if it broke.

The design of the 50E (and my 30D) is better than the 5 / 500 / 300D, as the flash goes down into a sort of well. the only exposed bits are the top and sides, which being smooth, don't get caught

That is one more reason I like the 1N - there is no internal flash to get abused.

pcyco · Sep 26, 2007

hallo

i use a eos 5 since 1992 or 3. and ist still works well. i took the camera to the sahara, the alps,... no repair .

maybe the eos1 is better. i dont know

ag

thomas

jeroldharter · Sep 26, 2007

I don't think that the older Canon cameras (e.g. AE-1) use the same lens mount as EOS cameras so I would stay away from those.

I have an older Elan and an EOS1v. I rarely use them anymore because I am doing 4x5 most of the time but they are great cameras. 35 mm film cameras are so cheap now on the used market. Just buy a dozen of them and take your pick. Most modern 35 mm cameras have more features than you can remember. As long as it has TTL flash and mirror lock up it should be fine.

bob100684 · Sep 26, 2007

ben-s said:
Yeowch! Either the nikon is very weak (I find this hard to believe - while I'm not a nikon user personally, the ones I've handled seem well built) or the people yanking them had absolutely no business being within 10 feet of a camera...

The catch on the 500 is plastic, but it's fairly thick. I'd be quite surprised if it broke.

The design of the 50E (and my 30D) is better than the 5 / 500 / 300D, as the flash goes down into a sort of well. the only exposed bits are the top and sides, which being smooth, don't get caught

That is one more reason I like the 1N - there is no internal flash to get abused.

I would have too except that at the store I work at I set up our D40x display and witnessed the first customer to handle the camera breaking the flash catch by just pulling the pop up flash up....I used an fm2n that I inherited when my parents went to a digital compact, and then an fe2 when a friend put their finger through the fm2's shutter...which was more expensive than a new used camera to repair. Both are built like tanks, the new nikons sure feel nice, but after seeing what happened to the d40x I'm somewhat doubtful.

Kvistgaard · Sep 26, 2007

Re Canon advice

Bob,

I use an EOS 33 and am very happy with it. Fair price, solid build, the right shooting modes ASPM, mirror lock up, stop down button, great user interface with large switches and buttons. Metal lens mount.

I use a battery pack which doubles as a vertical grip. This improves ergonomics and makes the camera somewhat heavy, which I consider an advantage in practical use.

Drawbacks are a somewhat loud mirror slap + an assortment of somewhat superflouous features (these are easy to switch off or avoid, though).

I'd recommend you take a look at this camera. The Europe version is here: http://www.canon-europe.com/For_Hom...x.asp?ComponentID=155555&SourcePageID=26025#1 (the 33V is a 30V without the eye control gimmick).

Søren

film_guy · Sep 26, 2007

The EOS 33 (Elan 7-series) cameras are actually one of the quietest newer SLRs for the Canon-mount. It's really quiet and one of the best cameras for concerts and churches.

bob100684 · Sep 26, 2007

film_guy said:
The EOS 33 (Elan 7-series) cameras are actually one of the quietest newer SLRs for the Canon-mount. It's really quiet and one of the best cameras for concerts and churches.

Thanks for all the help, I've narrowed it down to a used elan or a eos3 If I can find one in good condition from keh or the like.

ben-s · Sep 26, 2007

Sounds like either would be a good choice... Good luck

bob100684 · Sep 27, 2007

ben-s said:
Sounds like either would be a good choice... Good luck

thank you! A week and one day till the next paycheck comes in so hopefully I'll be placing my order a week from monday.

Tim Gray · Sep 27, 2007

Sounds like you've got all good advice already. Just wanted to say The Elan 7 is a great camera - I've been meaning to pick one up for a quiet alternative since they are so dang cheap.

Definitely have an 3 in future. For $350ish, it's got to be an awesome camera. I don't have one - I sprung the extra money for a used 1V which is just amazing. I figured why not shoot with one of the best Canon film cameras while I still can - haven't regretted it for a minute. But, its not that much different than a 3 when you get down to it.

The nicest thing about the 3 and the 1V, besides the build quality and feel, is the spot meter. Can't remember if the Elan has a spot meter...

kevin_c · Sep 27, 2007

I believe the Elan 7 (7N?) is the same as the EOS 30 (or 33?) in the UK - I have an EOS 30 and it's a pretty good body, especially considdering I only paid £25 for it on ebay!

I have used an EOS 3 and yes it is a better built camera with a few more functions etc. but for general usage i don't think you can beat the EOS 30 or 33.

The only thing I find a PITA on the EOS 30 is the fact that it doesn't have a backlight on the LCD display - I believe the EOS33 (the slightly newer model) does.

Of course it all comes down to money...

sausage100uk · Sep 27, 2007

I have a 5 (N.B. apparently the US version doesnt have the same over/under exposure scale) and it does what is says on the tin (i.e. more than I can make use of). Any of the "pro-sumer" EOSs are good and will do whatever you ask of them. FWIW my 2p is I will say that having an onboard flash can be good for those times when you need a bit of infill. have a look at photonotes.org for somne comparisons if you're still stuck.

aldevo · Sep 27, 2007

Tim Gray said:
Sounds like you've got all good advice already. Just wanted to say The Elan 7 is a great camera - I've been meaning to pick one up for a quiet alternative since they are so dang cheap.

Definitely have an 3 in future. For $350ish, it's got to be an awesome camera. I don't have one - I sprung the extra money for a used 1V which is just amazing. I figured why not shoot with one of the best Canon film cameras while I still can - haven't regretted it for a minute. But, its not that much different than a 3 when you get down to it.

The nicest thing about the 3 and the 1V, besides the build quality and feel, is the spot meter. Can't remember if the Elan has a spot meter...

The Elan has a "partial spot" meter that covers about 10% of the frame.

I bought an Elan from KEH a few years back and promptly returned it. It's a quiet camera but it's low-light AF does not perform well and it lacks a true spot meter. I found it felt flimsy, though some might disagree.

I returned it and bought a used EOS-5 (identical to the A2E). The 5 is every bit as quiet as the Elan, has a better spot meter (3.3% - still not a TRUE spot, IMO), and has much better low-light AF. The only drawbacks I find are a slight increase in weight (though more than justified by its better build), its incomatability with E-TTL flashes (not significant for me since I use a Sunpak 383 AutoFlash), and the aforementioned command switch problem. My switch broke the very day I received the camera and KEH fixed it under warranty. It has not troubled me again, though I mostly shoot my M42 cameras these days.

These days the EOS-3 costs less than the EOS-5 did four years ago, has better metering and AF performance, is weather-proof, supports E-TTL, and has better build with no known reliability problems. It's a bit heavier and noisier than the 5, but I think it would be the way to go.

Most 3's seem to have been owned by yuppies who bought them and promptly stuck them in the closet, too, rather than professionals who put them trough their paces on a daily basis. There's a fair chance, as a result, that the mechanical components will have many, many fewer cycles on them than a 1N or 1V.

canon advice

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