Camera on which the film can be forwarded less than a frame

Erik Petersson · Apr 26, 2019

hi,
Asking for equipment recommendation. I have a medium format folder on which the film can be forwarded just a little bit each time. I make multiexposures in panorama format with it.
Now I am searching for something similar for 35mm. It can be low-fi, not looking for sharpness or contrast primarily. I need to be able to forward the film just a little bit in order to do many partly overlapping exposures.
Thanks in ahead for sharing your knowledge!
Erik

AgX · Apr 26, 2019

I cannot think of any 35mm camera where transport is not locked after one frame (aside of rotary panoramic cameras)
You could modify such camera by disebgaging such lock.

Another approach, as you indicated, is using a 35mm camera where film-transport and cocking are not linked. By ths you can transport the film by fractions of a frame, until a full frame has been exposed. By breaking the the full-frame lock, as indicated above, you could even expose at larger aspect ratios.

Examples of what you are looking for are the Lomo Smena, Smena 6, Smena 8, Smena 8M .

Ces1um · Apr 26, 2019

Erik Petersson said:
hi,
Asking for equipment recommendation. I have a medium format folder on which the film can be forwarded just a little bit each time. I make multiexposures in panorama format with it.
Now I am searching for something similar for 35mm. It can be low-fi, not looking for sharpness or contrast primarily. I need to be able to forward the film just a little bit in order to do many partly overlapping exposures.
Thanks in ahead for sharing your knowledge!
Erik

Lomography has lots of cameras that can do overlapping panoramas. I know the lubitel can do it both with 120 and with 35mm film. I ~think~ the belair can do it as well, but better double check that.

Erik Petersson · Apr 26, 2019

Thanks! I am actually in Kyiv at the moment, so I could probably find a Smena here. I’ll look for that. Liubitels are a bit larger, a small camera seems perfect for my photo idea.

Chan Tran · Apr 26, 2019

While it's not precise I think you can rewind the film a little bit after advancing the whole frame and cock the shutter.

tezzasmall · Apr 26, 2019

Holga cameras come in 35mm as well as 120 size and you can get them in both an 'ordinary' styled 35mm camera and a TLR 35mm camera. I haven't got either but I can only presume that they have, like the 120 models, a film advance lever that has to be used in conjunction with the numbers on the backing paper, so one can advance as much as required. There's probably other ones in the 'plastic / toy' camera section which others may know of...?

Terry S

Kino · Apr 26, 2019

The Howay Anny 35 is a camera that has absolutely no coupling between the shutter release and the film advance; you could make a million exposures on a frame or across a roll if you like and they are very inexpensive.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Anny-Howay...499066?hash=item34071ad7ba:g:GNsAAOSwwFlclSNj

https://www.lomography.com/cameras/3341875-howay-hoei-anny-35/photos

Bill Burk · Apr 26, 2019

Why almost every 35mm camera I know has a rewind button that you can push at any time that disengages the sprockets until you wind forwards again.

On Pentax M42 cameras for instance you can press it and hold as you wind to get a superimposed frame. It's not "in register" as the loose sprockets/tension may allow the film to move slightly. But if you wind halfway then press the button, it's going to do exactly what you are talking about.

Erik Petersson · Apr 26, 2019

I already picked up a smena 8m, at my favourite photo store here in Kyiv (fotolavka), I hope this will solve my problem. The shutter is unrelated to the winder as far as I can tell.
When I come home I will post an example what I got with my Voigtländer E-messer and this idea. Hope to do something similar on 35mm now. Thanks everyone!

AgX · Apr 26, 2019

Bill Burk said:
Why? Almost every 35mm camera I know has a rewind button that you can push at any time that disengages the sprockets until you wind forwards again.

By disengaging the sprocket wheel, one can do as many exposure on the same frame as one likes. But the OP also wants to move the film deliberately.
However film transport then only is possible by the rewind. As the transport lever then is limited to shutter cocking.

To come up to the OP's requirements, the film should be first transported without effective exposure (lens cap) to the take-up spool. Then operated with the disengage button pressed. (By this there is no more need to manipulate internally a frame lock in the transport chain and any aspect ratio may be composed by multi-exposure).

Chan Tran · Apr 26, 2019

AgX said:
By disengaging the sprocket wheel, one can do as many exposure on the same frame as one likes. But the OP also wants to move the film deliberately.
However film transport then only is possible by the rewind. As the transport lever then is limited to shutter cocking.

To come up to the OP's requirements, the film should be first transported without effective exposure (lens cap) to the take-up spool. Then operated with the disengage button pressed. (By this there is no more need to manipulate internally a frame lock in the transport chain and any aspect ratio may be composed by multi-exposure).

I was thinking that after the first exposure one can advance the film partially with the advance level then push in the rewind button to complete cocking the shutter without further advancing the film.

Kino · Apr 26, 2019

I know the OP has already picked up a camera, but thought I'd still post this in case anyone reads this thread in the future looking for a like-type camera.

The Howay Anny-35 can easily be used in this fashion. The shutter is uncoupled from the frame counter, which is a simple film sprocket that locks the film advance knob after a standard frame passes the gate. In normal operation, the rewind release lever above the door is momentarily pushed to allow film to continue to be advanced. The shutter can be fired continuously; there is no interlock.

To rewind the film, you have to hold the rewind lever back and turn the rewind knob.

It appears that the camera advances the distance of about a perforation with 2 "clicks" of the ratcheted advance knob.

The only real disadvantage of this camera is that it has one timed shutter speed (1/50th I think) and "B". It would fall in the "toy camera" category in all likelihood...

adelorenzo · Apr 26, 2019

Buy a 35mm - 120 adapter and then you could use medium format cameras. Your shots would be extra panoramic too They are easily and cheaply found on eBay or you can 3d print your own.

jim10219 · Apr 26, 2019

What about an Argus C3? Or maybe something with a leaf shutter? I know my David White Stereo Realist will allow it, but you may not be looking for a stereo camera.

Ko.Fe. · Apr 27, 2019

Yep, Smena-8M. Awesome camera made in many millions. And not low-fi, but cost is low. Very meditative as well.

tezzasmall · Apr 27, 2019

Ko.Fe. said:
Yep, Smena-8M. Awesome camera made in many millions. And not low-fi, but cost is low. Very meditative as well.

Cost is low? It can be as I've just taken a look on ebay and yes there's loads available, from sensible prices right up to (in British sterling) a couple of hundred pounds plus!!!

Terry S

Erik Petersson · Apr 27, 2019

I bought mine in Kyiv for 200 hryvna, approximately 7-8 USD. I am sure they can be ordered from to a comparable price.

Ko.Fe. · Apr 27, 2019

tezzasmall said:
Cost is low? It can be as I've just taken a look on ebay and yes there's loads available, from sensible prices right up to (in British sterling) a couple of hundred pounds plus!!!

Terry S

I didn't know BS is so devalued now. In USD it is under twenty.
https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_fr...1.A0.H0.XSmena-8m.TRS5&_nkw=Smena-8m&_sacat=0

Erik Petersson · Apr 28, 2019

Here is an example, of what I did on mediumformat, with my folder. This one is contact printed.

Click on "instagram link" to see a bigger version. I hope to make similar pictures, but with a bit more of detail and variation.

Erik Petersson · Apr 28, 2019

That upload was hardly visible.... Here it is in at a greater size.

What I get our of this, is a skyline and a hint of a city below.

I was inspired by Jacob Felländer's exhibition "I want to live close to you" and want to see if I can achieve something similar. This one is maybe a first draft...

Here's a link to Felländer's work.
http://www.jacobfellander.com/i-want-to-live-close-to-you/

And then I thought I might try with 35mm, and I started this thread.

John51 · Apr 29, 2019

If the camera has an independent shutter, ie. can be cocked without using the film advance, you could keep the lens cap on and shoot 36 blanks. Then you can rewind partial frames.

Cholentpot · Apr 29, 2019

Gonna say the Argus C3. I think I can do it with a Vito II too.

Hatchetman · Apr 29, 2019

That is pretty cool. I believe this would work with a Kodak Signet 35. There is a shutter lock release. wind the film a bit. cock the shutter. unlock it. fire. repeat.

Camera on which the film can be forwarded less than a frame

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