Camera for film scanning (UK)

cattytown · Nov 14, 2023

Hi Guys, new here so please be gentle!
I am looking at negative scanning and have seen the comments that using a camera gets better results and is quite a bit quicker than using a neg scanner. What I don't have is an existing DSLR or similar and am looking at cameras that may do the job.
I have two thoughts - should I look at a camera that will work with existing lenses as I may as well use it as a camera occasionally, or should I look at a cheaper camera that will just be used for this?
My current film camera is a Nikon F80 so F-Mount lenses (I know there are lots of flavours...)
I was looking at the Kyle McDougal video where he was using a FujiFilm X-A3 that he got for about £125 - I can't see them even close to that.
So, can anyone suggest suitable camera/lens options that are readily available in the UK?

Thanks,
Paul.

koraks · Nov 14, 2023

Alright, can you elaborate a bit on your requirements? E.g.:
* Which film format(s) do you want to digitize?
* What are your resolution requirements; i.e. how big (in pixel dimensions) do you want the scans to be?
* If you have prior experience with scanned film, what are the problems from earlier experience you want to avoid? And vice versa, which quality aspects do you want to preserve or even optimize?
* Do you have any digital camera systems presently that may form the basis for a 'scanning' kit?
* Are you willing to entertain other options besides using a camera to scan film?

cattytown · Nov 14, 2023

Hi Koraks, Sorry it somehow submitted while I was talking!

I am open to anything - just saw a lot of comments that camera was better then most dedicated scanners.
35mm - probably mainly B&W
No prior experience to have problems with.
Resolution - not sure.
I have a lumix DMC-TZ80 - (18MP) compact digital, and an Olympus TG-5 Tough (12MP) I suspect the Lumix would be the better of the two. Being compacts I don't think I'll have any input on control or exposure.
Edit - apparently my oneplus 8pro phone is 48MP!+
Thanks

4season · Nov 14, 2023

cattytown said:
I am looking at negative scanning ... should I look at a camera that will work with existing lenses as I may as well use it as a camera occasionally, or should I look at a cheaper camera that will just be used for this?

The answer to all of your questions may be "yes"!

Sensor size isn't terribly important in this application, but depth (and flatness) of field are. Rather than use a zoom lens boasting of macro focusing, I might prefer an actual macro lens, such as a Micro-Nikkor.

Some of the more premium Olympus M43 cameras offer a resolution-quadrupling pixel-shift feature, which can yield up to 80 mp raw files. And combined with 2x crop factor, that 50 mm macro lens gains the easy working distance of a 100 mm equivalent on a FF camera, but with a bit more DoF. Pen-F (which is what I own) prices tend to be high, but I've seen EM5 IIs selling for less than 300 USD.

Admittedly, my own 35 mm images don't seem to particularly benefit from super high res scans, and beyond 24 megapixels or so, (shrug).

koraks · Nov 14, 2023

@cattytown, I would suggest to start with what you have and evaluate the results, so you can make a better informed decision of which direction to take this. I'd start with the Lumix on a tripod and the film on a light box, which may be as simple as a LED tracing pad with a suitable diffuser (e.g. a sheet of frosted plexiglas) on top of it.

cattytown said:
Being compacts I don't think I'll have any input on control or exposure.

Be sure to read the Lumix' manual, because I can assure you that it will most definitely allow all sorts of manual input on areas that matter, notably focus, exposure and white balance.

Forget about the Olympus and the phone for now. The Lumix is your best bet.

See how far you get with it and then analyze where you're unhappy with the results, so you can proceed in a more focused way.

_T_ · Nov 14, 2023

An 18 megapixel camera can get you a very good scan, suitable for prints that are just large enough to hang on the wall. If you're only using the files for posting online or viewing on a screen it will far exceed your needs.

cattytown · Nov 14, 2023

Thanks Koraks - I like advice that's actually "go with what you have - it's a decent start" (actually just moments ago gave pretty much identical advice to someone else in an unrelated field )

Now, where did I put the manual...

_T_ - potentially aiming at good sized prints

_T_ · Nov 14, 2023

If your entire system including support, lens, light source and your intervention can match the performance of your sensor you'd be readily able to get a good 16"x20". Depending on the viewing distance where you hang the print you could go as big as 20"x30", say if there is a piece of furniture between the viewer and the print.

Two23 · Nov 14, 2023

You don't need to spend a lot. Nikon D600 and Nikon 60mm micro (macro.) Used, ebay. More than adequate.

Kent in SD

cattytown · Nov 14, 2023

Thanks Kent.

Niglyn · Nov 14, 2023

I use the nikon D850, which has built in negative digitizing feature & flips it to a positive.
Nikon would recommend you use their macro lens with nikon digitizer attachment.
Instead, I bought one of those digitizer tubes with lens in the middle and neg carrier at the end. They come with a T mount, so you buy a T to Nikon adaptor.

They were around in the 90s. Not made anymore, I got mine on Ebay.

silvergelatin · Nov 14, 2023

I recently bought a system from scratch for the purpose of scanning, and found that the best balance of resolution vs price (used) in my country was Sony. I bought an A7RII and Sigma 70mm Macro ART lens, and the results are excellent. That lens came highly recommended. Light source and neg holders are another potentially expensive and complicated matter you will need to address.

cattytown · Nov 15, 2023

Thanks guys - I think those options are perhaps a bit rich for me at the moment - nice to know though.
I am thinking that I'll set up simply to begin with and ultimately keep my eyes open for something like a D600 and micro nikkor 105mm

Overrank · Nov 15, 2023

Try the 60mm AF-D and the JJC digitising set, which should both be pretty cheap.

tbh. If you‘re spending on a camera/lens/holder/software just for digitising then you might get better mileage out of just buying a film scanner.

cattytown · Nov 17, 2023

Thanks - will the 60mm be enough to get 1:1?

_T_ · Nov 17, 2023

The micro nikkor 60mm af-d is able to achieve 1:1 magnification on a full frame camera. On a crop sensor you can get higher magnification depending on the size of your sensor.

cattytown · Nov 17, 2023

Cool, Thanks

Overrank · Nov 17, 2023

This page gives all the different possible lenses supported by the JJC set https://www.jjc.cc/index/goods/detail.html?id=1024

dokko · Nov 17, 2023

_T_ said:
The micro nikkor 60mm af-d is able to achieve 1:1 magnification on a full frame camera. On a crop sensor you can get higher magnification depending on the size of your sensor.

this is likely a confusion with terminology, but a lens that magnifies 1:1 will do this regardless of sensor size, it's a purely optical term.

what 1:1 means is that the image on the sensor will appear at the same size as the object that was photographed. for example, if we photograph a ruler, 1cm markings on the ruler will appear 1cm spaced apart on the film or sensor.

what does change with the sensor size is field of view. so on a picture of the ruler on full frame sensor, we will see 36 mm markings on the image horizontally, while on an APS sensor, we only see 24 mm markings. so in this regard it might appear that the APS sensor has higher magnification, but it doesn't in optical terms.
of course this still means that if we want to scan a 36x24mm negative with an APS camera, we'll need a lower magnification (0.67:1) because at 1:1 we'd only see a crop.

this might appear like nitpicking, but it matters once we need to calculate certain optical factors (depth of field, effective aperture etc).

_T_ · Nov 17, 2023

No you’re not nitpicking. You’re totally correct. I wasn’t thinking when I said that.

Robert Ley · Nov 17, 2023

I am digitizing about 25 years worth of negatives, mostly 120, 4x5 and 35mm.
I use a Nikon D600 and have both the 60 and 105 AF Micro-Nikkors. The 60mm lens I use for 4x5 and the 105mm for the medium format (645, 6x7, 6x9) I use a Bowens Illumitran with my Nikon D7100 for my 35mm slides and negatives and use a 60mm Companon enlarging lens.

My light source is a Kaiser Slimlite Plano which is 5000K and a high CRI.

I have the camera on a pretty rudimentary copy stand which works OK but a PITA to change magnification. I'm looking for an old enlarger, but I think they have either been already snapped up or been recycled for scrap.

I use old negative carriers from my Epson 4990 scanner and they work just fine for my application.

Most importantly I use a LR plugin called Negative Lab Pro to convert both my color and B&W negatives. It is easy to use with a lot of adjustments available. Check out there web site https://www.negativelabpro.com/

cattytown · Nov 18, 2023

Again thanks for all the input

250swb · Nov 19, 2023

As you already have a film Nikon, the recipe is any Nikon digital with 18mp or 24mp (best), a 60mm D micro Nikkor, a Kaiser Slimlite Plano, and a copy stand. You can make your own negative holders or use something from a scanner, or even buy something new. So you now also got a 60mm micro lens to use with your F80 so there is no redundancy.

cattytown · Nov 19, 2023

Thanks all - just saw a decent price on a 60mm AF-D so will be watching D600s...

Camera for film scanning (UK)

cattytown

koraks

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cattytown

4season

koraks

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_T_

cattytown

_T_

Two23

cattytown

Niglyn

silvergelatin

cattytown

Overrank

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_T_

cattytown

Overrank

dokko

_T_

Robert Ley

cattytown

250swb

cattytown

Camera for film scanning (UK)

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