Calling true Leica experts!

David H. Bebbington · Sep 10, 2006

Was amused to find this:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Vintage-Leica...6QQihZ004QQcategoryZ67380QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

The body number indicates a Leica II model of approx. 1941. The gaudy refinishing is of course not original, the stamping "Monté en Sarre" as far as I know relates only to post-war IIIa models, BUT - I can't decide if, under all the ghastly "improvements", there could be a genuine camera. Any opinions?

Regards,

David

Andy K · Sep 10, 2006

Personally I wouldn't bother. I am no Leica expert, but I'm pretty cagey when it comes to the auction site. Having read this: 'Shutter fires at all speeds but, being no photographer, I have not put any film through it. In my experience only people who use and know cameras use that 'put a film through it' expression, so why would they claim to 'be no photographer'. I could be wrong. But to me thats an Ebay warning sign.

I also seem to remember seeing a wood veneered 'Leica' on Ebay about a year ago.

David H. Bebbington · Sep 10, 2006

Andy K said:
Personally I wouldn't bother. ... I also seem to remember seeing a wood veneered 'Leica' on Ebay about a year ago.

Don't worry, I'm not thinking of buying it, I'm just idly curious! There are indeed numbers of "wood-veneered" (sticky-backed plastic?) "Leicas" around, almost all are tarted-up Feds, but this one I just couldn't decide about. There are quite a few wartime Leicas where the original chrome-plating was very poor, this could have been a reason for someone to "restore" the camera. Cameras like this are not worth buying because the internals are made of equally poor materials and are likely to be totally worn out.

Regards,

David

wfwhitaker · Sep 10, 2006

Oooh!! Isn't that the famous Oscar Barnack Woody Commemorative? I understand it was Mrs. Barnack's favorite.

Looks like it should belong with Tom Abrahamsson's Uncollectibles.

Ole · Sep 10, 2006

I'm impressed with a "non-photographer" who manages to get the bottom off an old Leica, but doesn't unscrew the lens. I'd like to know if there's a roller or a wedge under there...

Dave Parker · Sep 10, 2006

I would have my doubts.....

Dave

Sportera · Sep 10, 2006

I can't seem to recall but the VF window on a Leica is flush with the top of the camera, and a FED/Zorki is not. Looks like it could be a genuine, modified Leica.

Dave Parker · Sep 10, 2006

I am no expert, but one thing I noticed, I have two leicas of this vintage and on the top plate where the serial number is, both of mine have the following to designate the serial number "No." with an underline under the "o" this camera has a serial with the designation Nr. Like I said, I am no expert, but I don't remember seeing this designation, both of the cameras I have, have been verified at real leicas by a leica trained repair person.

Dave

erikhaugsby · Sep 10, 2006

Fake! Fake! Fake!

Look at the VF window: Sam was just backwards, FEDs have flush windows, Leicas have steps between it and the top plate.
The shutter release is very Russian.

and good old Oskar never made any Leica front cap in such a gaudy color scheme, not to mention the wood veneer on the body.

It is wholy a fake.

Dave Parker · Sep 10, 2006

Well here is a picture of a true leica II from Cameraquest, and I will be darned if I can see the difference in the viewfinder you guys are mentioning..

http://www.cameraquest.com/leica2.htm

But I do agree, the shutter release looks very simular to the russian shutter releases I have seen on the fakes.

Dave

Andy K · Sep 10, 2006

Dave Parker said:
Well here is a picture of a true leica II from Cameraquest, and I will be darned if I can see the difference in the viewfinder you guys are mentioning..

http://www.cameraquest.com/leica2.htm

But I do agree, the shutter release looks very simular to the russian shutter releases I have seen on the fakes.

Dave

I can see the difference, its quite a big difference. The Leica has a raised frame around the VF window, the fake is completely different.

AZLF · Sep 10, 2006

You are right about the shutter button. Older Leicas did not have the center threaded for a shutter release cable. The shutter release cable threaded to the outside of the shutter button sleeve.

desertrat · Sep 10, 2006

Russian Copy

The seller has edited the auction page. He says, "I have been informed is a Russian copy..."

Dave Parker · Sep 10, 2006

Andy K said:
I can see the difference, its quite a big difference. The Leica has a raised frame around the VF window, the fake is completely different.

Andy and others are you talking about the viewfinder window on the front? between the two rangefinder round windows? If so, Now I can see what your talking about..I for some reason thought you guys were talking about the top of the camera..

Dave

Mark Layne · Sep 10, 2006

The 'Leica' engraving on the top plate is poorly done, and on a genuine II would be solder filled.
You do not find black front rims on Leitz Nickel Elmars
Mark

Sportera · Sep 10, 2006

Thank you for correcting me erik, I just knew I had that backwards!

David H. Bebbington · Sep 10, 2006

Thanks for your opinions - I did for a while think this was the rare Leica "Blue Peter" model (for non-UK APUGers, "Blue Peter" is a long-running children's TV program in which children are frequently encouraged to make things from materials which always include sticky-backed plastic).

It is amazing how much effort people put into refurbishing Russian cameras to look like no Leica ever made and which as far as I am aware no one really wants to buy. For less effort they could actually make the cameras look like Leicas which I am sure would sell better!

Best regards,

David

Dan Fromm · Sep 10, 2006

But David! Real aged Leicas are ugly whereas new imitation Leicas, especially, the ones covered with imitation exotic woods, are objects of great beauty. The real things look their age, are obviously useless. No person of, as they say, discernment and taste would use such a camera. I lack both, so I use old Graphics; my cruddy old cameras seem to me rather like Leicas interpreted by a locomotive manufacturer.

Cheers,

Dan

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