Bye bye Pentax?

nworth · Mar 19, 2006

These are low volume cameras. In the current marketing philosophies, that alone could be reason for getting rid of them. But the electronic components for these cameras were probably assembled in a batch many years ago. Pentax probably figures it would be too costly to trash them, redesign, and get new ones made.

digiconvert · Mar 19, 2006

As at today's date (March 19th 2006) this is the info on pemtax uk
http://www.pentax.co.uk/products.php?divisionid=2&parentid=25

No sign of any message re discontinuation which I thought would be there. Let's hope it's a misquoted artyicle.

Tom Hoskinson · Mar 19, 2006

nworth said:
These are low volume cameras. In the current marketing philosophies, that alone could be reason for getting rid of them. But the electronic components for these cameras were probably assembled in a batch many years ago. Pentax probably figures it would be too costly to trash them, redesign, and get new ones made.

Or, Pentax management decided to discontinue the line for economic (or whatever) reasons and we're getting the PR spin...

pentaxuser · Mar 19, 2006

digiconvert said:
As at today's date (March 19th 2006) this is the info on pemtax uk
http://www.pentax.co.uk/products.php?divisionid=2&parentid=25

No sign of any message re discontinuation which I thought would be there. Let's hope it's a misquoted artyicle.

For those of us in the U.K. it'll probably be worthwhile looking at the next couple of Amateur Photographer editions. They seem pretty quick on picking these things up. The new edition is in my library tomorrow. I'll have a look

Pentaxuser

sanderx1 · Mar 19, 2006

digiconvert said:
As at today's date (March 19th 2006) this is the info on pemtax uk
http://www.pentax.co.uk/products.php?divisionid=2&parentid=25

No sign of any message re discontinuation which I thought would be there. Let's hope it's a misquoted artyicle.

However note that Pentax UK is not really Pentax but Intro 2020 - and tehy certainly don't make teh cameras ;-)

srs5694 · Mar 19, 2006

Loose Gravel said:
Hard to see how cameras are a big threat to the environment. I know I don't throw many of them away.

Perhaps cameras aren't a big threat, but even if that's true, the same could be said about many other products that would violate the same environmental laws. If you write a bunch of exceptions into the law because this or that niche product isn't a big threat, then pretty soon you'll have a law with so many loopholes it'd be useless.

battra92 said:
I get some of the landfill part but can't they just refuse them at landfills?

Are you volunteering to sift through every load of garbage delivered to your local landfill to spot the electronics and return the offending items to the sender?

Those points said, I do agree that the lead solder issue sounds like a pretty lame excuse on Pentax's part. I find it hard to believe it'd be more difficult to re-engineer existing analog products to comply with new regulations than to design new electronics-heavy products to do so. More likely they were about to exit the market anyhow and just added complying with these regulations to their list of reasons to make that list a bit longer.

Lee Shively · Mar 20, 2006

Most laws are full of loopholes and interpretation, otherwise, why would we need lawyers and judges?

pentaxuser · Mar 20, 2006

Further to my earlier post I checked AP today in library. Nothing. That may be good news.However it did carry a mention that the future of Paterson chemicals was in doubt. AP bases this on a reply in the Q&A section from Paterson's marketing manager. When I looked at the Q&A there was no question about Paterson chems or any reply from Paterson.

Presumably they do have such a reply but goofed in the layout and failed to include it in the Q&A. I knew there was a reason I stopped subscribing to AP! Just thought it was worth a mention but not worth a thread on its own until there is more to report. A bit worrying though.

Pentaxuser

Craig · Mar 21, 2006

There is no specific definition of silver solder, it varies quite considerably from 2% silver to upwards of 75% silver. However, it is a higher strength alloy than traditional lead/tin solders, but that's not important in electronics. Along with the higher strength goes a higher melting point. Traditional Pb/Sn solders melt around 160-180C, whereas silver solders melt around 600C, which is too hot for electronic components.

Often silver solders contain cadnium, which is also toxic, so you're just trading one poision for another, with no perfomrmance advantage.

Aggie said:
Ok a female question here.... what are the components they are soldering made from? Why not switch to silver solder? I know it is twice the temp of lead solder to do this, but if it is metal to metal why not the silver? It has a better adhesion than tin, and for the amount you would need it is not that expensive. We are talking cents more in the costs of soldering a camera verses dollars more expense.

voceumana · Mar 24, 2006

The question is, is Pentax discontinuing the product, or is Pentax DE (Germany) ceasing the importation.

The fact is, that Pentax could continue to manufacture and sell the product outside of the EU and just stop importing it to Europe.

Somehow that seems a very happy, evil thought to me: leave the EU to it's nasty regulations, and just stop selling products there. Deprive the legislating little b******s of the nice products, and let them play by themselves.

On another forum, there is talk that they will have to stop making and repairing pipe organs in Europe because of the lead content. How silly would that be of them?

Kilgallb · Mar 24, 2006

The regulations referred to are called RoHS. (Reduction of hazardous materials) Every manufacturer must comply by July 1st 2006. Any product imported for sale (new or used) into the EU must meet standards for the amount of several materials.

As for solder, there have been lead free solders in place for many years. The trouble is components on the circuit boards must be changed to special types that withstand higher soldering temperatures. Most manufacturers have been preparing for this for years. It is nothing new. My bet is that Pentax cannot justify the re-engineering of the product. (They can make more profit getting Samsung to design and build them a digital camera)

Before the North Americans become smug about this, you should know California will adopt the same rules on January 01, 2007. Massachusetts and New York may follow in June 2007. This will basically force the whole world to follow. China may enact even more stringent regulations.

Joe VanCleave · Mar 25, 2006

Just as an aside, but here in the American southwest, many small communities are having to face new, EPA-mandated arsenic and lead rules for drinking water.

The problem is typically not because of manufacturing or waste disposal reasons, but because there are within these areas many mineral-rich geologies that effect the local water table. It's "naturally" tainted water.

Abatement systems, costing hundreds of millions of dollars in some cases, are having to be installed in small communities that don't have the budgets for such investments.

Its also interesting to watch the migration of the semiconductor industry to Asia. Its driven by many factors, but payroll is not necessarily the only reason. Environmental laws are much more lax in developing countries.

David H. Bebbington · Apr 6, 2006

Postscript: According to today's British Journal of Photography, Pentax is NOT ceasing production and distribution of film cameras EXCEPT IN THE EU. Does this mean that Europeans can without restriction buy Pentax film cameras in Hong Kong and elsewhere (by mail or personally) and bring them back as personal imports?

Lee Shively · Apr 6, 2006

That does bring up an interesting point, David. I wonder if the EU will start banning the mere possession of the cameras in order to stop personal imports to Europe? That's taking things a little into the preposterous but, hey, the whole concept seems preposterous to some of us.

Kilgallb · Apr 6, 2006

The New York Times had an article today about Pentax and Samsung.

Pentax is negotiating with SAMSUNG to do camera co-development. Pentax will stick with doing lenses while Samsung makes cameras, presumably digital. Interestingly, Pentax lost money on cameras but made money on endoscopes. Looks like Pentax' days as an independent film camera maker are almost over.

Lee Shively · Apr 7, 2006

The irony is this whole thing--Kodak abandoning film, Nikon abondoning film cameras, Konica/Minolta abandoning photography and now Pentax--is almost always based on maximizing profits for shareholders of these corporations. The stockholders demand profits on the products. The stockholders make more money to spend for products. Eventually, the stockholders will have all this money to spend and there's gonna be nothing worth buying anymore!

Brac · Apr 7, 2006

According to this week's Amateur Photographer the problem is due to restrictions on the amount of lead used in electrical and electronic equipment. Pentax are quoted as saying "Pentax will be discontinuing the production and European sales of a number of its products, including its film based medium format cameras, some film & digital compact cameras as well as a number of lenses and accessories". So how I read this is that production stops, European sales stop, but remaining stocks will continue to be sold but not in Europe. Pentax also said they are continuing plans to launch new digital SLR & digital medium format cameras.

Another victim is the Hasselblad Xpan because there is lead solder in the circuit board. The EEC are concerned over what happens to the lead when the cameras are eventually disposed of. Hasselblad say the cost of redesign is too high & would result in a 30% price increase.

David H. Bebbington · Apr 7, 2006

Here's the article in this week's BJP. If it proves nothing else, it shows how difficult it is to nail the truth down!

Brac · Apr 8, 2006

David H. Bebbington said:
Here's the article in this week's BJP. If it proves nothing else, it shows how difficult it is to nail the truth down!

You're right. There is so much disinformation out there. If Pentax really don't want to continue marketing film cameras in Europe why can't they just say so.

Bye bye Pentax?

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