Bulk processing film

[Kvistgaard]

Hi all,
I've been given an 8-roll Paterson tank, and want to develop - you guessed it - eight rolls of film in one go.

The films are all tri-x, and the developer is xtol stock.

Is there anything in particular I should be mindful of, when developing this many films at the same time - need more/less time than the standard dev time, for instance?

This obviously feels like putting a lot of eggs in one basket, so I thought I'd get the basics right first.

Thanks as always for your insights!

 

[df cardwell]

Put developer into the tank before loading the film.

Let the solution sit for a while before taking the temperature.

Probably good to use dilute XTOL, to slow the time, thus minimizing the effect of pouring out the developer.

Clean as large an area as you can to load the film.

Check the dark. Have a box or basket to hold the rolls of film.

Practice.

 

[Anscojohn]

What they said. And when I had to soup eight rolls on ss, I always added 10% to my regular developing time for a single or double tank. FWIW

 

[MattKing]

Load in stages

If you have smaller tanks (like three roll tanks) use them to store the loaded reels as you go. That way you can load three reels, put the core in and lid on the (smaller) tank and take a break. Once all eight are loaded, and in the smaller light-tight tanks, it is easier to transfer the reels in the dark.

Matt

 

[fschifano]

Probably the most important caution you should take is to fill the tank with developer first, then drop the reels in. Fill time will be too long, and there is a risk of uneven development. Another thing to consider is to NOT use the agitation stick. It works ok for two reel tanks, but for more than two reels good agitation gets tricky, if not impossible, if you use it. Use the inversion method of agitation, and don't be too gentle about it. That's a lot of liquid that needs to be thoroughly mixed up on each cycle.

 

[Konical]

Good Evening, Soren,

I concur with the advice you've been given so far. One additional thing to note is the simple matter of weight. A tank, whether SS or plastic, loaded with eight reels and full of liquid is relatively heavy and awkward to handle, especially since it will probably be wet at some point during the processing. It's very easy to let it slip during handling. With a plastic tank, that could be disastrous, since a dropped tank will probably split. ( I know from experience that Paterson tanks will break, because I cracked a small one years ago just by rapping it on the sink to dislodge air bubbles.) Use both hands when doing the agitation!

Konical

 

[John Shriver]

I'll second the weight caution. A Nikor 4x5 tank with 36 ounces of developer in it is quite heavy. An 8 reel tank would be at least 60 ounces of developer.

Also remember that you're putting a lot of eggs in one basket. Do anything wrong and you have possibly lost 8 rolls of film.

The 8 reel tanks were really for press photographers "on deadline."

 

[Larry.Manuel]

In the tall Paterson tank, I've developed 8 rolls at a time, using Rodinal 100+1, and D-76 1+3, starting by simply pouring in the developer [as fast as I could]. Development seemed equal on all films.

 

[fschifano]

Yeah, ok. Using very dilute developers is a way to get around the problem. Development times are so long with these very dilute developers that an extra few seconds doesn't add up to a whole lot in the scheme of things. Use something more active, and the picture (no pun intended) changes dramatically. Think HC-110 dilutuion B, which is very fast acting. Now, those few extra seconds add up to a sizable portion of the total development time, and may very well become an issue.

 

[jpberger]

I was wondering about the same kind of thing myself--I've got a travel assignment that should leave me with a zillion rolls to process when I get back. I was thinking diafine might be a good way to go with multi roll tanks as its more forgiving of time and temp and needs limited agitation.

 

[David A. Goldfarb]

All good suggestions thus far, and another thing to remember is that it's nothing to be afraid of, and it's not so unusual to handle large amounts of film in this way. If you shoot medium format, that tank only holds four rolls, and those rolls have a lot fewer exposures than 35mm, so there are often a lot of rolls to process. My largest SS tank holds 6 MF or 12 35mm reels. As suggested, I fill the tank and lower the reels in on a lift rod. The next step up would be a 3.5 gallon tank line with a cage, but I haven't gone that far yet.

 

[fschifano]

I was wondering about the same kind of thing myself--I've got a travel assignment that should leave me with a zillion rolls to process when I get back. I was thinking diafine might be a good way to go with multi roll tanks as its more forgiving of time and temp and needs limited agitation.

Diafine is a good developer, but it is not a general purpose developer. It is great as a speed enhancing developer for Tri-X and a couple of other films, but do not expect results to rival good processing techniques with general purpose developers like D-76, XTOL, and the like, for normally exposed films. You will find that normally exposed films will be somewhat dense, and low in contrast. You will also find that there is no control over the development process. It runs to completion with 3 minutes in bath A and 3 minutes in bath B. There's one fellow out there with a video extolling the virtues of Diafine and my results with the product confirm what he's saying. As he says, it works great if you're scanning. Not so good if you print conventionally. Try a couple of different films exposed normally and see if it doesn't work for you.

 

[Curt]

Wasn't there something about the center spindle in the Patterson tanks, I have a few but use stainless steel for the most part. Don't forget to put the reels on the spindle or light will leak in? And put the lid gasket on too. Wasn't that it? It's a duh I know but someone did that and got spoiled. You shouldn't have any problem with it, as was said put the developer in then in the dark put the reels in. The only problem with that is you should presoak first right? Put the water in the tank first then in the dark put the reels in. Don't want air bells? Put in a couple of drops of LFN and end that problem. Good luck and have fun. Remember you will need some extra clamps to hang them up by.

 

[BetterSense]

At least with 35mm it's fairly easy to load two rolls onto one reel, back-to-back. I can do 8 rolls in my tall tank this way.

 

[Vincent Brady]

Check out RH Designs ProcessMaster II Compensating Process Timer it reads the temp. of the dev. and adjusts the time required.

 

[Ian Grant]

As a past user of these 8 roll tanks I stopped after one split on me in the mid 70's, it's to many films to lose. These days I prefer to use the 5x 35mm/ 3x 120 versions.

I think the largest versions are more prone to problems, filling fast enough, weight when agitating, my split when tapped gently to remove air bells.

Ian

 

[df cardwell]

a travel assignment that should leave me with a zillion rolls to process

Lazy creature that I am, I prefer doing something easy every day to doing something difficult once.

Two rolls at a time, perhaps twice in the evening for a few nights in a row, eats up lots of film.
The process is easy, familiar, and controllable. And pleasant.

Everything is working against you doing 8 rolls at a time, but two at a time ? Fun.

 

[Kvistgaard]

All - thanks very much for your advice here.

Curt - you are right about the center spindle and the lid - I tried developing without the spindle in, and sorely regretted it afterwards. Light leaks galore. So, the spindle is part of the light trap....

 

[naugastyle]

Interesting about the putting-developer-first advice. I only use a 5-reel tank (and it's heavy enough that I likely will never use 8-reel) and have never considered the fill time as a problem. I don't think I've really scrutinized my results...everything has seemed fine. Would most of you say fill time doesn't become an issue until you get to 8 reels?

 

[fschifano]

Can't say for sure, but a tank that big will take some time to fill and drain. Granted, Paterson tanks do this very quickly and it may not even be an issue. Still, I'd consider it a prudent precaution - especially if one were to use a fast acting developer.

 

[BetterSense]

More than actual fill time, I would be worried about fill evenness. A plastic tank with a center filler will fill up nice and evenly from the bottom up. A metal tank where developer has to run down the sides of the tank sounds a lot more iffy to me when it comes to filling up a big one.

 

[Vincent Brady]

I used to use a 3 reel tank but always found that it leaked when inverted so now I use the 2 reel tank and am happy with it.

 

[David A. Goldfarb]

Fill time is an issue if you have a tank with a slow filling lid (new style Kindermann plastic lids are the best for stainless tanks, in my opinion) or if you've got a really big tank (8x35mm or larger) or if you have a developer with a very short development time or if you are using a staining developer that is very prone to uneven staining when the developer isn't poured in quickly and evenly. You might be able to fill a large tank with Microdol-X 1:3 from the daylight cap, but you wouldn't want to do that with Acufine or PMK. That's why most people here who use large tanks are recommending filling the tank and dropping in the loaded reels in the dark, either on the core for a Paterson tank or on a lift rod for a stainless tank.

I don't find drain time to be a big issue, but it will depend on the developer. PMK, for instance, should be pretty much exhausted by the end of the development time, so even though it would be very likely to stain unevenly if poured in through the cap, it doesn't seem to be a problem to pour it out through the cap.

 

[jpberger]

Diafine is a good developer, but it is not a general purpose developer. It is great as a speed enhancing developer for Tri-X and a couple of other films, but do not expect results to rival good processing techniques with general purpose developers like D-76, XTOL, and the like, for normally exposed films. You will find that normally exposed films will be somewhat dense, and low in contrast. You will also find that there is no control over the development process. It runs to completion with 3 minutes in bath A and 3 minutes in bath B. There's one fellow out there with a video extolling the virtues of Diafine and my results with the product confirm what he's saying. As he says, it works great if you're scanning. Not so good if you print conventionally. Try a couple of different films exposed normally and see if it doesn't work for you.

I should have mentioned that I'm already a diafine user-- usually with tri-x and plus-x. Works great with those 2 at 2 stops over box speed. Needs hard paper or a curves tweek but otherwise great. For other films or lower speeds I go xtol

 

[cmacd123]

Main Problem with the 8 reel unit is the weight. 8*290ml is 2.32 Litres which would weight if it were just water 2.32 Kg, or about 5 pounds. The Super System 4 has a VERY good built in Funnel, so it is fairly fast to fill. Getting the cover on takes practice. The older ones don't fill quite as fast but they fill far faster then the Stainless Units.

Fill Invert twice and then start timing. ALWAYS use 2 hands on the 8 reel unit. If you are buying a tank get the 5 reel.