Been shooting 120 on my Yashica Mat for awhile now and love it but have always been curious about the SLR Medium Format Cameras. Was curious as to what was recommended to look in to on the more budget friendly side. Unfortunately can't afford a hasselblad or a Mamiya 7 but I'm sure there are just as many great budget options that I can be enlightened to. Also where is the best place to usually look? eBay? KEH? Anywhere else? Thanks!
Budget Medium Format SLR Type Camera
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What is your budget? RB67s are on the auction site for less than $300 including body, lens, waist level finder and film back. The camera is a solid shooter and has a complete system of available accessories for you to add over time.
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does it have to have interchangable lenses and be a SLR or can it be a coupled RF ?
mamiya made a folder post-war that was fantastic. sharp lens, great focus mechanism
easy to hold+use.
http://camerapedia.wikia.com/wiki/Mamiya_Six
mamiya made a folder post-war that was fantastic. sharp lens, great focus mechanism
easy to hold+use.
http://camerapedia.wikia.com/wiki/Mamiya_Six
The cheapest prices are usually on Ebay. You do have to watch and be patient.
For 645 look at the Bronica ETR series. I have not priced these lately but you may get one for $200.
For 6x6 look at the Bronica S2a, EC or SQ series. These will probably blow your $200 budget.
For 6x7 look at Bronica 6x7, Mamiya RB67 or Pentax 6x7. These will blow your $200 budget.
If you don't mind a TLR with interchangeable lenses then look at Mamiya C220 or C330. I've seen C220's go for $200 with 80mm lens.
For 645 look at the Bronica ETR series. I have not priced these lately but you may get one for $200.
For 6x6 look at the Bronica S2a, EC or SQ series. These will probably blow your $200 budget.
For 6x7 look at Bronica 6x7, Mamiya RB67 or Pentax 6x7. These will blow your $200 budget.
If you don't mind a TLR with interchangeable lenses then look at Mamiya C220 or C330. I've seen C220's go for $200 with 80mm lens.
Just sold a Mamiya 645 and four lenses -- yes, four -- for a pathetic $600 plus the shipping and so forth -- really, they practically give those things away and they're very good quality. I found this particular camera -- a 1000s -- to be very heavy for my shooting style. If you look around you can find the bodies and lenses for about $125 each.
You can pick up Bronica EtrSi and earlier ETR and Etrs 645 cameras fro peanuts these days, they are fine cameras and lenses Etc are interchangeable between the etr to the etrsi, as are all accesories, I have a Etr here that I never use as these days I prefer folders and Tlr's I must have paid thousands for the camera, backs lenses Etc, today it is not worth selling, so it sits in it's billingham bag gathering dust, I fire the shutters from time to time to keep them alive, but it must be well over a year since I took it out. shame
Richard
Richard
JADoss, I notice you are in "Ky" which I take to be Kentucky. Surf craigslist regularly, in your surrounding cities (Cinci, Indy, Knoxville, etc.). From time to time RB67s come up on these sites and many times the prices are lower than the auction site.
Mamiya (manual focus) and Bronica ETR series go the cheapest of the SLRs at this point, I think. I don't have much experience with either system, but I am sure both are great. One of the nice things about MF is that there is very little 'bad' equipment... much less consumer junk floating aruond than in 35mm, and cameras tend to have been kept and maintained well.
Pentax 645 have more demand and go for a little more, probably because the lenses are fully usable on a modern digital system. But also a nice system.
What interests you specifically about getting an SLR? RB67 is a very good pairing with a TLR - it's big and best on a tripod, but very flexible, with a huge negative, good glass, bellows for close focusing, extensive lens range... I went with a Hasselblad because I wanted high degrees of portability in my system and found a good price. Bronica SQ are a great equivalent for about half the cost of a Hasselblad system and very versatile.
While manual focus 645 systems are cheaper, I think it is worth the little price bump to go to 6x6 or 6x7 if you can save a little longer... If I was looking at a 645 system it would be for a modern, AF system (Hasselblad H, Contax 645, etc.) which are big $$$ but have other advantages.
Pentax 645 have more demand and go for a little more, probably because the lenses are fully usable on a modern digital system. But also a nice system.
What interests you specifically about getting an SLR? RB67 is a very good pairing with a TLR - it's big and best on a tripod, but very flexible, with a huge negative, good glass, bellows for close focusing, extensive lens range... I went with a Hasselblad because I wanted high degrees of portability in my system and found a good price. Bronica SQ are a great equivalent for about half the cost of a Hasselblad system and very versatile.
While manual focus 645 systems are cheaper, I think it is worth the little price bump to go to 6x6 or 6x7 if you can save a little longer... If I was looking at a 645 system it would be for a modern, AF system (Hasselblad H, Contax 645, etc.) which are big $$$ but have other advantages.
^ May sound a bit harsh , but stay with what you have . Your budget will barely get you an ETR
with a standard lens ( which you already have in a larger format ) . I have them both and image
quality on Provia 100f is a tie between them . Beside the changeable backs and prisms the real
advantage to MF SLRs' is the great selection of lens .$$$ Cheers Peter
with a standard lens ( which you already have in a larger format ) . I have them both and image
quality on Provia 100f is a tie between them . Beside the changeable backs and prisms the real
advantage to MF SLRs' is the great selection of lens .$$$ Cheers Peter
You cant go wrong with an ETRS. They are going very cheap and have a slew of beautiful lenses to expand your kit later as you grow into it.
A must have though.... get the winder grip! It makes handling the camera a dream.
For accessories I find very useful... the focusing levers are great. They aren't readily available but if you see them, get one!
A must have though.... get the winder grip! It makes handling the camera a dream.
For accessories I find very useful... the focusing levers are great. They aren't readily available but if you see them, get one!
Kowa Six. Great handling, cheap. I still miss mine.
There are several choices but you will have to be patient to find one in your price range and in the condition that is good enough for you.
Be careful in getting the cheapest SLR you can find. Cuz you will be stuck with that camera.
Waiting to save a bit more to get better is usually a better option.
Made that mistake before, don't want to do it again.
Waiting to save a bit more to get better is usually a better option.
Made that mistake before, don't want to do it again.
A great alternative is a Pentacon Six. There is a big BUT, though.
Finding one in good condition is difficult, most have been handled badly (letting the cocking lever snap back etc.) and some have overlapping frames, although that is mostly down to not cocking it properly.
They almost always need a service because the old fats double the speeds in cold weather and the slow speeds tend to stick. I have never seen or heard from anyone using slow speeds but there we are.
Which bring me to my other BUT. The optics are excellent, especially the Zeiss Jena ones although some russian ones have their own merit. I personally don't like the build quality of the russian ones.
There is a 30mm fisheye to be had for roughly 200 bucks which is awesome but difficult to handle.
The bottom line (sort of) is: get a Six, get it serviced and you have a camera for life. Sure, there are alternatives with the P6 mount like a Kiev 60 or Kiev 88 CM, the P6s screen is darker but imo it is wonderful.
Not much bigger than a 35mm SLR, about the same size of a Canon DSLR with battery grip and not really heavy. 1,7kg approx with 80mm lens.
A Kiev 60 is ugly as hell, too and a P6 is a thing of beauty.
I also prefer the glass screen, it pops into focus and renders the picture very nicely.
Finding one in good condition is difficult, most have been handled badly (letting the cocking lever snap back etc.) and some have overlapping frames, although that is mostly down to not cocking it properly.
They almost always need a service because the old fats double the speeds in cold weather and the slow speeds tend to stick. I have never seen or heard from anyone using slow speeds but there we are.
Which bring me to my other BUT. The optics are excellent, especially the Zeiss Jena ones although some russian ones have their own merit. I personally don't like the build quality of the russian ones.
There is a 30mm fisheye to be had for roughly 200 bucks which is awesome but difficult to handle.
The bottom line (sort of) is: get a Six, get it serviced and you have a camera for life. Sure, there are alternatives with the P6 mount like a Kiev 60 or Kiev 88 CM, the P6s screen is darker but imo it is wonderful.
Not much bigger than a 35mm SLR, about the same size of a Canon DSLR with battery grip and not really heavy. 1,7kg approx with 80mm lens.
A Kiev 60 is ugly as hell, too and a P6 is a thing of beauty.
I also prefer the glass screen, it pops into focus and renders the picture very nicely.
Thanks for all of the info. I love my TLR but was just wanting a good companion that is a little different. I'm not necessarily looking for the cheapest camera available just looking for something a little more budget friendly and not as pricey as a hasselbalad or some of the expensive fuji rangefinder/mamiya 6/7's all of those. I've been looking at the different Mamiya models and like all of them. Are there a lot of differences between the 645 models that Mamiya has made? Pros/Cons? Also like the Bronica cameras you all have mentioned as well. After reading all of the above with already having the 6x6 TLR is there any pros/cons of having another size negative or not really? I was leaning towards getting an SLR medium format for the interchangeable lenses and for something different. I probably won't shoot a ton on tripods so which of these would be best for portability? Thanks again. Means a lot
I found 645 a disappointing format. Too long relative to the height, much like 35mm. Stick with 6x6. There are many threads discussing 645 versus 6x6 on APUG. Other will disagree with me but by any standard they are just basically wrong. 
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I found 645 a disappointing format. Too long relative to the height, much like 35mm. Stick with 6x6. There are many threads discussing 645 versus 6x6 on APUG. Other will disagree with me but by any standard they are just basically wrong.
I'm inclined to agree but with the prices of 120 what it's at and the loss of my Shanghai GP3 I shoot my 645 to get those few extra frames. Sure I prefer 6x6 but with 645 I still get that smoothness and DOF that MF will give me.
I've never shot the Mamiya 645 cameras. I did use to own a Pentax 645Nll at the same time I owned a Mamiya RZ67. The RZ was used mostly to take portraits on a tripod with studio strobes. The Pentax was a fun camera to carry around and shoot people at parties. The matrix metering, auto exposure, auto film advance and auto focus made a quick to shoot camera that was small/light enough to walk around shooting hand held. The Mamiya 645 should be similar to the Pentax, depending upon the model.
Shooting both squares and rectangles can be refreshing and helps to get your creative juices flowing. It helps to keep you from getting into a rut.
Shooting both squares and rectangles can be refreshing and helps to get your creative juices flowing. It helps to keep you from getting into a rut.
I found 645 a disappointing format. Too long relative to the height, much like 35mm. Stick with 6x6. There are many threads discussing 645 versus 6x6 on APUG. Other will disagree with me but by any standard they are just basically wrong.
everyone has their own preference.
645 is a great format.
there are no right n wrongs!
its just another opinion.... ya know what they say about opinions?
.
I found 645 a disappointing format. Too long relative to the height, much like 35mm. Stick with 6x6. There are many threads discussing 645 versus 6x6 on APUG. Other will disagree with me but by any standard they are just basically wrong.
I am puzzled...
- my 645 camera has a 55mm width x 42.5mm height, or 1.29: 1
- 135 format is 1.5:1
- 6x7 format (RZ67) is 69.5mm x 56mm, or 1.24:1
- 8x10 print is 1.25:1, with 1/4" borders 1.27:1
My bad, checked out Bronica ETR prices and they can be had for a bargain. $200 for a kit. I have even seen a listing for an ETR with 3 lenses for 150, though it is far off to pick up. Curiously mostly ex-pro kits with prisms and winders fall into the category. If only my Rolleicord didn't need a CLA, and the Fuji 6x9 need more film, and the film to be processed...
Didn't get very attracted by the SLRs because they aren't very compact.
645 can be seen as a cropped 6x6, though the square format has a nice equilibrium to it and is nice enough on the shots/roll ratio.
Didn't get very attracted by the SLRs because they aren't very compact.
Fomapan is where it's at. But color isn't cheap. Sure I do agree, when the mojo hits fast a 8EXP 6x9 roll of 120 gets burned fast. Well, I don't drink or smoke.
645 can be seen as a cropped 6x6, though the square format has a nice equilibrium to it and is nice enough on the shots/roll ratio.
And square is 1:1
MattKing
Moderator
The Mamiya 645 cameras can be divided roughly into two batches:
1) the earlier models (and the 645e) which do not offer interchangeable film backs; and
2) the later, interchangeable film back 645 Super, 645 Pro and 645 Pro-Tl.
All models take the same film inserts, and all the lenses.
Other accessories will be specific to particular models - particularly the viewfinders, power winders and grips.
The earliest models are heavy, and quite old.
The 645 Super is nice and cheap, but check it carefully because the gearing used in it tended to wear prematurely if used with a power winder.
A lot of them were used by wedding photographers. still use.
I've owned and enjoyed a 645 Super in the past (it had been well used but worked fine) and the 645 Pro I still use. I wouldn't mind having a second body. I would consider a 645e (fixed back, but built in porro-finder) for that.
You do need an eye level finder - 6x4.5 with a waist level finder doesn't work well for portrait orientation.
1) the earlier models (and the 645e) which do not offer interchangeable film backs; and
2) the later, interchangeable film back 645 Super, 645 Pro and 645 Pro-Tl.
All models take the same film inserts, and all the lenses.
Other accessories will be specific to particular models - particularly the viewfinders, power winders and grips.
The earliest models are heavy, and quite old.
The 645 Super is nice and cheap, but check it carefully because the gearing used in it tended to wear prematurely if used with a power winder.
A lot of them were used by wedding photographers. still use.
I've owned and enjoyed a 645 Super in the past (it had been well used but worked fine) and the 645 Pro I still use. I wouldn't mind having a second body. I would consider a 645e (fixed back, but built in porro-finder) for that.
You do need an eye level finder - 6x4.5 with a waist level finder doesn't work well for portrait orientation.
Are we adjusting our budget ? I'm sure by now you've pretty well checked every suggestion on Ebay .
Cheers , Peter
Cheers , Peter
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