Bronica SQ-A Lens Shutter Broken?

Death_Rey · Apr 5, 2021

Hey guys,
I just bought a Zenza Bronica SQ-A off ebay, and I'm having a lot of trouble getting the shutter to open to allow preview when I look in the view finder; when I look in the viewfinder it's entirely dark, unless I have the lens set to the T setting.
-I purchased a new battery for the camera (and check the battery by depressing the battery check button).
-I loaded new film into the film back and ensured the counter works.
-The red dot on the shutter release is facing down, and not locked.
-The dark slide is removed from the film back.

The shutter works properly and I'm able to fire through shots as if everything is working, but there's no preview available to me to see what I'm shooting. As mentioned above, I'm only able to preview when I have the lens in the T setting, which allows for a preview both when I have film in the back, and when there's no film and I'm in the multiple exposure setting. The guy I purchased the camera from said he hadn't tested it, and is giving me a 30 day warranty so it's no issue if there's something wrong, but this will be the first medium format camera I own and I was hoping that this one would work! Thanks in advance for any help.

voceumana · Apr 5, 2021

Without film in the camera, you have to have the multiple exposure mode to return the mirror to the down position--rotating the film winding mechanism returns the mirror to the viewing position. With film loaded, this isn't necessary, though you do have to advance the film to lower the mirror--it's not "instant return" but you probably know that.

wiltw · Apr 5, 2021

Seeing something in viewfinder requres

body cocked to lower reflex mirror...it is not an automatic return mirror
shutter cocked to open shutter

Both happen on the first stroke of the winding lever. Second stroke of winding lever advances film.

The T setting on shutter opens it and it stays open until you close the T control.
If the mirror loickup lever is activated, the mirror will stay up.

Death_Rey · Apr 5, 2021

I have the mirror lock up in the N setting, so that shouldn't be messing with it. I loaded some old film and the shutter sounds as if it's working properly. I'm able to wind the lever to cock the mirror and the shutter and everything seems to advance properly, but the view finder is still dark the whole time. Also when I look at the lens I see that the shutter leaves are closed at all times unless in the T setting which forces them open

Death_Rey · Apr 5, 2021

Okay so, it seems that the shutter leaflets are kind of stuck in the closed position somehow. I'm able to trick them into staying open by removing the film back, switching the lens setting to T, moving the mirror lock up to c, winding the film crank and activating the shutter (which causes the leaflets to open at this point and remain open) and then turning the mirror lock up back to n, winding the film lever once more to lower the mirror, and then turning the lens setting back to A, at which point I can add the film back again and the lens is normal for me to take a picture. anyways I think the lens is broken a bit lol but the body seems to work fine.

Death_Rey · Apr 5, 2021

Oh also after I press the shutter button at that point, the leaflets close again and I have to repeat all those steps. So not something I want to be doing between each shot!!

wiltw · Apr 5, 2021

Death_Rey said:
Okay so, it seems that the shutter leaflets are kind of stuck in the closed position somehow. I'm able to trick them into staying open by removing the film back, switching the lens setting to T, moving the mirror lock up to c, winding the film crank and activating the shutter (which causes the leaflets to open at this point and remain open) and then turning the mirror lock up back to n, winding the film lever once more to lower the mirror, and then turning the lens setting back to A, at which point I can add the film back again and the lens is normal for me to take a picture. anyways I think the lens is broken a bit lol but the body seems to work fine.

For normal operation of mirror lockup,

the lever should be put into the N position (C is for continuous mirror lockup, S is for single mirror lockiup) and the lens Time setting set to A., before advancing the winding lever,
After you fire the shutter (leaving mirror lockup in N), one crank of the winding level should open up the shutter blades and lower the reflex mirror.

If you tried the above, what happens?

Death_Rey · Apr 5, 2021

With the normal settings of having the mirror lock up in N and the lens time setting on A the shutter blades do not open when I wind the crank or engage the shutter button. After getting the shutter blades to open by tricking it the shutter closes again after engaging the shutter button and does not open back up after one full crank. I hear the mirror lower, but the blades don't open back up.

wiltw · Apr 6, 2021

The issue might NOT be the lens, but may a problem in mechanical adjustment of the body. I have experience with this problem on an ETRSi (fundamentally same operational design as SQ-Ai):

The film back has an interlock pin which protrudes into the body when a fresh frame is advanced.
The interlock pin in the body can prevent the mirror from swinging up fully
When the mirror does not swing up fully, it does not permit the lever at the right side of the mount (as viewed by someone in front of the lens) to slide
When the lever in the body does not slide, it does not get the matching lever on the lens to slide fully range in response
When the lens lever does not move far enough, it does not close the shutter and then open it for exposure
When the lever on the lens does not slide, the len shutter does close itself and then re-open for expsure (so the electronics do not command it to close, and there is no red shutter confirmation light in the viewfinder)
When the film wind lever is advanced, it should cause the lever in the body to move back to the cocked position (to green dot)
When the lever in the body does not move, it will not move the lever in the lens
When the lever in the lens does not move, it does not open the shutter again.

I had problem with steps 1-6 because of a too-long interlock pin in the used back which I had purchased as an extra back.
I had to send the back, plus the body, to Bronica for repair; they fixed the back so it operated properly.
Your problem sounds to be all nine steps listed in a normal sequence of operation.

My suggestion is to remove your current lens and mount a lens borrowed from somewhere to confirm if the problem with lens or with body...if the borrowed lens acts the same as your current lens, the problem lies in the body.
Similarly, if you can mount your lens on another body, that will prove that the lens itself is functioning properly, or not.

itsdoable · Apr 6, 2021

You should probably check the lens separately. The shutter should be open when the shutter charge cam is fully anti-clock-wise, over towards the green dot. As you swing it clock-wise, the shutter & aperture will close, and at the end of the motion, the shutter will trip (@ 1/500 without power). If this is working properly, then your body is not moving the cam far enough.

wiltw · Apr 6, 2021

itsdoable said:
You should probably check the lens separately. The shutter should be open when the shutter charge cam is fully anti-clock-wise, over towards the green dot. As you swing it clock-wise, the shutter & aperture will close, and at the end of the motion, the shutter will trip (@ 1/500 without power). If this is working properly, then your body is not moving the cam far enough.

What you wrote...just as I decribed above in stops 4, 5, 6.
I tried to manually actuate my ETRSi lens yesterday before I wrote post 9, but I could not figure out how get the lever to be released from its position near the green dot. It would be helpful to describe manual release of the lens shutter charge cam so that OP can try your test. That is why I suggested he mount the lens on a different body....not knowing how to do that manually.

Zenzanon Fan · Apr 7, 2021

There is a small release pin on the bottom of the lenses, within the silver mount on the bottom. If you depress this you can manually operate the shutter. At least on the PS lenses anyway, not sure about the S series but I would imagine they are the same.

itsdoable · Apr 7, 2021

wiltw said:
What you wrote...just as I decribed above in stops 4, 5, 6.
I tried to manually actuate my ETRSi lens yesterday before I wrote post 9, but I could not figure out how get the lever to be released from its position near the green dot. It would be helpful to describe manual release of the lens shutter charge cam so that OP can try your test...

Yes indeed, I was just re-iterating, or clarifying that the lens should be checked independent from the camera body.

The latch to release the shutter charge cam is on the side, under one of the bayonet flanges, it gets pressed in as you mount the lens. (see Zenzanon Fan's post)

Bronica SQ-A Lens Shutter Broken?

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