Bronica gs-1 AND mamiya rb 67 pro-s

[game]

Ok here goes,

Since I want to switch to a leafshutter system, I am going to buy either a bronica gs-1 or a mamiya rb67 pro s, and sell my pentax 67.

Problem: I really can not decide wither I should go bronica or mamiya....
I've read sevral articles but both systems seem great.
Hopefullly some guys here can elaborate more on the differences between the two...?

I know the mamiya is heavier, and that the bronica is handier in use. I have worked with the pentax so I guess the weight is not to much of a deal...
I also know the mamiya has rotating backs, and the bronica does not.
the bronica also has lesser amount of lenses, but then again, I only use a standard and the slight wide angle...
off course the bronica is discontinued, but that should not be to big a deal...
the mayima seem sto pop up a little more often and seem sto be a tad cheaper...
But that's about where the differences I know end....

so here my questions:

1. Is there more I should know?

2. Does either the mamiya or bronica print shutter/aparture settings on the negative, like the pentax 67-II?

3. is there any optical difference?

4. does either one has any nifty features the other does not have?

Hopefully I can make up my mind with your help!!!
thanks game

 

[Pinholemaster]

Get the Mamiya.

 

[Steve Smith]

I have just bought a Mamiya RB67 and I think it's great. I like using a waist level viewfinder and I take more vertical pictures than horizontal so the rotating back is perfect for me.

Also, despite its size and weight, I find it easy to use hand held.

Steve.

 

[RoBBo]

If you're shooting 6x7, the benefits of the bellows focusing and rotating backs and the possibility of shooting 6x8.
All I can say about the weight thing is that Steve Smith must be buff as hell.
The way I see it, if you're going to be hand holding, you should be looking at either a smaller format (Square or 645) or a Rangefinder.
The real question is, since you've used the Pentax, whats making you not want to just get one of those?

 

[Chuck_P]

I own an RB ProS and I love it, and I also would rather use the waist level finder rather than the prism finder. I would recommend that if you get the RB, then make sure that you get a Intenscreen by Beattie. The original focusing screens for the RB's are not very bright; it would be well worth the extra cost to get a nice bright screen to focus with.

I can't speak for the Bronica.

Chuck

 

[Travis Nunn]

I also own a RB ProS and I wouldn't trade it for anything. I use the metered prism which does add quite a bit of weight, but still I don't have a problem using it hand held.

The lenses are great and there is a good selection to choose from. The rotating back is so helpful, I can't imagine flipping that thing on its side on a tripod to get a vertical shot.

Go with the RB.

 

[poutnik]

I shoot a Pentax 67II and my negs/slides do not have any shooting info on them. Am I understanding this correctly?

I own two RB's and love them. Get the RB.

The shooting info imprint is a feature of the Pentax 645 line (I think of the 645N and 645NII models). I also have the 67II and if there was a possibility of the imprints, I'd be in heaven... But alas...

 

[game]

ok everyone, thanks for the reactions!
I'll try to answer the questions you asked me, and maybe in the few next posts mor gets obvious... The bronica seems to have lesser enthousiastic responses ere, maybe because not to many people use it?

anyway, my mistake on the pentax 67-II, I ment the pentax654n, that camera uses data print on negatives...
does either the bronica or the mamiya has any nice special feauteres the other lacks? does either one has a display? or anything else?

To answer the question on why I am going to switch from the pentax 67, has everything to do with the flash sync time... It limits my subjects, and I do not want that. The size and weight of the pentax is fine with me, could easily handhold that. I know the bronica is smaller, but I can not imagine the mamiya is a lot bigger than the pentax 67..
and to the one suggesting 6x6 or 645, I can say: sorry no can do.


So there remain a few questions:

1. anything on optic differences? which lenses have the best reputation?
2. any special features on either one?
3. has either one a really dim focussing screen? dimmer than the pentax?
4. anything you can think of

THANKS a lot I'll stay tuned - game

 

[JohnArs]

Hi game
I worked one time in a studio with a Mamiya RB and it is for me much larger and my short fingers had problems for holding it properly!
I work in my on studio with the Bronica GS 1 and like it much better!
If you work always with a stand then its the Mamiya to take if you work much with your hands I recomand the GS 1 wich I use since over 20 years and not one service! Nock on wood!
Armin Seeholzer

 

[poutnik]

My brother-in-law has an RB67, and comparing it with P67II, it's not that much larger nor heavier/lighter. It's just differently shaped. I like holding the RB67 with the WLF, while the P67 is designed to be held at the face (although both have provisions to be held vice-versa).

As for the sharpness of the lenses, I have compared BIL's negatives shot with a normal (I think it's a 105mm or so) lens, and my P67 135mm and 55mm. Neither is visibly better, there might be some slight differences, but nothing obvious.

I have no experience with GS-1, but at one time I was considering buying it too (because of the removable back, lighter weight) to shoot people/weddings/portraits. I almost bought it. But than I decided I shoot landscapes more and bought MPP MicroTechnical 4x5 instead...

 

[game]

k, love to hear some more here,
I noticed some say, the bronica is lighter so if you wnat to do quicker documentary like stuff, use that one, else Use the mamiya.
I understand the smaller size is handy when you shoot fast and docu, and stuff, but why the "else use mamiya", what is it that mamiya has in favour of the bronica? all I can think of is the rotating back...
Kind regards Game

 

[Christopher Walrath]

Mamiya.

 

[RoBBo]

The Mamiya weighs a good 10 lbs or more depending on the lens you're using.
Between each shot you need to both recock the shutter and advance the film, in separate motions.
It does have bellows focusing, so you can focus at a couple inches with any of your lenses.
I've never found myself recommending the GS-1 to anyone before, simply because the RB67 is such a wonderful camera, but then again, most people that I talk to that want the 6x7 wont be handholding it and will have it on a heavy duty tripod most of the time.
The SQ series is what I'd really recommend for what you want, but it seems you're really stuck on that 6x7 and not the square.
If you're going to be handholding, I can only say you'd be better off with the Bronica.

 

[Travis Nunn]

The Mamiya weighs a good 10 lbs or more depending on the lens you're using.

My RB67 with my largest lens (180mm C), film back and metered prism weighs in at ~7 lbs. With the WLF instead of the metered prism, ~5.5 lbs.

As far as cocking the shutter and advancing the film in seperate motions, that is true, but it didn't take long before it just became second nature to me.

 

[game]

just the weight and a big issue, the pentax is around 6 db too, with the grip detached... I think a grip would really help the handhold performence...
I also saw a double cable release.... does that simplify the action or something?
To bbe more clear: I am a tripod photographer, I only want to handheld whenever I want, and I want to use flash.
I think I should go mayima....
Can anyone tell me wether the fosussingglass is as clear as the foccusing glass on the pentax 67?

Thanks everyone, kind regards Sam

 

[Nick Zentena]

There is a grip for the Mamiya RB/RZ. Not cheap. I've seen people hand holding it. Lets be honest they weren't using the bigger longer lenses. The 110mm on the RZ is shorter and lighter then the 180mm. I assume the same thing happens with the RB normal lenses [90mm and 127mm?] versus the longer lenses. The RZ with a normal lens isn't light but it's reasonable to hand hold. Just don't plan on doing it for hours on end unless you look like the terminator.

I think the double cable release is for mirror lockup.

I'd suggest downloading the RB manual and giving it a read.

 

[game]

hi there,
that's a good suggestion! that I did not do that yet.... :confused:
I think you're right on the mirror lockup... But hey, doesn't hasselblad requires that same recock and wind action? thanks for helpnig me on this decision! game

 

[poutnik]

...Can anyone tell me wether the fosussingglass is as clear as the foccusing glass on the pentax 67?...

The ground glass on my in-law's RB67 is comparable in brightness and clearness as on my P67II. Working with both of them is very pleasant.

Jiri

 

[RoBBo]

hi there,
that's a good suggestion! that I did not do that yet.... :confused:
I think you're right on the mirror lockup... But hey, doesn't hasselblad requires that same recock and wind action? thanks for helpnig me on this decision! game

The Hasselblad, much like the Bronica, winds and cocks in one motion.
That's another thing, the Mirror lockup is a bit more complex with the RB.
That is, assuming the MLU is the same on the GS-1 as it is on my SQ-Ai, in which case, you just flick a switch before you click the shutter.

But again, the Mamiya is an amazing camera, the best 6x7 system I've seen. And if you think you're capable of handholding it, it's probably what you want.
Like it's been said by other people, you can get used to the separate advance/cocking mechanism and odd MLU.

 

[jasparks]

I have a Bronica GS-1 and have used an RB briefly.

I use the Bronica about half the time for static subjects on a tripod and about half the time handheld. I tried using the RB handheld, but found it very difficult. It wasn't so much the weight, but that the focusing is with a rack and pinion. This means that you pretty much have to hold almost all of the weight of the camera with one hand while focusing. With the Bronica, the helical focusing allows you to support much of the weight of the camera with the palm of your left hand while still turning the lens. I also find prisms to be a great advantage when handholding (and even on a tripod when the camera needs to be higher) and the prism for the RB is a monster.

For tripod only use, the RB has some advantages, closer focusing with bellows, rotating back, maybe waist level finder if the shot requires the camera to be lower than eye level (though the Bronica has a rotating angle finder that accomplishes much of the same thing). For handheld use, there is no question, the Bronica is much easier to use.

The AE finder for the Bronica shows the shutter speed chosen in aperture priority mode or the shutter speed you choose in manual mode. The GS-1 is a electronic camera and requires a battery. The RB is all mechanical. I can't remember if there is a metered finder for it (the RZ is electronic and you can get an AE finder). The RB requires cocking the shutter and winding the back seperately, something I found awkard, but not too different from the view cameras I used for years (the RZ fixes this).

If you get the Bronica, I would recommend you get the 110 macro lens for your standard lens instead of the 100mm. I have both (got the 100 first) and kept running into the minimum focusing distance. The 110 macro is a great lens and has enough close focusing that I don't have this problem anymore. The Bronica lenses have smoother bokeh if you are in to that.

John