Bottled Water for Developing Film

Jaf-Photo · Jun 7, 2014

I have been looking for a more efficient way to use water when developing film.

By chance I came across a consumer test of bottled water. It showed that one of the cheap supermarket brands had a very low mineral content. Only a fraction of that found in tap water and much less than other bottled water.

So, I mixed a batch of XTOL and fixer with it and developed a roll of 35mm T-MAX using the Ilford wash method. It worked brilliantly. The negatives came out very clear with no drying marks, even though I skipped Photo Flo.

Apart from the chemicals, I only used 2 litres of bottled water the whole process, which is the equivalent of runnning the tap for only a few minutes.

So, to me this seems like a good way to preserve water while getting good results.

Does anyone have similar experiences or any words of caution before I start using it all around?

(I should mention that distilled water is only available in pricey 0,5 litre bottles where I live, so I only use it to mix C-41 chems).

pdeeh · Jun 7, 2014

if you are in the UK, the evil Tesco are selling 2.5 litres of deionised water for 90p at the moment

zanxion72 · Jun 7, 2014

Even better than that is boiled water. If your tap water has no serious contaminants that could blow the development, simply boil it to loose as much of its oxygen possible. This way, the developer is less likely to get oxidized by the water's oxygen and perform its on your film.

Xmas · Jun 7, 2014

The Waitrose in Malvern has a spring with low mineral content just outside in Back lane. There are many others rare that any are dry...

Cats and dogs today...

But you only need low mineral in final rinse.

pdeeh · Jun 7, 2014

Xmas said:
There are many others rare that any are dry...
.

this has a delightful rhythm to it, but I can't for the life of me understand what you are trying to express ... are your posts being made with a device that "autocorrects", Xmas, because I quite often can't make head nor tail of parts of them

Jaf-Photo · Jun 7, 2014

pdeeh said:
if you are in the UK, the evil Tesco are selling 2.5 litres of deionised water for 90p at the moment

Cheers, I live in a Tesco-free zone

I can get deionised water at the petrol/gas station, but I was taught to avoid it, right or wrong. Deionised water is active, which distilled water isn't.

A 0.5 litre bottle of distilled water will cost you $3 or £1.50 at the farmacy here...

Jaf-Photo · Jun 7, 2014

zanxion72 said:
Even better than that is boiled water. If your tap water has no serious contaminants that could blow the development, simply boil it to loose as much of its oxygen possible. This way, the developer is less likely to get oxidized by the water's oxygen and perform its on your film.

Thanks. I have looked into it. But it seems that you have to seal the water from air before it starts to cool down. Otherwise , it will reabsorb oxygen.

Apparently, they distill water in a vacuum for some scientific purposes to get rid of the dissolved oxygen. But it can't be exposed to air.

Also, my tap water leaves drying marks on pretty much anything.

Ian Grant · Jun 7, 2014

Xmas said:
The Waitrose in Malvern has a spring with low mineral content just outside in Back lane. There are many others rare that any are dry...

Cats and dogs today...

But you only need low mineral in final rinse.

I used to drive to Malvern to fill up containers with water for brewing

Cheapest and most efficient is to use a water softening filter, I use the jug type although I have an small industrial unit somewhere.

Ian

markbarendt · Jun 7, 2014

Jaf-Photo said:
Thanks. I have looked into it. But it seems that you have to seal the water from air before it starts to cool down. Otherwise , it will reabsorb oxygen.

Apparently, they distill water in a vacuum for some scientific purposes to get rid of the dissolved oxygen. But it can't be exposed to air.

Also, my tap water leaves drying marks on pretty much anything.

A reduced atmospheric pressure can be used to lower the temperature needed to boil liquids.

hoshisato · Jun 7, 2014

I use de-ionized water with great success: 5 liters for €1 at Auchan; it solved all my problems with calcium deposits and I use it without Photo-flo.
You can always boil it if you worry about the oxygen content, but as I get very reproducible results, I never bother.

Jaf-Photo · Jun 7, 2014

Sure, water will boil at room temperature in a vacuum.

But if you want to reduce dissolved gasses like oxygen by boiling water, you have to store it in a vacuum, otherwise it will reabsorb it.

So if you want oxygen reduced water for developing, you'd have to fill an airtight container with boiling water and keep it sealed before use. Not very convenient for mixing chemicals.

Xmas · Jun 7, 2014

pdeeh said:
this has a delightful rhythm to it, but I can't for the life of me understand what you are trying to express ... are your posts being made with a device that "autocorrects", Xmas, because I quite often can't make head nor tail of parts of them

Sorry

There are many other springs, it is rare that any of these springs are dry...

Is less vernacular.

jp498 · Jun 7, 2014

I just use a one-shot developer and don't worry about shelf life and oxygen.

Truzi · Jun 7, 2014

Xmas said:
The Waitrose in Malvern has a spring with low mineral content just outside in Back lane. There are many others rare that any are dry...

I think a comma, semi-colon, or hyphen would have been fine:

Xmas said:
The Waitrose in Malvern has a spring with low mineral content just outside in Back lane. There are many others; rare that any are dry...

Xmas · Jun 7, 2014

jp498 said:
I just use a one-shot developer and don't worry about shelf life and oxygen.

I boil up facet water and mix with cold faucet for 50C and add the chemicals for ID-68 (microphen analogue)and leave to cool, for a stock bottle.

It is so strongly pH buffeted that the calcium carbonate does not seem to make a difference. It keeps ok in a plastic concertina bottle and I discard after 10 35mm per litre.

ROL · Jun 7, 2014

Truzi said:
I think a comma, semi-colon, or hyphen would have been fine:

Vernacular and subtlety are fine, but there seems to be a whole raft of posters these days who apparently feel that punctuation and syntax are beneath them and entirely unnecessary to communication of their golden thoughts. Perhaps this is the inevitable result of thumbscentric texting and tweeting, or disrespect of the written word and those who read them. Unfortunately, I suspect it is in large part, just plain ignorance.

BTW, I use one gallon bottles of distilled water for all film developing. It just isn't worth taking a chance on getting it right when all you have is one chance.

chriscrawfordphoto · Jun 7, 2014

Too bad you aren't in the USA. Distilled water is cheap here. Every grocery store sells gallon jugs of distilled for about a dollar a gallon.

pdeeh · Jun 7, 2014

I don't think US photographers always quite understand how incredibly lucky they are to be able to lay their hands on so much stuff so easily and cheaply - even something as simple as distilled water, let alone photographic chemicals, film, paper and even second-hand cameras & accessories.

Many of these things can be almost unavailable in some countries, and in others (the UK included) can be hard to find, or stupidly expensive, or often both.

NedL · Jun 7, 2014

chriscrawfordphoto said:
Too bad you aren't in the USA. Distilled water is cheap here. Every grocery store sells gallon jugs of distilled for about a dollar a gallon.

I've only purchased distilled water for car batteries or photographic uses. I know people use it in CPAP machines and humidifiers, but what do people use it for?

Truzi · Jun 7, 2014

There are a lot of industrial uses, but since we're talking grocery stores, I'm assuming home use is related to the question.

My father had COPD and used it with an Oxygen Concentrator, and I dated someone who's father did the same due to Emphysema.

With distilled water, you don't get mineral deposits on equipment (not just film) like you would with tap water, which is a large reason.

You can use it in a steam iron for clothing (at least older ones preferred distilled) - both professional and at at home. It can also be used for humidifying tobacco (think humidor for cigars) and classical musical instruments. Most people use tap water for these things, but the "purists" will use distilled for many reasons.

mgb74 · Jun 7, 2014

Not sure how this applies to the rest of the world but, here in US, bottled water takes a few forms. It could truly be spring water from a natural spring with high mineral content. Or it might simply be municipal tap water that's been filtered. You have to read the label carefully.

Also, I'm not positive, but I believe some distilled water is not truly distilled (i.e. water to steam to water), but rather filtered via reverse osmosis.

Jaf-Photo · Jun 7, 2014

chriscrawfordphoto said:
Too bad you aren't in the USA. Distilled water is cheap here. Every grocery store sells gallon jugs of distilled for about a dollar a gallon.

Yeah, it's weird that it's so hard to get by.

Years ago you could buy it in the supermarket for use in irons and such. I guess people don't iron as much anymore.

As I mentioned I buy it in 0,5 l bottles in the pharmacy for mixing C-41. That's 7 x $3 = $21 on top of the cost of the chemicals.

Ridiculous.

wombat2go · Jun 7, 2014

I just got 3.8 litre of distilled water for my next batch of C41
It was $1.29
It takes more than 0.44 kW.Hr of heat to boil 3.8 litre, which is energy cost of less than 10 cents.
I saw some reverse osmosis filtered water alongside at Rite Aid for same price .
I wonder if that is OK to use and is it less energy consuming?

NedL · Jun 7, 2014

The closest "big store" for us is a Target about 5 miles away. They have a huge rack full of distilled water for $0.89 per gallon. Even with the uses Truzi mentioned I have a hard time imagining why they stock so much, there must be a few hundred gallons on the shelves. The bottles have "fresh" dates stamped on them and they stay recent, so they must sell a lot. Not that I'm complaining.

I too wonder about RO water. We have an RO filter under our kitchen sink, and I use that for most photographic purposes. When I started experimenting with calotypes and salt prints, mixing solutions that contain silver nitrate or that I want to store well, it seemed like a good idea to use distilled water. I have no idea if it was necessary.

Another benefit is that if I use distilled water for each step, then the amount of silver nitrate or fixer discharge waste is guaranteed to be less than the volume of water used, so I always have a container for discharges.

Bill Burk · Jun 7, 2014

Xmas said:
The Waitrose in Malvern has a spring with low mineral content just outside in Back lane.

I think I get it...

Used to be a spring I'd get my drinking water from, Pierpoint Springs the post-office stop on my way home to Camp Nelson.

Never dry, but in spring and early summer the water tasted fresh and clear, late summer as it was slowing down, the taste... still clean and refreshing, had a little more 'tooth'... Could have been all in my head.

Across from my house was Soda Spring... It had mineral content year round. Fire Chief, Ben Ray would drive up in the fire truck and stop at the spring. Looked like official business to me so one day I asked him, "Are you taking samples of spring water to a lab to be tested?" "No," Ben said, "I just like the way it tastes."

Bottled Water for Developing Film

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