Border thickness in print

Since I'm currently printing a large amount of fiber prints that will end up framed. I'm starting to wonder what a good border size is? I've seen people cut off the white space when dry mounting, but I've seen people use it with photo corners ... Sometimes it's visible, sometimes not. Are there any recommendations on this topic?

Many thanks

I prefer to give about 2 inches all around the image - I also prefer to use the window matt to cut slightly into the image area.

I do not like trimming the image to the edges with no border then mounting… history has proven that this is a poor way of mounting as over time the edges can come up, chip
and become visible to the viewer.

Bob Carnie said:

I prefer to give about 2 inches all around the image - I also prefer to use the window matt to cut slightly into the image area.

I do not like trimming the image to the edges with no border then mounting… history has proven that this is a poor way of mounting as over time the edges can come up, chip
and become visible to the viewer.

Click to expand...

Thanks Bob. So the window matt is over the print, or over the white area (borders) of the print?
Do you use, precut window matts on standard sizes or cut every matt to the size you need?

I am using the gum tape technique to get my fiber prints flat, so I lose about 5mm around each edge... And I'm wondering how I will be able to frame them properly, without glue or tape or dry mount tissue.

Bob Carnie said:

I prefer to give about 2 inches all around the image - I also prefer to use the window matt to cut slightly into the image area.

I do not like trimming the image to the edges with no border then mounting… history has proven that this is a poor way of mounting as over time the edges can come up, chip
and become visible to the viewer.

Click to expand...

Mine are around 1½" to 1¾" depending on the format. This is roughly what good galleries, curators, agents, etc require so that prints can be handled then mounted and it's well away from the actual image area in case images need remounting.

Ian

Jessestr said:

Thanks Bob. So the window matt is over the print, or over the white area (borders) of the print?
Do you use, precut window matts on standard sizes or cut every matt to the size you need?

I am using the gum tape technique to get my fiber prints flat, so I lose about 5mm around each edge... And I'm wondering how I will be able to frame them properly, without glue or tape or dry mount tissue.

Click to expand...

Yes the window over the print sometimes I will give a little bit of the paper white showing, people like to see it different ways.
I try to use standard Outside Dimension Frames for consistency and the ability to reuse.. for example 20 x24 and 16 x20 are very popular in my gallery.. this allows me to rent frames with art glass
and when the show comes down the photographer keeps the presentation matt in either 20 x24 or 16 x20 portfolio boxes… over time great portfolios are accumulated.

You are cutting the package very close by having image out to 5mm IMHO…. I like a much wider paper, means using larger paper sizes some times but over the years I find it practical.

whether you show some white paper around the print or mat cuts into image is a subjective call. Both look good. One thing that can determine which you choose is how sharp your easel blades cast shadow onto print. Some easels leave fuzzy edges to print area which may not be desireable to have visible in matted print.

Bob Carnie said:

... I do not like trimming the image to the edges with no border then mounting… history has proven that this is a poor way of mounting as over time the edges can come up, chip
and become visible to the viewer.

Click to expand...

I do exactly what Bob recommends not to do... Yes, there are sometimes issues, but I like precise borders on my prints and I like the look of the cut edge as opposed to (often not square or sharp) easel edges. I tack on the dry-mount tissue and then trim both with a rotary trimmer to exactly the dimensions I want, i.e., no white border at all. Prints are dry-mounted to the mat board; the overmat window is cut slightly larger than the image. Signature goes on the bottom right on the same board the print is mounted to and revealed by the window opening.

FWIW, I've found that edges coming up is a sign of bad mounting. I haven't had that happen to one of my prints for many years. The occasional chip can be retouched with standard retouching dyes and a bit of gum Arabic to match paper sheen.

Best,

Doremus

One of the reasons for large borders in archival printing is that degradation from external sources often starts at the edges of the print and work its way inwards. So in that sense, a border can never be large enough. Trimming a print tightly guarantees that when the edges start to go the print is immediately ruined.

mdarnton said:

One of the reasons for large borders in archival printing is that degradation from external sources often starts at the edges of the print and work its way inwards. So in that sense, a border can never be large enough. Trimming a print tightly guarantees that when the edges start to go the print is immediately ruined.

Click to expand...

Any artwork or photo that is worth anything to the owner, be it sentimental or monetary value, should be checked at least every 5 years and have its mat boards changed. The mat and framing isn't just about presentation, it's also about conservation. The backing and front mat baords act as a sponge to soak up any pollutants before they get to the print. If you don't change them they become a reservoir of pollutants right next to the print and once they are reaching load limit they give zero protection.
To that end dry mounting your print onto a piece of mount board means it can never be changed so you better make sure the mount board is extremely well protected by more mountboard behind it. Or don't dry mount so you can change all the boards on a regular basis.
Nobody does it until passed the time when they should have.

It has to be said that these days people don't have open fires in the house nearly as much as they used to and airborne pollutants are much less of a problem unless you live in a city or busy urban area. Its easy to get overly concerned about being "archival". Besides, the biggest factor assuming you've processed and washed your prints properly is the environmental conditions the owner keeps the work in and that is completely out of your control. You can do whatever you like but if the buyer hangs it above a heat source such as a radiator or on an open fire chimney or in a kitchen with wild swings of humidity, then it won't last long.

This topic is pretty interesting to me. I frequently print 9x12" on 11x14" paper or even 10x10" on 11x14" paper so my borders are quite small compared to others here. I do like the look of a print on paper much larger paper (6x6" on 11x14") but hate wasting that paper and also what do you do when you frame that image? You have to have huge mat borders on your framing to not require cutting the print down.

Jessestr said:

Since I'm currently printing a large amount of fiber prints that will end up framed. I'm starting to wonder what a good border size is? I've seen people cut off the white space when dry mounting, but I've seen people use it with photo corners ... Sometimes it's visible, sometimes not. Are there any recommendations on this topic?

Many thanks

Click to expand...

I trim theprint together with the drymount adhesive to taste prior to mounting.This gives me a chance to a final crop and composition change.Then,I leave2-3 inches of whiteborder around theimage when mounting.This gives the image room to breath.

I tend to have prints that will frame nicely in 11x14, 16x20 and 20x24 frames since it is easy to find pre-cut mat boards in those sizes. The size of the print borders will vary depending on the size of the actual image some being square and some rectangular. If dry mounting, I tack the tissue to the print and cut both together with a rotary trimmer. I prefer not to dry mount because if something happens to the board especially in our humid climate it's a problem. I rather use archival corners so a border that accommodates the corners is necessary. To my taste in framing a window cover mat 4 or 8 ply with 3 inch borders on the sides and top and close to 4 inches on the bottom in a museum type wood frame or an aluminum frame -- black, contrast gray or German silver makes a very nice presentation.

http://www.jeffreyglasser.com/

I've been using a 1" border to try and maximise the print size whilst still leaving a decent amount of space around the edge for mounting/framing. Now I'm wondering if I should have left a bit more...

mdarnton said:

So in that sense, a border can never be large enough.

Click to expand...

Keep in mind though Murphy's Law, which in this case goes:

Whatever the size of your borders -- all your stains, ripples, and fingermarks will always be large enough to cover them completely.